Public Pay Talks - see mod warning post 4293

You'd be surprised. If skills are hard to find the rates go up not down.

Anyway, been thinking more about this "deal".

The cost of living increases have left my family worse off. The deal doesn't adequately address this. Not nearly.

Prices of petrol, gas, electricity may fall (But may not) but it's not just the price of these commodities leaping ahead, it's everything, and these general price increases are just not going to be reversed ever. Best we can possibly hope for is a period of stability - but when? Not any time soon and in the next year or two there could be plenty more pain to come.

The idea that future deals would somehow make up for this erosion of living standards (i.e. be above the then-current inflation rate) is laughably naive. Not going to happen.

So this is a permanent cut in living standards. But it gets worse.

With pensions linked to pay, this cuts my pension too.

I'll be poorer until the day I die because of this deal.

And this comes after being locked into ridiculous 1% and 1.5% pa increases leading up to this.

It's a sick joke.

That essentially the same for everyone.

The odd person will receive a pay rise completey covering the rise (very odd). The odd person will get no rise.

We're in the middle because we bargain as a public service. Some of us are excellent. Some of us are shite. Therefore we're getting a somewhere in the middle package.

If we could bargain individually some of us would get the full pay rise but some of us would get nothing.

Lets be clear the majority of the private sector are not getting pay rises. In fact a very high % will not be in jobs come this time next year.

Will you stop making up sh*t and presenting opinions as fact with absolutely no evidence to back up.

I have not received anything from SIPTU via email myself but they only issued their press release on it yesterday. They are recommending it is accepted with balloting starting next Monday.

All the Unions seems to be recommending it is accepted so I will vote to accept the deal.

https://www.siptu.ie/media/pressreleases2022/mainnews/fullstory_23121_en.html

This doesn't really address anything I posted.

When the economy is doing less well, we get pay freezes or cuts, more work due to hiring freezes, etc.

When the economy is doing well (and it's actually doing very well at the moment, despite inflation) the ground lost in less good times is never made up.

Effect over my nearly 30 years is a gradual but definite erosion of living standards and ever-increasing difficulty in recruiting and retaining talented staff.

Unions promise jam tomorrow (i.e. this deal is crap but it's the best we can do, hope for better next time) which never arrives.

The civil service is being hollowed out and it appears that successive governments are perfectly fine with this - for all the shyte talk about "investing in people" and other PMDS-style nonsense.

I am pointing out the hypocrisy on here . People are moaning saying the public sector never catch up blah blah blah. When they are already 20 to 27% ahead of the private sector. I don't know should they be the same, some on here want to be compared when looking at Tesco getting 10% payrises but don't factor in their employer not being in 240Billion of debt and then some dont want to be compared when the fact is that over 1.2 million private sector employees are getting zero payrises this year. Its the selective nature of the comparison that I have issue with.

Will you look at this thread it is awash with public sector people comparing selectively when it suits their pay rise narrative and then ignoring comparisons when it doesn't.

I am simply pointing out when people compare that it is very disingenuous to be very selective either we are comparing and then everything needs to be taken in or don't compare, so when for example your brethren come on here saying "well tesco got a 10 % pay rise so I want the same too". I am simply point out that this comparison does not take the whole of the private sector into account, nor the fact that Tesco workers get zero pensions from their employer and their employer is not 240 Billion in debt.

The comparison from the CSO shows average wage in both sectors and the public sector is 20 - 27% ahead. If you have issue with these states I suggest you take it up with the CSO.

So you think with an upcoming recession and a tsunami of price increases on energy, food and interest rates and you think companies are being greedy because they are not paying pay rises? REALLY? As I say your lot have your head stuck in the sand. Some companies are getting pay rises (they generally tend to be companies not overblown with debt and turning a profit, what are we 3rd most indebted country per capita in thweworld with a debt of 240 Billion, yet your employers think its a good call go give pay rises under those circumstances?) but the majority in the private sector are not as there is a sh1tstorm coming and a lot of companies cannot afford and will not be able to afford the increases in energy, food and interest rates and give more to employees in pay riese and then expect to make a profit. It just does not work like that in the private sector, they dont have an ECB money printing press out the back to turn on. The CSO do a weekly wage comparison on both sectors so your hypothetical sh1te and bringing up average ages in Africa vs Europe is just that absolute sh1te. Its there in black and white weekly wage for private and public (In Ireland not Europe or Africa) no amount of spinning that your trying with that post can be done to misrepresent those numbers. The figure from the CSOs weekly wage has it at about 20%, ISME have it at 22% https://www.isme.ie/public-sector-pay-demands-represent-self-interest-not-national-interest/ and how much will you lot be getting is it 4/5% this year which is why the variation I have put up is between 20% and 27% . I hope this clarifies it for you.

I am railing as there is an avalanche of indicators showing where we as a country will be in 12 months time and I have explained why they should not be getting a pay rise very coherently. The fact that they are already paid a premium with job security and a guaranteed pension is already a significant buffer over the majority of the private sector. We also have to find the money to pay the pay rises meaning I will be paying more or seeing a cut in some other service or the bill will be passed onto my kids or grand kids. I hope that clarifies coherently my position. So when the recession comes it will once again be the private sector decimated and you lot cushioned like before.