Random EV thoughts.....

DaveyDave · 28-09-2022 12:01PM

I'm not aware of any ducting in place for on street parking in my estate in SDCC. They did dig up the path to install a public charger in the visitor spaces on my road. I recently found out we have to pay standing charges/PSO levy for the public chargers when they go live. SDCC required 10% of spaces in the area to have public chargers yet the homeowners of the estate are paying for them, we already pay to rent the equipment in our management fee even though they haven't been turned on for the 2 years they've been installed...

AndyBoBandy · 29-09-2022 04:58PM

Looks like Coyne's Cross is the next Applegreen in line for proper infrastructure...

Don't eCars units usually get delivered not in boxes, so this is a good sign...

TitianGerm · 29-09-2022 05:14PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119681262#Comment_119681262

Between there and Gorey I'll never need to worry about a charge between Dublin and Wexford return trips.

zg3409 · 29-09-2022 08:35PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119674984#Comment_119674984

I know one about 2 years finished. All houses are council. Roads are council. No driveways, no marked spaces, no chargers, possibly ducting. The layout means often you cannot park near your house meaning carrying shopping long distances and no easy ability to keep an eye on your car from the house. I know similar older estates like this, say 15 years old, and petty crime on cars is high, and no hope they are getting chargers soon. While there is a management company in theory, in practice nothing gets done while shared bins areas are regularly set on fire.

Gumbo · 29-09-2022 08:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119682102#Comment_119682102

Wow, sounds like a right kip, and i say that living in Finglas!

I have a house built in Dublin in 2006, no front garden but all the parking spots are numbered and assigned to the house. Easy to install a charger but no ducting as it was pre regs for this.

I don't live in that house anymore so never explored charging options.

My current house, typical 3 bed semi built in 1996, Council haven't taken in charge yet. Both houses within 5 minutes of each other!

It is a problem going forward i suppose but at least it's been captured in new estates going forward.

This is for Buildings other than Dwellings :

"(e) A building which has more than 10 car parking spaces, that is: (i) new, or (ii) subject to subparagraph (g), undergoing major renovation, shall have installed at least one recharging point and ducting infrastructure (consisting of conduits for electric cables) for at least one in every 5 car parking spaces to enable the subsequent installation of recharging points for electric vehicles."

For Apartments :

"1.4.6.1 For a new building (containing one, or more than one, dwelling), where there are more than 10 car parking spaces, ducting infrastructure, consisting of conduits for electric cables, should be provided for every parking space, to enable the subsequent installation of recharging points for electric vehicles where:

 the car park is located inside the building, e.g. a basement car park; or

 the car park is physically adjacent to the building, i.e. the car park is within the curtilage of the site."

Strangely TGD Part L is quiet on Ducting for single dwellings. I'll keep digging.

innrain · 29-09-2022 09:01PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119682123#Comment_119682123

I think it is for those building with planning permission applied after a certain date in 2021(?) There are some exceptions which probably builders pay hard money to take advantage of.

There is a video from the housing agency and the SEAI regarding the grants for apartments if someone is interested. They say there the new builds after March 2021 have to have the charging infrastructure provisioned hence don't qualify for grants. For those living in apartments might be interesting to see how they intend to run the grants.

https://youtu.be/KAJHXH0mEj4

Gumbo · 29-09-2022 09:34PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119682214#Comment_119682214

Builders can’t pay to exclude any Building Regulations thankfully so they will have to apply them in their entirety.

It’s something I’m keeping an eye on through work and many builders are doing it thankfully already.

cannco253 · 03-10-2022 12:16PM

https://www.thesun.ie/money/9500399/electric-cars-diesel-costs-service-station/

like the headline, same old story…

Didn’t know about this

”we can reveal that EV charging prices will not be displayed on site until 2023…

Ionity’s 71 cent high powered rate will go to 73 cent on November 1st.”

creedp · 03-10-2022 01:33PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119695384#Comment_119695384

Not sure why anyone should be surprised. Can't depend on private providers to provide a good value service. Same as EV maufacturers, their primary focus is to maximise profits at expense of consumer.

