Rugby world cup post mortem

This is true. No excuse tonight for it not to malfunction after it was a problem against SA. We can imagine that our campaign will be over in QF in 2027 so Ireland can plan back from that.

We have a serious mental block when it comes to world cup quarter finals.

Watching some clips and analysis of the game online and everyone saying that we were badly done by the referee and TMO. Aki was the victim of a high tackle at the very end of the game, Porter was harshly penalised in the scrum, NZ moving across in the lineout, forward pass for their second try. We probably shouldn't go as far as looking for a replay, but feels like we were cheated out of it. IRB doesn't want us in latter stages at the expense of NZ. We're a better side than them. Just bad luck along with poor refereeing

You must have been watching a different match to me. I saw none of the above.

Barnes was spot on.

Someone mentioned squads and ages, whether in this thread or the match thread, so I thought I would look where Ireland stand compared to what most would consider the other stand-out teams at the moment. I am particularly looking at anyone over 32 at the start of this World Cup as in 4 years time you would think a 36 year old will struggle to make a squad, never mind contributing meaningfully. You see a few older than 34 olds still producing at the top level but they are few and far between so that is why I am thinking anyone over 31 at the moment will not be there for the next World Cup. So the average ages are as follows,

Ireland 28.9, South Africa 29.9, New Zealand 27.6 and France 26.8.

Within those squad though you need to look at where the ages are. So for New Zealand you will need to look at replacing the hookers and locks from the squad that played last night (Coles is 36 and Taylor 32 and their locks are Barrett at 29, Retallick at 32 and Whitelock is 35) will need to be replaced. Lock is an area where they have struggled with and having to replace 2 from the squad and hoping a 33 year old Barrett will still be doing it will be a gamble. They do look well set up for the rest of the squad though, Aaron Smith will need to be replaced but Roigard looks promising and then Beauden Barrett is probably playing his last World Cup at 32. Moanga is 29 and McKenzie 28 so you would expect them to be available in 4 years time (at least age wise, not speculating if they will be available on selection criteria for playing in New Zealand).

France just looks set for now and the future. They only have 2 players over 31, Antonio and Taofifenua and only another 6 players at 30 and 31 years old.

South Africa is just old. They will need to replace one of the hookers (Mbonambi is 32), 4 of the 5 props (only Nche is younger than 30), at least 2 of the locks (Etzebeth is 31 but already had 113 tests played so a lot of mileage and Mostert is 32 and only Snyman is under 30 in the squad), at least 3 of the loose forwards (starting 3 today is 31, 32 and 37 years old and the replacements are 30 and 36 - Fourie as cover, only Wise and Van Staden is under 30), De Klerk and Reinach are 31 and 33 respectively as well and Le Roux is 34. Of the 23 for today I think they will need to look at 14-16 replacements based on their age alone. These are players that are 30 or older from the start of the World Cup and Pollard, who is an old 29 and has been playing international rugby since 2014 and has an injury record almost as long as his test wins.

Ireland needs some work on the squad, but its not as bad as South Africa. So the list for players currently 32 or older is Herring, Kilcoyne, O'Mahony, Murray, Sexton, Aki and Earls and you have an average age of 27.4 for the rest of the squad without those players. The problem area I see is that there are a lot players around 30-31 years old. But at the same time you have young players in the same squad already. There are 3 areas of concern I think, loose forwards, scrumhalves and centres. For the loose forwards you only have Doris under 30 in the current squad, for the 9's it is only Casey and in the centres only Ringrose is under 30, and he is an old 28.

The good thing is there will be enough experience going forward and there is enough time to find players to replace those that will need replacing. Maybe the first couple of Six Nations will need to be experimental to find those replacements. It could be better, but it could be so much worse as well.

Not kicking for three points at the start had an actual massive impact on the scoreline for the rest of the game it's pretty much accepted by everyone in Rugby in a tight gae take the points on potential offer. It's exactly what NZ did. The other one in the second half as well was very kickable for him

Now you have some idea of how Mayo feel - and yet they come back every time IN HOPE

There is no such thing as a bad NZ team. They are like Kilkenny hurling teams - you would hear very little about the team so you would not know what stage they were at and they always managed to come in under the radar , just like NZ did this time. Ireland should have made no comment and if they had to then it should be about talking up NZ and talking themselves down -TO THE PUBLIC. It is another matter in their own minds

how likely is it we can get project players of the quality of the ones we have now under the new rules or is that a false understanding? What would that Irish side be without the project players just in terms of physicality. I think this heightens the sense of opportunities lost here.

Time to give O'Gara a chance - I feel sorry for Farrell as some people he trusted in so much didn't deliver when the chips were down but that's ultimately falling on him. Didn't manage game time in a way that the players would had enough juice either to go on.

There is a lot of negative comment about this team / about Irish teams in the future / about individuals - including Farrel. We actually came within a hairs breath of winning / winning position a few times towards the end eg that ball that was not grounded in the maul that got over the line,! The ball that Doris knocked on - he is not a machine, he is only Human after all; the very last play under the posts when Ireland did not release. If any of these pieces of play resulted in a try and we won by a point , instead of losing by four we would be saying that it was the best Irish performance ever, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc,etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc.

I don't think winning that game would have resulted in people saying it was the best performance ever. It would have been default our greatest ever win considering we haven't got past a QF. It is logical to ask why we came up short and tactically that was the case as was Sexton's decision making, the line out and the scrum. That doesn"t denigrate the squad and management in terms of effort and commitment. It's just about learning and embedding that in the next iteration.

Other teams incorporate the learnings of the past and iterate off it, we don't which is why we come up short.

Some of the absolute spoof and drivel on here is incredible. We lost the kicking battle last night so "Taking the 3 points" would have put us in suboptimal field position and put us under the cosh with regards having to win a turnover or the all blacks giving a cheap turnover, both of which we struggled to do last night.

The Farrell should be sacked stuff is such poor analysis, kneejerk reaction. There are some critisms to be had of coaching decisions, such as why didn't we get Healy into the squad over Ryan? Kilcoyne wasn't trusted to hold up a scrum and Healy is well able to come on at 60 minutes and do a job. Tactically I'd say we got it pretty right, New Zealand got loads of easy exits from their 22 and Barnes reffed the scrum like a SA twitter user and we kept it to 4 points.

Finally we really missed what Ryan brings to the table, which is attacking ruck speed by clearing out so well. Our tight 5 was in a battle all night which was 50 50, if Ryan was there it would have swung in our favour IMO. He might not have done the flashy stuff but he does the essentials to a high level.

2015 was probably the time for the kneejerk reactions, last night we went out and actually performed, Kelleher grounds a ball and Farrell is our best ever coach at a world cup, we were structurally good enough.

Absolutely, take nothing away from us not a single Irish player had a bad game. Just NZ went phase after phase & played the clock.

We saw nothing from New Zealand over the past 12-18 month’s to suggest they had that performance in them

Whatever you say, our best ever played their worst performing team of the modern era who played with 14 for 25% of the game and they won in every facet of them game on the night. Taking three points is conventional wisdom for a reason.