2023 RWC Buildup, Squads, Fixtures 'etc'

joseywhales · 29-10-2023 02:55AM

Jaysus, hard not to be a choker around here.

ersatz · 29-10-2023 03:36AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296442#Comment_121296442

Clarified with a ref. They aren't rules, they're recommendations and according to him the ref is not allowed to change a call resulting from new info from a replay, that happens via the TMO...but if the ref realizes he processed it wrong he can change the decision. I might have misheard him but I thought he admitted to Ardie that he got it wrong. Seems crazy to proceed with awarding SA a 3 point opportunity in those circumstances.

ersatz · 29-10-2023 03:44AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296503#Comment_121296503

Frizel came in from the side and rolled all his weight onto the leg, if he'd been legal the physics would have prevented that outcome. Surprised the ref and TMO didn't point out that the entry was illegal. Yellow every time.

Klunk_NZ · 29-10-2023 06:35AM

NH powerbrokers forcing rules for ‘safety’ that don’t reflect the reality of 110kg behemoths charging at eachother changing directions and levels within milliseconds. Do any of these rule changes actually reduce head accidental contact to the head? or do they just better protect the organisations from lawsuits?

the game is an example of how not to introduce technology into a sport. Tennis got enhanced by the technology can anyone honestly say the same thing about rugby?

supernova5 · 29-10-2023 07:19AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296451#Comment_121296451

Can you not a

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296451#Comment_121296451

Can you not accept it for what it is without the negative connotations

FintanMcluskey · 29-10-2023 09:01AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121244610#Comment_121244610

😎.

KaneToad · 29-10-2023 09:25AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296954#Comment_121296954

Rugby is only one major head collision away from the sport being non existent. World Rugby are entirely correct to persist with their stance to make these behemoths change their behaviour in collisions. Eventually defensive tackles will be less effective as defenders err on the side of extreme caution. There are still far to many collisions where defender enters at an inappropriate height.

Madeoface · 29-10-2023 09:45AM

'Four more years boys, four more years'.

Enjoy the flight home Reiko you *ickhead. Jeff Wilson too...

ButtersSuki · 29-10-2023 09:48AM

Seeing Foster has criticized the match officials and the red card this morning is disappointing. That was an absolutely clear red. Sounds like very sour grapes.

TheRona · 29-10-2023 09:57AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297162#Comment_121297162

You have to feel for them. Had every chance to win, and blew it.

I have no problem with the red card, even if Cane just decided to be more passive in the tackle, it would have been a yellow.

I don't think Barnes had a bad game. The one big mistake obviously cost NZ 3 points, but other than that I thought he was alright. The TMO intervening to disallow a try which is outside the scope of what they're allowed to do isn't great though, in a time when there's a lot of people who feel that they already get too involved

ButtersSuki · 29-10-2023 10:04AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297177#Comment_121297177

They (like Ireland v NZ) still had their chances, they didn’t take them. Someone has to lose.

The Savea call was in the first half. Who knows what would have happened had it gone the other way? You play differently holding/protecting a lead v chasing one.

Given the favourable refereeing NZ have historically enjoyed (not just the 2011 WCF) I don’t really have much by way of sympathy for them though.

bilston · 29-10-2023 10:11AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296812#Comment_121296812

Yeah, I don't think he apologised, but he clearly saw a replay and realised his mistake because he did say something to Savea along the lines of "I thought there was no clear release" in an almost apologetic manner. But he didn't actually say sorry.

The reality is referees always get one or two things wrong. But I did think SA benefitted more than NZ, but then I wanted NZ to win so probably noticed calls against NZ more.

fitz · 29-10-2023 10:14AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297177#Comment_121297177

I generally agree. I think Barnes was mostly fine, aside from a few things. The Savea penalty, not carding Etzebeth for cynically walking into a pass where NZ had an overlap, and not even warning SA for 3 or 4 penalties close to thier line in the space of a couple of minutes late on. I've said it before, that just rewards cynical teams. It's an area I'd like to see less discretion for refs. Laws should be more prescriptive about escalation to yellow for continued non-technical penalties in the 22 by defending teams.

On the Smith try, they can only go back two phases, but we're there any rucks after the ball came out of the maul? So, same phase and fine to go back for, no?

TheRona · 29-10-2023 10:15AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297209#Comment_121297209

I think SA have been favoured by referees a lot more historically, and in this tournament over the last few matches, so I don't think that argument really holds any water.

TheRona · 29-10-2023 10:17AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297238#Comment_121297238

Yeah, there were 3 rucks after the lineout and before the try, so they went back 4 phases.

Musicrules · 29-10-2023 10:23AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121294646#Comment_121294646

Beating France at their home World Cup was harder than beating us. Did you even watch the games?

Musicrules · 29-10-2023 10:25AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121294679#Comment_121294679

You don't rotate in a World Cup semi final. Nonsense post and it turns out the South African coaches were proved right.

ButtersSuki · 29-10-2023 10:26AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297242#Comment_121297242

Well that’s your opinion - which of course you’re entitled to btw. Mine would be that historically NZ have gotten more than their fair share of referring calls - and by those I mean blatantly bad or biased calls; far more than any other nation incl. SA.

The Savea call was missed and incorrect but it wasn’t blatantly bad. Similarly the penalty in the France game was incorrect rather than blatantly bad or biased.

