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Rim brake road bikes becoming rare

24

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,420 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    Donedeal and adverts are the only game in town second hand really. Market is quiet enough at the minute, I'd say most people have sorted themselves out and are happy to hang on to whatever they have at the minute and just ride it for the summer.

    But there are still some crackin bikes there if you're lucky with sizing.

    New is a tougher nut cos stock in everything is low and they're aren't any bargains. I did notice that Canyon cfsl ultegra. That's a bloody great deal and a magnificent bike by any standards.

    What size are you anyway?



  • Posts: 903 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I'd love disc brakes. Commuting in a lot of damp weather and 105 rim brakes are unpleasant. My pleasure cycling is mostly short jaunts around the dublin foothills and i can feel the limitation of the rim brakes very quickly and they are not at all confidence inspiring.


    In neither situation is the limit tyre grip. I'd take confident, reliable braking over a slight weight gain any day of the week - going faster is nice, being safer is nicer.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    105 calipers are excellent. Stick a decent brake block in there - Swisstop Green or Yellow Flash - and it's all you need for any descent in this country.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 725 ✭✭✭Keep_Her_Lit


    Thanks for your reply. Most manufacturers would advise a 56-58cm or Medium sized frame for my dimensions (88.5cm inside leg, 179cm height). So probably one of the more popular sizes and hence quickest to sell in these times. Age is really slowing me down now, so I need something lighter to help maintain the denial for a bit longer! Ta for your advice, it's appreciated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    179cm / 88.5cm is some funky offset!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,603 ✭✭✭Large bottle small glass


    If one's goal is old school simplicity, the bike has been a solved riddle for a very long time; two triangles welded together with attention to detail in terms of sealing of bearings, quality bearing, wheel design and build etc etc were all possible and available long before the advent of

    • disc brakes
    • electronic shifting
    • internal cable routing
    • press fit bottom brackets
    • innovative cockpits
    • tubeless etc etc

    All of the above add complexity and often reduce reliability and off course the cost to the end user (in terms of purchase price and maintenance) but are required for the continuation of the bike industry.

    As far as I'm concerned they could have stopped at 7800/Sram red 10 speed, but of course it'll never stop. Pretty soon the bike industry will be convincing users they need something else.

    I'd rather if I could buy a replacement 7800 derailleur, 7900 freehub or whatever but that wouldn't be good for Shimano's share price...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,420 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    I've 2 full sram red tenners on the go and I'm going to keep them alive and kicking for as long as I possibly can. Only a few short years ago over 7kg was heavy. Reading a review of the new Colnago C68, best bike in the world, all the best components, 15 grand or thereabouts.. and its 7.2 kg or something

    We've 3 bikes in the low sixes and anything over 7 is a winter bike! Manufacturers and reviewers can say what they like about aero and comfort and explain away the extra pork however they like but you can't hide it out on the road. It makes a massive difference.

    I know this started out as a disc V rim but really for me it comes down to weight and cost. If disc braked bikes were lighter I'd be top of the queue, but the industry conspiring to tell me lightness doesn't matter a sh1te anymore, and bigger wider heavier tires on heavier bikes were actually quicker - pissin on my boots and telling me it's raining etc, and charging for all those extra grams at pick'n mix sweet shop rates! :).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 533 ✭✭✭Mr. Cats


    There’s a lovely looking Canyon Aeroroad on Adverts at the mo. Rim, mechanical dura ace should suit all the luddites 😂

    Whole lot of bike for the money in fairness




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,787 ✭✭✭cletus


    Just over 7kg? For 3 grand? Pure madness 🤣😄🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 880 ✭✭✭byrnem31


    That's some yoke. Have to get my deposit back off the shop first before i start looking. I was out on my 2015 canyon today though after turning the handlebars towards me so the grips are nearer to me. I also got a new saddle and its even more comfortable now. Im in two minds now about getting anything at all.



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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 55,566 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    just weighed my merckx - 6800 mechanical rim brakes, with zondas on it. 7.9kg.

    Post edited by magicbastarder on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,420 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    That canyon is nice but it's not a bargain. That was a cheap bike new - with 105 and the Reynolds wheels it was a bargain at 2600 sterling. So as a used bike albeit with DA on it it's pricey enough imo.

    The current brand new aeroad sl with ultegra disk is available now and is 3900. But it's (imo) unacceptably heavy at 8.2kg for that money.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 533 ✭✭✭Mr. Cats


    I think it can probably be bought for c2.5k (price reduced now to 2850). Looks like value to me compared to 3900 for new with Ultegra (albeit disc). Probably this spec if available today would be c. 4.5k new?

    A lot will depend on condition and mileage on frame and components. If it’s fairly fresh (big if), then I think you could do a lot worse for 2.5k.

    But, as ever, it’s only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,604 ✭✭✭DaveyDave


    I have rim brakes on my carbon bike and discs on my commuter ebike. If I was buying a new road bike I'd be happy with rim brakes. With SwissStop pads I can't fault the braking power, although I think my cables need to be replaced as the lever feeling is a bit vague. The only issue I have with rim brakes is commuting, particularly in the Winter the rims would get absolutely filthy and I'd be cleaning them every 2 days.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 55,566 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    With commuting on discs, I found that the rear pads got contaminated quickly enough. To be fair, I was going past Dublin port on grubby enough roads.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,174 ✭✭✭Alanbt


    ill be clinging onto rim brakes for the foreseeable.

    couple of disc brake bike a few years ago and just found them more of a pain than rim brakes. Likely due to first time on hydraulics, but often had issues with noise etc. Rim brakes just so simple to maintain.

    Have picked up a few groupsets to see me through for a while yet.