Just supports the position that unless you have your own driveway, forget about EVs if your sole motivation is to save money. Course many EV owners won't care as they have more lofty motivations such as improving air quality for future generations, bringing despotic oil producers to their knees etc. I jest..

the_amazing_raisin · 03-10-2022 08:16PM

http://www.rte.ie/news/business/2022/1003/1326774-aa-survey-on-electric-vehicles/

Bit of a more balanced article, although I'm slightly annoyed they only used EI rates given there's better options out there

I've never gotten the idea behind people not shopping around for electricity when they own an EV

I mean it takes like 20 mins to change provider and I've known people to drive 20 mins out of their way every week to save 2c on a liter of petrol

the_amazing_raisin · 03-10-2022 08:22PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119695644#Comment_119695644

You CAN save money even if you're living off public charging, albeit not as much as home charging.

I think the obfuscation of what price you're paying is causing a lot of people to get trapped. Having to display the basic price is a good start but there's still plenty of scope for third party providers to put a surcharge on top

People need to do their research when signing up for paid plans. It's still buyer beware with a lot of these schemes

DaveyDave · 03-10-2022 09:43PM

Re: public charging, I think anything under 70c/kWh is the cost saving point for me coming from a petrol Golf. Plus savings on servicing and tax. Although more expensive tyres will eat into some of that cost. You'd be a bit mad to get an EV and only use public charging though.

liamog · 04-10-2022 01:08AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119697697#Comment_119697697

If you are stuck in a situation where you are forced to regularly charge in public, the subscription services become very economical. I moved to an apartment in April. I'm paying €4.80 a month and can charge at eCars AC for 26c/kWh or DC for 31c/kWh. It's much better rates than I'd get by paying the walk up fee to eCars. If there was an Ionity location near me I could pay an extra €12.50 a month and charge at Ionity for 26c/kWh. That's all through my Mini charging provider.

I'd totally pay the Ionity fee if it was nearby, as having more available chargers would be worth the €12.50.

the_amazing_raisin · 04-10-2022 09:52AM

I think the question of whether you can live with public charging or not is very dependent on where you live and how you drive.

Up until recently anyone living near a Lidl could charge for free on AC, and if you only need to charge once or twice a week then it was pretty easy to find a day you could plug in and walk back home then collect your car a few hours later

Same goes for workplaces that provide free charging. I know of one business in Dublin which has ~16 AC charging spaces and is looking at installing many more than that in the next 12 months. Currently the charging is free for employees but I imagine they'll start charging something to prevent abuse of the chargers

Not even the cheapest home charging rate could beat free charging

And as Liam said, if you're regularly using public charging then the subscription plans can offer pretty good value. I imagine for example that Applegreen will have a subscription plan, and anyone living near Ballymount in the near future is likely to have plenty of chargers available for a 30 mins top up one or twice a week

04-10-2022 07:36PM

My random EV thought is....why didn't I put my name down for a Hyundai Iconic 5 18 months ago - so regretting it, considering how prices have spiralled- the repayments would have been high but the depreciation oh so low relatively speaking compared to "normal" times of new cars.

Anyway, that boat has sailed. I'll be buying a second hand diesel to keep for about 5 years in early 2023 - of course cue massive increases in motor tax for such vehicles but considering my relatively low milage, it's probably the better choice from a financial perspective. But so regretting not just going for the Ionic 5 at the time- hope anyone here who has one is enjoying it.

MojoMaker · 04-10-2022 08:19PM

You mean the Ioniq 5 that went up just 2k over those 18 months?

the_amazing_raisin · 04-10-2022 08:34PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119701442#Comment_119701442

If you're doing low mileage then couldn't you buy a second hand Ioniq28 and then rent a petrol car the odd time you're travelling long distance?

Seems the best option financially, you get the benefit of low cost EV driving, get a car with low depreciation and you don't have to pay the cost of diesel all year round

Or go for a PHEV, if your daily driving is within the electric range and you can charge every night then it's basically as cheap as an EV to run

I mean, there's more options out there than high spec EV or car with a tractor engine shoved in the front

Redfox25 · 04-10-2022 09:39PM

If we are going random regrets, regret is that I didnt take a punt on a M3 in Jan this year and put a deposit down before the price increases

:)

zg3409 · 04-10-2022 09:55PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119701442#Comment_119701442

I did the sums on EV 4 years ago and every month I thought about it was costing me around 250 euros in fuel costs. I was doing 110km a day plus toll road twice a day.

I hung on to an ICE for longer trips and I rarely needed it and it's sold now.

Depreciation is real cost of ownership along with fuel for ice and maintenance and servicing.

For 2 car households with decent daily commute it makes good financial sense. Buying new may make more financial sense with used prices so high.