NZ were for years it seemed incapable of getting even a yellow card no matter what they did on a pitch. The 2011 WC Final wasn’t missed calls, it was blatant homer/biased refereeing.

For what it’s worth, I think Eben (walking into the passing lane) and PSTD (tackling a support runner off the ball) were lucky not to get yellow for their separate offences. But likewise I think NZ could have very little to argue about had they been down to 14 after 2 minutes. Another day and another TMO and that’s a red. That play was far dirtier and cynical than any of the SA card or potential card offences.

Oh and I do think disallowing the NZ try was correct as the knock on was blatant. I also thought the pass for the actual try was forward btw.

i’m not even a big fan of Barnes but I think he was good last night all things considered.

Musicrules · 29-10-2023 10:28AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296407#Comment_121296407

They actually didn't play that well. Ireland made it easier for them. I think the final showed that New Zealand weren't that great. Definitely opportunity blown for Ireland, not sure we'll ever get a better chance of winning the World Cup.

Dave0301 · 29-10-2023 10:29AM

I didn't know about the TMO and the two phases of play. Off the top of my head I feel that this regularly gets if ignored, but I could be wrong.

TheRona · 29-10-2023 10:32AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297276#Comment_121297276

You can't base one game on another. Teams don't perform at the same level every game.

You do realise played most of that match last night with a man down? Despite missing a man in the forwards, they stood up to SA in every facet of forward play, and this is with people saying that their forwards would run straight through them. I'm really proud of how they performed.

Musicrules · 29-10-2023 10:42AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297289#Comment_121297289

South Africa were wrecked after the past 2 weeks. New Zealand were far fresher, they left the game behind them really.

The overall standard in this World Cup was quite poor. South Africa have won a soft World Cup. And they deserved it but they weren't great throughout the tournament. It was the worst New Zealand team ever to enter the World Cup and they nearly won it. That was mostly because it was also the worst England and Australian teams plus very weak Argentinian, Welsh and Scottish teams.

That's why this will go down as one that got away. We blew it. The nerves got the better of us in the quarter final and that will be a major regret for our players for a long time to come.

FrancieBrady · 29-10-2023 10:45AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297316#Comment_121297316

Everyone 'blew it' bar SA.

You need to get over it. And watch more tournaments, you'll find this one was not a whole pile different from others.

ButtersSuki · 29-10-2023 10:46AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297279#Comment_121297279

This is very commonly misunderstood. A phase is not for example a pass (which a lot of people seem to think it is).

A phase is the time a ball is in play between breakdowns. I haven’t rewatched the disallowed try but from memory it was pretty straightforward off the line out (where the knock on happened) so they were correct to bring it back.

Now imagine the furore if the try stood and NZ won the game with the officials missing a rather blatant knock on?

Jacovs · 29-10-2023 10:49AM

I will be honest, I thought NZ did enough at the end to get a scrum penalty. They did to SA what SA do to other teams. Not sure if it was kickable, but couldve set NZ up deeper in the SA half for one last phase.

The lineouts were a complete shambles for both teams. More so SA.

And dear god, like 4 piss poor drop goal attempts? Keep the possession, dont just give the ball away cheaply. I would be pissed off if im a forward, killing myself to get the ball near the opponent 22 and the backs all want a piece of glory by trying drop goals. And not even good attempts either.

As for the red card, i didnt like that it happened, but dont disagree with the call either. Didnt look like it made much difference to NZ.

ButtersSuki · 29-10-2023 10:50AM

I do think where NZ made a bad tactical error was after the SA yellow. They took a 50/50 at best long range penalty when for me a more tactical kick into the 22 and 7 minutes at 14 v 14 would have been a better option. You have the throw in and as long as you secure possession you can play for a much shorter DG or penalty.

Dubinusa · 29-10-2023 10:50AM

South Africa with 4 titles!!! Insane. Congrats to Rassie & staff. 2 for Rassie!! Certainly an all time great.

Going forward though, I feel both the kiwis and saffers will struggle to stay ahead of the French and Ireland.

For the kiwis. There's no more Whitelock, Rettalic and Aaron Smith. I think their run has ended. The bright spot is the new front rows.

South Africa have to find an out half. Replace a relatively elder pack.

France will struggle to find spots for the young bucks. They're falling over talented players, it's ridiculous.

TheRona · 29-10-2023 11:01AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297330#Comment_121297330

It was 4 phases. They weren't correct to bring it back. Sometimes you get the rub of the green, sometimes you don't. Sometimes the TMO decides to make the rules up as they go along. That is life.

BTW I don't think anyone thinks a pass is a phase. Maybe this is something you just discovered?

FrancieBrady · 29-10-2023 11:02AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297345#Comment_121297345

Jeepers, don't tell some around here you won by making a few mistakes and with a share of luck and the bounce of a ball. Their wee heads will implode. 😁

Congrats Jacovs. Enjoy holding the Webb Ellis.

ButtersSuki · 29-10-2023 11:08AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121297380#Comment_121297380

Going to be a smart ass now? Classy.

So you’d have been fine with that try being allowed even with the blatant knock on that everyone it seemed bar they touch judge and the ref saw?

2023 RWC Buildup, Squads, Fixtures 'etc'

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