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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Darth Putin


    see the parallel “a global recession/winter is coming thread” where everyone banned from this thread seems to reside

    they are creaming themselves at every negative economic news story awaiting the collapse of the decadent west

    imho if NATO was everything that the far left/right paint it as, we wouldn’t be talking about price of oil/gas now and there be troops on ground guarding oilfields right across there Middle East shooting anyone approaching within a mile, and aircraft carriers protecting ships. instead nato left iraq, Libya etc and not getting too involved in Syria outisde of periodic pruning of isis halfwits

    anyways




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande




    image.png

    You have to look at the claim that in the context of centuries of invasion of Russian territory. There are no natural barriers to prevent a land based power invading from Western European plain (Sweden, Germany - you know how & France - Napoleon) or from the south like the Ottomon empire, the Golden Horde, the Mongols. These invasions tend to go rather badly for Russian people. That is why the military want to control the choke points and post World War II they thought they had achieved that with the buffer states of Eastern Europe in front of them. They are paranoid about that, from their perspective they have to control the space around their borders, because of that they see other states as a security threat, and because of that inherent insecurity, the states bordering then see Russia as a security threat.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    Instead of being terrified of the West, they should look at their former vassal states in Eastern Europe and be demanding that their leaders join the EU!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    I just heard a great summary of the Russian predicament in Kherson: "swim or surrender".



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭20silkcut


    Just behave like a civilised normal country and no one is going to threaten them at all. If they had not started this war their stock would be much higher as they would still be perceived as in the top three of world military powers.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Darth Putin


    Nuclear weapons make your point moot

    and that’s before considering the much longer border with China or Kazakhstan



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,043 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Russia just needs to worry about her own borders. Havin a buffer is horseshit of the highest order. Invading Ukraine and taking it over doesn't give it a buffer, just moves the border on across further west, actually closer to "the west".



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Which is what the people in Belarus and Ukraine want to do, they are not blind to the improvements in Poland and the Baltic states.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,876 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    You have to look at the claim that in the context of centuries of invasion of Russian territory

    No you don't.

    Russia does not have some unique historical experience of invasion, nor do they have a uniquely porous border in terms of natural barriers. We do not have to give any credit to the natural paranoia of a dictatorial oligarchy.

    Ukraine is also not "de facto" part of Nato given that the single most important part of NATO membership is Article 5 protection.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,129 ✭✭✭coolbeans


    It's the exact same mentality that drives those PBP clowns. Hatred of the US/EU and the West is their raison d'être.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,636 ✭✭✭rogber


    Yeah I don't like being sadistic but I would have quite happily seen those fleeing soldiers, and especially their leaders and commanders, the f*ckers who are now senselessly firing rockets at Kharkov for maximum destruction, surrounded and slaughtered or at least rounded up and given long jail sentences in Ukraine.

    There are hundreds or thousands of war criminals who will now slip back into Russia and pay no price for their crimes - or even worse, regroup and come back. Still, it's not the most important issue right now



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,029 ✭✭✭Sunny Disposition


    To an extent the war was lost for Russia when they had to withdraw from Kyiv. It's gotten a lot worse for them this week obviously.

    But it's crazy how people here still spout their bs. One poster saying the west can't keep this up for two years, but the Russians can. Westerners are making a limited economic sacrifice that has been very widely accepted by its population. On the other side the Russians have likely had 100,000 people killed or injured in just over six months, they've endured sanctions from many of the world's wealthiest countries and they actually have less territory acquired now than they did in April. Even though its an autocracy there is still criticism of its leader emerging.

    The West is certainly in a far better position to deal with a protracted conflict than Russia is.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    A border with the West is much narrower and less costly to defend and keeps the enemy away from the heartland. Supporting the heartland i.e Moscow - St. Petersburg, is also a problem across the Russian federation since all the wealth from the territories get sucked up by Moscow, leaving the republics starved of wealth to create employment. Within the Russian federation this has given rise to mass migration from different ethnic groups from the poor areas towards the heartland, which itself is a source of conflict as Russian racialists fear being outnumbered. There are racist groups within the heartland, like everywhere, for them expanding to Ukraine is more appealing.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Darth Putin


    The “west can’t keep this up” meme is plain wishful thinking

    350b of Russian money was seized at start, so far actual delivered aid in 6 months has only materialised at maybe 50b

    In contrast 2.26 trillion was spent on Afghanistan over 20 years, probably same again for Iraq

    Thats before get to lend lease which starts in couple of weeks and ensures employment in US (and hence bipartisan support) and that Ukraine doesn’t have to repay until sometime next century as per experience of previous lend lease (uk only paid it off few years back, ww2 long finished)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,596 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Lol

    Screenshot_20220912-165735_Chrome~2.jpg


    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,876 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Yeah I don't like being sadistic

    Then maybe don't be sadistic? The bloodlust here over the last few days is a bit disturbing.

    "surrounded and slaughtered" and "given long jail sentences" are two pretty different things. I hope everyone that should be is brought to justice. I hope Ukraine continues to abide by the Geneva Conventions (as much as any army can/does). Thankfully the leadership in Ukraine, who have more right to be angry than we do, appear to view this the same way.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,209 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    No, I do not have to take the persecution delusions of a paranoid schizophrenic as justification for their murderous and barbaric behaviour. Have you ever known a paranoid schizophrenic? I have - their partner justifiably saw them as a threat to themselves and their child and gave them the boot. They didn't think it necessary to have any sympathy for their viewpoint.