04-10-2022 10:32PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119702151#Comment_119702151

You speak total sense- and if I were commuting 500KM a week to work (without taking any other travel into consideration) as I was over 2 years ago, I would have- but with lockdown and now WFH, milage is an awful lot less per week overall, not just commuting.

Crunching the numbers has been on my mind 24/7 over the last number of months TBH- looking at what my average milage is, looking at ICE cars, secondhand that I'd consider buying Vs New EV's that Id consider buying. ICE still seems to work out cheaper overall, taking a 5 year view of depreciation, servicing and running costs - EV's still have a a big premium and a long lead in period with uncertainty over final price charged. I see people driving around in 2022 ICE vehicles and thinking, whilst EV are great, we've a long way to go before my secondhand diesel will be worth nothing.

I'll keep an open mind over coming weeks and months- supply has obviously affected EV pricing and up to 1 year delay on a new EV is just not for me as I need to change in next 6 months max I'd say.

Anyway just thinking out loud - don't want to derail this thread in anyway as it's "random" but hope it helps others thinking the same way i am. Maybe I should just bite the EV bullet but the ones i want are just too expensive right now I think compared to ICE.

04-10-2022 10:33PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119701622#Comment_119701622

Went up a lot more than that.

04-10-2022 10:48PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119701676#Comment_119701676

Yeah- it might be ultimately my route into EV- secondhand ICE cars are over-inflated prices right now- same with secondhand EVs though- so was thinking going new EV but as I said earlier, the boat has sailed on that for a few years until prices and choice stabilise- probably best thing i can do now is finally decide what money I want to throw at "transport" on an annual basis and then decide what my options are.

MojoMaker · 04-10-2022 10:58PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119702315#Comment_119702315

From 37,995 at launch to 39,995 now.

Or was it cheaper at launch?

cannco253 · 05-10-2022 01:08AM

https://evhacs.com/

The World's First Heat Pump/Air Conditioning Unit And Electric Vehicle Charger in one

graememk · 05-10-2022 01:18AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119702718#Comment_119702718

A solution looking for a problem.

Possibly only suited for new builds... Then you would have plenty of capacity(electrically) for a evse and a heatpump...

A 10kw heatpump only really has a 3kwish electrical load. So no swapping out the heatpump and magically getting 7kw evse.

To get the grant now it has to have load balancing anyway afaik.

zg3409 · 05-10-2022 07:01AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119702314#Comment_119702314

Some EVs are in stock to drive away today. Particularly Teslas but you may be limited to certain colours or models. Others cars availability can vary by dealer so some dealers may have stock. I agree it does not make sense to buy a new EV if you have done the sums and it costs more than ICE overall. There are still.big downsides to EV ownership such as queues at peak times at public chargers and the risk of forgetting to charge at home and having to charge for 30+ minutes at public charging on the way to work which has happened to me more than once.

the_amazing_raisin · 05-10-2022 08:23AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119702718#Comment_119702718

I'd say the main issue there is that the heat pump tends to be shoved around the back of the house, away from where you'd put a charger. Bit of a niche market to begin with

cannco253 · 05-10-2022 09:49AM

https://www.aviva.com/newsroom/news-releases/2022/09/aviva-launches-standalone-cover-for-electric-vehicle-charging-points/

“The insurer is now offering Erection All Risks (EAR) and Operational All Risks (OAR) cover for EV chargers on a standalone basis. The product is aimed at customers including contractors, car park operators, local authorities, asset managers and forecourt operators, with cover applicable for everything from a single charger to an entire network.”

I’ll leave it at that…

zg3409 · 05-10-2022 09:56AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119703270#Comment_119703270

This is like special EV car insurance. There is no real difference in ICE Vs EV car insurance, same with parking meter installer versus EV charger installer insurance. Sure the risks might be different but it's just a public liability insurance product, same as most contractors insurance that has a cost based on the risks of a claim.

It might make it a bit easier to get a quote and easier to settle a claim as most scenarios are already listed but nothing special.

Mattie500 · 05-10-2022 10:42AM

Very happy with an ioniq electric with charging at home and at work. We use it a lot more than than the ICE that we thought would still be the main family car. We installed a Zappi home charger and will look at installing Solar in the near future.

One thing we had to negotiate was the “service cost” being asked for by the garage…. €250 for inspection, replace pollen filter, and replace brake fluid. OEM pollen filter @75, brake fluid @75 and 100 for the inspection (to get the book stamped). Obviously I pushed back on all of this but this is an example of what may be going on.

Random EV thoughts.....

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