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Dummies on big money

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  • 13-07-2023 4:19pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 9,804 ✭✭✭


    The notion of serious dumdums on big money is one that has always baffled and intrigued me.

    How these people got to where they are? How they survive everyday in their jobs? How they haven't been fecked out. How few qualifications and little actual ability a lot of such people have.

    The stream of hardneck dumdum CFOs and CEOs from RTE before the PAC is just the latest example of this.

    It strikes me that the higher you go in any field, that what one needs for most high powered jobs is 80% hardneck/self-delusion/blind money-desire and 20% skills and ethics.

    What blatant examples of this have you seen in your field of work?

    Edit: this probably belongs in AH actually. Feel free to move.



«1

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭the.red.baron


    jobs for the boys

    at a certain level its networking that gets you jobs

    RTE would be worse than most place for it, even the new guy in is really the old guy 😁

    no one questions it



  • Registered Users Posts: 577 ✭✭✭z80CPU
    Darth Randomer


    Smartphone repair in Ireland.

    The official Irish Vodafone / 3 / Eir repair agent is at best mediocre. And specialist agents now for Nokia or Samsung or Motorola - hahahahaha.


    The management of these outfits can afford to pay themselves sumptuously.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,399 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    You still have to have qualifications to be CFO of any company.

    How to do it is to get some qualifications, then specialise in something that's current at the time you want to make your move, compliance for example but could be anything network a lot. Then move around every few years.

    Post edited by mariaalice on


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭ZookeeperDub


    RTE is hardly a good representation of C levels in Ireland.

    These are the people who still think Tubs is a "talent" and want him back ASAP. That alone tells you they are headless chicken



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,758 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Most C Suite level people I have worked with/for are very far from dumdums. Nearly all are very hard working and very fcuking ruthless.

    Many give the appearance of not doing much but they are usually excellent delegators.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 835 ✭✭✭mazdamiatamx5


    I reckon most of these types are not dummies at all but cynically pretend to be to cover their asses. The old see no evil, speak no evil, hear no evil approach.



  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,066 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    Anyone that gets to a board level position even in a medium sized organization is anything but a dummy. If they were they would not have got that far. There are hundreds of organizations all around the world that are run by experienced managers who deliver good results year on year and all you have to stack up against them is a couple of bad apples.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    This wreaks of yet another example of Irish begrudgery.



  • Registered Users Posts: 471 ✭✭Baba Yaga


    any company ive worked in the top brass are fairly sharp,switched on and on top of their jobs...rte i think are the exception


    "They gave me an impossible task,one which they said I wouldnt return from...."

    ps wheres my free,fancy rte flip-flops...?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,177 ✭✭✭twinytwo


    C level are usually very clued in, quick thinkers and as others have said ruthless. You do not get there by accident and if you do,you will not last long. Middle management - now that is an entirely different story....



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,586 ✭✭✭Squatman


    agreed. if they earn more money than you, then theryre not dummies, unless, you the OP are very much a dummy,.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,147 ✭✭✭opinionated3


    I work for a well known multinational in the Midwest. How we are still in operation beggars belief. Our management is just shockingly inept but they truly have a gift for pulling the wool over our owners eyes. Our factory floor, which has a good number of long serving employees, works of the assumption that " it won't be long till our redundancy package will be offered".

    These managers are extremely well paid for what they do. But I wouldn't put them in charge of anything if I had my way.

    So yeah, it's not just the big corporations that reward the "dummies" with big salaries. Its pretty much the way of the world. Brass neck and a gift of the gab will definitely get you a long way in Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,949 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ....we tend to respond well to more narcissistic personalities, we tend to overlook major short comings, potential red flags etc etc, for whatever reasons, many high level, high paid people would posse such traits, then when we eventually question them, they turn on another narcissistic trait, the denial of responsibility, and round and round we go.....

    ...oh and theres plenty of evidence in many professions of such behaviors, particularly those that provide great supply for such individuals....

    ...will it change.....probably not!



  • Registered Users Posts: 64 ✭✭tobesure


    Being able to talk the talk gets you further than being able to walk the walk.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,301 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    They're not really dumdums though, they likely have above average but not exceptional intelligence. They are skilled at politicking, profile raising and manipulation. Life isn't a meritocracy and having reasonable intelligence and a hardneck is a good combination for success. Greed and hubris can trip them up though.

