Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

But again, your argument is built on the assumption the players missing have equal significance to their Provinces. They don't. Prendergast and Blade are way more important to Connacht than Frawley and McCarthy are to Leinster. And they're playing each other in Round 4; the tour spans Rounds 3 and 4, so the fixtures directly impacted are:

Ulster: Leinster (h), Ospreys (h)

Munster: Zebre (h), Connacht (a)

Leinster: Ulster (a), Sharks (h)

Connacht: Munster (h), Leinster (h).

And we know momentum counts. Connacht have a pretty horrible opening run of fixtures, and this adds another element to contend with.

...and as for your last sentence in brackets, thats basically complaining that youre not getting an unfair advantage.

Nope; it's acknowledging that if an unfair advantage exists by the vagaries of the format (which it does) I'd want my Province to be looking to make the most of it. Whatever way you frame it, ultimately an advantage Connacht otherwise would have had is now reduced.

(I've refrained from mentioning Munster here, as I largely think, given the fixtures, they don't come off too badly).

Ironically, this tour will probably make it less likely that Frawley see's game time at 10 for Leinster this season. Since Leo and Lancaster know they'll be losing him for 3 games soon, I imagine they'll be much more likely to go with Ross Byrne at the start of the season to minimise disruption.

If the Ireland coaches really do see Frawley as the natural successor at 10, they should have done to Leinster what they did to Ulster 4 years ago when they didn't let them extend Pienaar's contract so they could install Cooney at 9, and not allowed Ross Byrne's contract be extended last season.

If they could do that to Ulster, why couldn't they do it to Leinster? Well, I think people can figure that one out themselves. The IRFU have no problem screwing the other provinces over for their benefit, but they don't want to upset the apple cart at Leinster.

Doak who is very clearly second choice at Ulster?

Baloucoune is the most significant player for Ulster to be involved in this. One player, if that is what you regard as significant disruption. Then we can agree to disagree.

Connacht are arguably most affected in terms of players lost. Prendergast being the most significant loss. Blade not so much so if Marmion is fit but still a key player for them. Would either be the winning or losing of a game. I really don’t think so.

No one has ever said there won’t be disruption to squads. There will but ultimately I can’t see how people think this will be the winning or losing of any game.

I doubt one single player named in that squad will be bemoaning then fact they got picked and would prefer to be at home playing for their province.

As Paul pointed out earlier. With a jam packed season, there is no perfect time for this. It works for the Irish setup and ultimately the provinces serve that purpose.

Doak who is very clearly second choice at Ulster?

Yes, Doak who is clearly 2nd choice at Ulster is a more significant loss than, 3rd/4th choice lock McCarthy is to Leinster. Again, that's exactly the point.

Baloucoune is the most significant player for Ulster to be involved in this. One player, if that is what you regard as significant disruption. Then we can agree to disagree.

To be fair, I never said significant disruption since the squad was announced. All I'm saying is I can understand why, say, Ulster or Connacht fans may feel a little aggrieved.

Connacht are arguably most affected in terms of players lost. Prendergast being the most significant loss. Blade not so much so if Marmion is fit but still a key player for them. Would either be the winning or losing of a game. I really don’t think so.

Connacht were involved in 7 1-score games in the URC last season. Ulster were involved in 9. It'll be impossible to ever know, but it could be the winning and losing of a game, in what is likely to be a very tight table again this season.

But I think at this point you're right that we can just leave it there and agree to disagree.

@TRC10 People are getting silly now, comparing non IQ pienar to RB’s contract extension, please. This will have no impact on Frawleys time at ten for Leinster, in fact it will give him 2 or 3 decent games at ten on tour, and more’s the point that if coaches are picking RB at ten, Frawley will be in the mix for the bench. At the level of most URC games his performance in NZ alone would guarantee that. Their options aren’t great given that HB barely played, did he crack two hundred minutes last season? Come on, Leinster coaches aren’t stupid.

2 players who saw a grand total of 4 minutes in that final between them.

Leinster really used their bench very very poorly in that final.

O'Gara and La Rochelle really taught the Leinster management a lesson with his superior use of the bench.

If after this Tour Frawley comes back having nailed down the 3rd choice Irish outhalf Jersey. Then the tour is nearly justified for that one reason alone.. similarly if Doak shows he can manage the game plan at 9 or joe Mccarthy or max Deegan show they can be pack leader.

There are many positives Ireland can gain from this tour.

Its not perfect by any means but covid hampered the last 2 years and this sort of a tour would have been held then under normal circumstances.

I’d imagine it isn’t any one thing. It would be different things for different players. But getting them familiar with the systems, getting them to work on specific things (most likely in the cases of Frawley and Balacoune) and then seeing how they apply those things in a match day situation would be, at a high level, what they are after. How that worked for them in the Māori games seems to be cited as the driver.

awec, you normally post with great insight but you have gone on a jihad about this tour! Of course there is a cost given that the tour happens during weeks with league matches but the IRFU calculate that the upside is greater than the downside. They think IT's WORTH IT. And if we get a couple of players who make the team better come the World Cup then it is worth it. Remember, from the IRFU's perspective EVERYTHING is designed to make the Irish team better. That's the mission.

If you take a long-term view I can see two positives for the a province:

• losing players means that others further down the pecking order are more likely to get exposure in the URC, which will increase the strength-in-depth in the long run. This could be useful towards the end of the season if there are injuries. So often it's because others are absent (usually through injury) that someone gets a shot. Would Kendellen have had such a big season last season and be as far along in his development as he is if Hodnett had been available?
• Having more international players is a good way to have a competitive edge over the other provinces. Exposure to Test rugby can make players better, as in the case of Gibson-Park. Featuring in this touring squad has to increase a player's chance of picking up Test caps down the line. As a Leinster fan I'd like to have seen more Leinster players selected.