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Transport Aircraft

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 315 ✭✭mupper2


    Well if you wanted to be hopelessly optimistic, you could imagine the plan contains so much spending that the new MATS jet will be swamped out of the news cycle....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭sparky42




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,339 ✭✭✭source


    If they were to chose the Falcon 8x and asked for a standard airliner style cabin layout, rather than a bizjet layout, does anyone know what the capacity would be?


    Edit: I know it's not a very wide aircraft so probably would be a 1x1 layout.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭California Dreamer


    Why is the purchase of a secondhand aircraft not allowed?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    For training and maintenance resources when it comes to replacing the helicopter fleet would the air corps be better of with one fleet say like the H145M but buy in sufficient numbers to ensure availability or does having a mixed fleet not make that much of a difference in the bigger picture?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,829 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    They won't do you a 'standard' airliner layout, thats not what business jets are for.

    The upper limit of capacity is 16 passengers, 2 flight crew and 1 steward.

    Thats not just dictated by the desire for luxury, its things like baggage capacity x pax, fuel efficiency, aircraft payload balancing etc.

    The highest capacity of 16 means a configuration of typical bizjet seats and belted couches, with no bedrooms and one small toilet. This is a Falcon 8X interior below.

    DA00017956_S.jpg

    If someone wants a 2x1 airliner arrangement, they should probably buy an airliner.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,829 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Mainly security and manufacturer guarantee and after sales relationship.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    If you look back at the news reports at the time the A105 was heavily tipped as a replacement



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    When ever the Helicopter replacement contract comes around if Bell Textron went for it and one it I wonder could we get a deal like the Czech Air Force did



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,829 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    We are certainly **** at contracts. Right through the public sector.

    The establishment of the Office of Government Procurement, during the austerity era, was supposed to revolutionise procurement effectiveness at all levels. It has failed.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭sparky42




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,829 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    DftE5ZLWAAAVNgC.jpg

    __



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    The replacement of the Irish Air Corps’ helicopter fleet will take place in 2028

    Taken from the journal so for that to happen would a order need to be placed in 2025?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭sparky42


    With our normal procurement timeline, it should have been started years ago, even if it starts now I don't see even IOC in 2028.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 456 ✭✭Grassy Knoll


    You would assume some thought has been given to this already… 2028 is no length away in terms of these exercises. I presume it will be an AW of some variety again ? What is the view in B/don on their relative reliability, serviceability etc ? Also, do we buy more than the half dozen?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,829 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    AW149 will probably be in the mix.

    But if the plan to dedicate some helicopters to special forces use and heavier military taskings follows through, then by 2028 the Airbus H175M super-medium, will be maturing nicely.

    6qlqgqzddk281.jpg




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,342 ✭✭✭EchoIndia


    Could I suggest that future helicopter issues be split off into a separate thread?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭sparky42


    Bold assumption that thought has gone into capital purchases, I mean given our track record…



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,215 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    That is one ugly looking helicopter. I reckon they dont move from AW & graduate to the AW169.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,468 ✭✭✭Heraldoffreeent


    AW169 is smaller than the 139. AW189 is in the super medium category, but thats a civi spec/Coastguard heli I think, not sure if theres a Mil equivelent.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 456 ✭✭Grassy Knoll


    If I were a betting man I’d say we would go for a life-for-like change to the AW 139m version. Engine commonality with the Pilatius PW engines must be an influential factor, particularly given the technical end staff shortages? The AW 149 is I see touted as an alternative to the Blackhawk and is a more robust machine. However, given we go ‘pimped up civilian spec’ and sometimes nothing wrong with that, the 139 is I’d say IMHO where we go.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭tippilot


    The recommendation was Super Medium and that's what we're looking at so it's bye-bye to the AW139 in any version.

    Realistically, we're looking at either AW149 or H175M if we get the military spec version. (Civilian version of AW149 is the AW189).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45 spark23


    All this "Super Medium" talk isn't particularily helpful when whats needed is an actual medium lift aircraft like EC225 type with the capability to move a platoon via two airframes. Alot of marketing terms being used here at one stage the AW139/149 family were classed as intermediate type aircraft. All the types mentioned so far are just a rehash of the AW139 civie helicopter painted green.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    The Chinese are the only ones operating a military version and its slightly different to the H175.

    Like you said In a previous post about the tender for the government jet they kept it basic x amount of people and x amount of distance and see what comes back. Hopefully they do the same here x amount of soldiers and cargo carried and x distance it can go. See what the market comes back. The only problem is if they stick to the technical term of super medium that leaves only 2 aircraft. Maybe there mind is set on the aw189 already



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Are they keeping the term super medium because the DOD/Air Corps have already decided what the replacement helicopters will Be?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,479 ✭✭✭sparky42


    Maybe the fear that Finance and DPER after having collective heart attacks from the sticker price, will kill off any investment? Though in the case of the two extra “139s”, I’m wondering what is the state of the 6?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭tippilot


    Super Medium was the phrase used by the Commission report. It definitely narrows the scope. It's a phrase invented for the offshore industry.

    Rather than a stretched 139 painted green the 149 was designed from the outset as a military spec machine. Unusually and in the opposite manner to the norm it was redesigned as a civilian version, the 189. (We don't want the 189)

    Of the two, H175 or AW149, the 149 is more mature and has sales to Polish, Egyptian and Thai militaries.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,252 ✭✭✭jonnybigwallet


    That 149 looks the biz all right. Had a look at the spec on the company website. Didn't realise how roomy it is. Would have come in dead handy on the recent ARW gig.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,829 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭tippilot


    The EU open tender acquisition process is not required for a state's national security needs. (Normally applied for every government purchase over €140000)

    For defence tenders it can be beneficial to exact a good financial deal, even when a preferred bidder is known in advance.

    If the need is pressing as with the military airlift capability, a state can bypass the tender requirement entirely.

    I still think we'll see a tender here. Even if the 149 is the preferred outcome. The weighted criteria are key to determining the outcome.



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