    Look at Oireachtas committee meetings and corporate meetings generally -people are not straight with each other, they ask questions that they already know the answer to to catch out others or bounce them into doing something. How many IQ 145+ people, with autistic traits do well in such an environment? Even in academia where one would think that the most academically gifted would thrive, politics and competition for scare resources (grants/funding) sees to it that this often doesn't happen.

    Out of my class in college, one of the individuals who has done the best out of all of us (would be on well into 6 figures) had mediocre ability and was an arsehole. Was constantly up the lecturers' arses looking for exam hints, still didn't do great in his exams in the end. Still got a job before anyone else. Then he was involved in several controversies which resulted in him "leaving" various jobs - yet this doesn't appear to have impacted his career at all.

    Post edited by BrianD3 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,949 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...a lot of those traits can also be linked to narcissism....



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭the.red.baron


    what are you trying to say and what qualifications do you need



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,804 ✭✭✭take everything


    Just to clarify of course when I say dumdums I generally mean midwits. The exact person the last poster described in his last paragraph.

    Having said that they don't even have to be midwits.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,949 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78




  • Registered Users Posts: 12,399 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    Any accountancy qualification is a good start, the thing about moving around every 2 years or so is if they are not great they are never there long enough to do any harm.

    Any of the really good bosses I worked with who got promoted upwards were really good it's hard to explain, things like being able to read and absorb reports very quickly and find the salient points absorb a huge amount of information, they used language very precisely, they made very few mistakes, very organise, worked quicker than others, calm logical, knew how to delegate,

    One boss overhearing me on a phone call saying...I'm in work said to me you are not in work you are at work, they would not have meant it badly but things like that were very important to them. They have a different brain than the rest of us.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭the.red.baron


    Most have some business background for sure, but what is this point?

    getting a pass in some business degree isn't exactly hard

    look at these guys



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,399 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    Also didn't spoof, didnt make things up, knew the different between being economical with the truth and outright lying. At those hearing they could be questioned for upto 3 hours. Try always staying on messenge and not tripping yourself up and answering questions for 3 hours and see how you get on.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭the.red.baron


    what business is this, because everyone knows absolute stinkers in all businesses, they also know some good ones



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,804 ✭✭✭take everything


    https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Midwit

    Basically, people who are above average intelligence but where the Dunning-Kruger effect is pretty big.

    So, they've gone to university and get to know stuff in their little silo, but when you probe deeper/ask difficult questions, they kinda don't understand things properly or how things are connected globally.

    I often find this goes along with a self-delusion/lack of emotional intelligence. But that lack of emotional intelligence/self-awareness can often be quite self-serving/protective especially if you can get a lot of not so bright people thinking you're amazing.

    And this basically happens everywhere.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,837 ✭✭✭EchoIndia


    Not making excuses for anyone in RTE, but put anyone in the pressurised surroundings of an Oireachtas committee, with questions being fired at them on a very messy set of issues and limited opportunities to give proper replies, and they will rarely come well out of it. The great majority of people in the country are not in jobs where their performance is publicly scrutinised in front of politicians, the media and the public. It's worth asking yourself "how would I do in that situation?" The honest answer is probably "not as well as I might like to think".

    Post edited by EchoIndia on


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,699 ✭✭✭StupidLikeAFox


    It's hilarious when people say "they only got there through networking and politicking" as if that isn't a core skill for operating at this level.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,399 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    Not all need to be like that but it's rare to get on without networking and politicking, another skill I admire is the ability to be friendly with everyone but friends with no one ( in a work situation ) but do it in a way that's not obvious that is the skill.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭Swaine


    It's who you know not what you know.

    Paul Reid a great example of this. A spoofer.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,399 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    So who did he know then? I am fairly sure that aren't handing out MBAs to idiots, plus if all it takes is spoofing why aren't more doing it?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,949 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...this is more or less narcissism.....

    ...and yes, its common within institutions that have been left largely unchecked for long periods of time, a similar problem is currently occurring within the hse, we need to move this whole process of scrutiny into there next!



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