Covid vaccines - thread banned users in First Post

"The vaccine programme in Ireland has progressed rapidly over the past few months with the majority of the population having received at least one dose of a vaccine by the end of June."

"The arrival of the Delta variant in Ireland which was confirmed in June and the potential increase in infections due to the higher transmissibility of this strain. While there is still some debate as to whether the Delta variant has a similar fatality rate as previous variants, it is reasonable to expect more cases in general might contribute to an increase in deaths."

Speculation which turned out to be false. As I've said we know the deaths from COVID. They don't account for the rise in deaths from June 2021 onwards.

Unless you want to admit now that the vaccine rollout was a complete failure. How would you get a rise in deaths AFTER a vaccine rollout if was 100% effective?

How could the outcome get worse AFTER vaccination than before?

The deaths are still rising into 2022. What is causing the excess mortality?

"The age adjusted figures taking into account population demographic changes dont show excesses for the rest of 2021."

You can manipulate the data anyway you want. It is literally straight in front of you. A clear signal above 6 previous years!

Yes, I think that's the current official figure since March 2020. Although I would dispute it since "within 28 days of a + test" is in no way an accurate or appropriate way to count.

Most occurred in 2020, almost 5000. We had less COVID deaths in 2021. Entirely predictable as the virus mutates to be more infectious and less deadly.

He's very close to getting an ignore from me if he keeps up this ridiculous claptrap. He's just trolling at this stage.

I'm hearing reports that Pfizer have pulled out of Uruguay rather than submit the requested documents. To be confirmed.

in fairness, they've picked apart numerous points which have either been left unanswered, or just descended into name calling... your post is case and point, where you've assumed a collective opinion of a poster, as if you are the chairperson, it's kind of ironic...

they were actually correct, the vaccine was very effective preventing symptomatic COVID for the original and Alpha variants...

unfortunately mutations happen, and the vaccine isn't as effective in preventing symptomatic cases, much like getting the bird flu vaccine, then complaining it doesn't work when you catch swine flu.

Your biology knowledge is embarrassing.

Except now we know from the Pfizer document dump they were next to useless from the beginning. Nice try though.

with the original and alpha variant pretty much eradicated from last year, definitely didn't work.

Couple of queries, that you probably won't answer

1) I thought we weren't supposed to trust Reuters links, as according to you earlier in the thread

I'm curious as to why they would report negatively on a company they are in bed with?

Do we just dis-believe the positive stories, but believe the negative ones?

2) With this thought stream going of countries and companies looking after their own self interest, do you think this didn't have a factor in allowing any multinational company into one of the biggest generic medicine manufacturing countries in the world? Much like trying to get into the Russian and Chinese markets (although Pfizer seems to be the vaccine of choice in locations where Sinovac and Sputnikvax have failed).

With all the calls of "safety concerns" against Pfizer, who at the time had over 6 months of phase 4 data, and by Sep 2021 when they got shot down again by India, had billions of people vaccinated, it's funny how they recently approved their own mRNA vaccine with a combined phase2/3 trial of 4,000 people....

MRNA vaccine: Panel recommends emergency use nod to India's 1st mRNA vaccine - The Economic Times (indiatimes.com)

follow the money as you say... you're just doing it wrong.

for ref:

Delta was milder as was every subsequent variant since the original that is how viruses go.

Most of the susceptible died in 2020. We didn't suddenly import a load of grannies in June 2021.

I repeat again. There were less COVID deaths in 2021 than 2020. What you are seeing is not COVID deaths. Demographics is irrelevant.

It is clear from the graphic that all cause mortality is steady for 6 years until a sudden rise in June 2021. Apart from the peak in spring 2020. That was the pandemic it came and went. Numbers since then are background noise

The data is from the CSO. Any other source would be ridiculed here. You have to accept official sources or its pointless continuing. You can't pick and choose.

That's not how viruses go, there is no consciousness to a virus where is says "ahh, we're at a happy equilibrium, I get warm fuzzy hosts, and nobody dies"... it will mutate into other variants which may or may not be more dangerous... please stop undermining over 100's years of virology studies with stupid comments like that.