    Stalin engineered the deaths of 7-10 million Ukrainians in order to stamp out Ukrainian nationalism and as punishment for them wanting to eat some of what they had grown instead of allowing every last ear of grain to be sent to feed Russians in Russia because communism didn't work. Putin is just Stalin Mk II in his attitude, actions and motivations regarding Ukraine. Trying to justify your lie by an implication that Russia’s viewpoint is innately superior to everyone else's is sick-making.

    Stalin's actions had nothing to do with centuries past invasion routes and neither does Putin's. It's still about Russia wanting all of what Ukraine has; being mostly it's grain. The fuc​kers are even stealing their children, washing machines, ships full of grain, agricultural equipment, Irish owned aircraft, and all you can see is the bullshit official Russian propagandic justifications. This is about a grab for resources, like the invasion of Iraq, not because NATO have been planning and scheming for a Russian invasion since it's formation, likely to happen any century now. The Mongols were easily the worst invaders the Russians have known, I don't see them pulling this nonsense in the far east because they are afraid of an imminent repeat.

    The world does not have to kow-tow to the views of a cleptocracy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    World War II was brutal on the populations of Belarus, much of Ukraine and Russia, then part of the Soviet Union. All over you will find monuments to the people who died in that conflict. May 9th is a major public holiday that marks this catastrophe, the narrative is engrained in the population. If you want to secure your empire, you need to secure the borders and the Russian thinking is to control the choke points and that has been their goal for centuries. If you are a country that borders them, their tendency is to expand to geographical choke points to protect themselves.

    NATO has decided that it is better to fight Russia at arms length, all members are acting collectively to defend Ukraine from Russia by supplying weapons, training and intelligence as well as financial support. That about sums up the purpose of Article 5.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,051 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Maybe now, due Putins mis -adventurers Russia as we know it will be under a threat to its very existence , but it will come from within. But even before the invasion of Ukraine, who would be even thinking about invading it? After all, it was supposed to be the 2nd strongest military in the world and with the BOMB, no less!!! Nato, the west etc, were all painted a s being a threat ( wrongly ) but Putin needed a reason to justify his illegal invasion plans. And so we have the big bad NATO and the evil EU. Putin has unleashed a whirlwind that will strengthen the EU and NATO beyond what he could ever have imagined in his wildest dreams, ( or worst nightmares ) but will go a long way to destroying Russia's ability wage war on its Neighbour's for generations.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,876 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    That about sums up the purpose of Article 5.

    Overwhelming force sums up the purpose of Article 5

    I don't see how WW2 being brutal on the population of Ukraine somehow makes a twisted justification of a brutal oppression of the population of Ukraine. I don't really care about some justification of the genesis of their worldview - it is paranoid delusion. Over the last 100 years Russia has been the invading force, not the threatened one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    I do agree with you fully. I am not saying their viewpoint is correct, I am pointing out they have a different perspective with its own logic and fallacies.

    image.png


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭Apiarist


    Yes, while the country is a dictatorship for now, it's borders are open and until recently it was not difficult for a Belarusian citizen to get a Shengen visa. People in Belarus travel to neighbouring countries very often for work or shopping. The nearest IKEA to Minsk is in Vilnius, which is only 170km away and it's very normal to drive there to buy some furniture. I would estimate that 10% of Belarusian citizens work abroad, mostly in Poland, Russia and Germany. Everyone in Belarus has relatives or friends abroad. So Belarusians know full well how other countries are doing.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,514 ✭✭✭zv2


    This looks like the car is utterly destroyed but then looks like only the petrol tank exploded. Only one escapes.


    Post edited by zv2 on

    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Posts: 7,946 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No, I never said NATO is not involved. They are helping Ukraine against barbarians, but they themselves are not fighting Russia.

    Russia is bigging up NATO’s involvement so the shîtshow Ru military are running in Ukraine doesn’t look so bad. You must be used to communicating with people that have had soviet propaganda shoved down their throat for years. You’re wasting away your fingers and keyboard for no reason when trying that with us.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 273 ✭✭Perseverance The Second


    Not a good day for the Russian Airforce

    Three new airframes to the Loss list. Confirmed a new SU-30, The SU-34 in Crimea and the crash of that SU-25 on social media today.




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,209 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    OT: It was during Tony Blair's regime that the last cent was paid. That they had to pay back even a penny is galling and ridiculous. The US got from the UK, for free: RADAR, cavity magnetron (basis of all microwave ovens), the electronic computer, the jet engine, etc, etc.

    The US didn't consider the UK ally enough to share atomic bomb tech, until the UK demonstrated a hydrogen bomb that made the US one look like a damp squib, then all of a sudden they were more than happy to have the UK as a nuclear secrets ally - 'by the way, what was that tweak you used to to increase the yield, not that we really need it or care, but just out of vague, casual curiosity?'



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,762 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    The potential for use of nuclear weapons has to be factored into any conflict with a nuclear power like Russia, it shapes how the conflict is cirrently being fought.

    The Russians control Kazakhstan in much the same manner as they do Belarus. There are geographical barriers that limit Chinas movement (Mongolian steppe, desert, mountains and Amur river). For the time being, Russia has a solid alliance with China (who need them for resources), China has being building their belt and road through the old territories of the Soviet Union and diplomatically extending it's influence. In the face of the United States both are "frenemies" and China is some distance from the heartland.

    image.png


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 775 ✭✭✭Heraclius


    I saw lots of claims of negotiations for a surrender in the area west of the dnipro near Kherson. Is it likely to be people getting their hopes up or a psychological tactic against the Russians or is it likely to be something real?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,596 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    I think it started out as psychological but has since become something real.

    Ukrainians are playing a very clever game with social media, twitter, etc. Far better than anything the Russians have done.

    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



This discussion has been closed.
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