    But another reason is aesthetics. I just find most modern disc brake bikes ugly. And for me a not insignificant part of the appeal of bikes is how they look. Rim brake bikes just look nicer imo



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,278 ✭✭✭xxyyzz


    Sorry but disc brakes do not "add complexity and often reduce reliability". MTBers have been using them for years and years, not to mention motorbikes and cars. They are extremely easy to maintain and in terms of performance I'd take them any day over rim brakes. If you don't like them, that's fine but some of the unfounded garbage that has been posted about them in the last few years by roadies is frankly embarrassing. The whole safety thing about razor sharp discs was comical when discs are completely blunt and the same cyclists were blissfully riding with bladed aero spokes etc.

    Ask any mountainbiker would they go back to rim brakes and they'd laugh at you. Shimano disc brakes are absolutely bombproof in terms of reliability and performance. Rim brakes do a job adequately and there's nobody being forced to change but the disc brake hysteria of the last few years is ridiculous.


    Disc brakes have more stopping power, better modulation and work as good in the wet as in the dry.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    ...and are largely unnecessary on the road.

    So we're all aligned I think?



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,279 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    I don't really understand why people get cross or sound offended if someone thinks disc brakes are unnecessary.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,603 ✭✭✭Large bottle small glass


    I've been using disc brakes on my mountain bikes for over a decade and I'm well aware of their performance and advantages.

    Bleeding brakes, fitting hydraulic hoses is significantly harder than tensioning a brake cable, so yes it is more complex and difficult for an average ROAD cyclist.

    What some SNIP posted about getting cut by a disc is relevant to my post how.

    I don't know why I would ask a MTB rider, this thread is very specific to road cyclist and the increase in weight and cost from an unnecessary technology for most road riders.

    People btw are being "forced" by planned obsolescence by the bike industry, such that rim braked bike market is very much reduced.

    Most road cyclist would benefit from improving their braking technique rather than switching technology; that improved skillset will stand to them irrespective of the braking mechanism.

    My current gravel bike has discs but other than not having to clean rims I managed to never lose control on my old cx Ridley canti bike on really lumpy off road rides; circa 1000m climbing in a 40km spin with lots of 15-20% gradients. Having to re rim after 3k km was a pain but at €30 a rim cheaper than changing bikes and all the waste that goes with that.

    With just road riding I've gotten 40k km from my hplus sons so the rim wear argument doesn't hold much water with me. Lots of that 40k would have been clocked up spins in wet weather in the 200km to 450km range; i.e. I wasn't anal about rim cleanliness.

    If a road cyclist needs disc brakes to stop because of their undeniable advantages he should probably go back to cycling school 🙂



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,131 ✭✭✭Peterx


    "If a road cyclist needs disc brakes to stop because of their undeniable advantages he should probably go back to cycling school 🙂"

    That's me :)

    The winter before lockdown (fado fado) was extremely wet, i had poor braking commuting (on XTR V-Brakes perfectly fitted) all the time as the rims were always wet and frequently filthy. I picked up a Boardman with hydraulic discs and am a much happier commuter.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,278 ✭✭✭xxyyzz


    Sorry, I'm not getting angry that someone thinks they are unnecessary, I get frustrated when I see some of the nonsense arguments posted against them. There was a big uproar over a movistar rider who claimed he got a gash in his leg from a rotor, it turned out the disc didn't go near his leg. Also a team sky rider Owain Douall who claimed Marcel Kittel's rotor put a gash in his shoe which turned out to be more horsesh*t, he hit a barrier at 60kmh and didn't even realise he had cut his shoe until he crossed the finish line but he was still certain it was Kittel's fault. The hysteria from that formed a major part of the backlash against disc brakes but now they all use them and don't give it a second thought.


    I have no issue with someone deciding that rim brakes are adequate for them and I do sympathise that the bike industry enforces planned obsolescence (believe me, it's a million times worse in MTB) but some of the strawman arguments that they add complexity, are more dangerous, don't offer any performance benefits are nonsense. It's just a fear of the unknown. I would say that if you can't follow a youtube video explaining how to bleed a brake then bike maintenance isn't for you. It's a very simple process and changing pads is far easier than changing pads on a rim brake.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,506 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    Backlash? That sounds like hysteria alright.

    They add weight & cost, spoil the visual lines, and are mostly unnecessary for pure road use. That's all we're saying!

    Go for your life in mountain biking - they make sense there.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,438 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    I have Shimano 105 rim brakes with SwissStop pads - they're still sketchy in the wet. My next road bike will have discs.

    Put your money where yer mouth is... Subscribe and Save Boards!

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,150 ✭✭✭Paddigol


    Yeah, brake blokes are key. I notice a much bigger performance difference as between crap blocks v. swisstop yellow than as between rim and disc.

    From experience, the average leisure cyclist's descending skills are pretty poor too. Braking and line choice etc. But 'disc brakes' is sold as a ready-made solution.

    I'm happy to have them on my CX and MTB bikes, but love the simplicity, reliability, and aesthetics of rim on road.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,278 ✭✭✭xxyyzz


    Quote from the rider - he likened them to “giant machetes,” adding, “I’ve been lucky: I didn’t get my leg chopped off, it’s just some muscle and skin. But can you imagine that disc cutting a jugular or a femoral vein? I would prefer not to.” - hysteria.


    The funny thing was it was his left leg got cut and he claimed he rubbed his leg on his opponent's rotor while they were riding which was odd given that the rotor is on the left hand side of the bike so this couldn't possibly have happened unless he unclipped and slung his leg over his opponents back wheel.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,116 ✭✭✭bazermc


    My bike has rim breaks. Does that mean I’m officially old school now?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 880 ✭✭✭byrnem31


    You are going to have an accident as they are obsolete and wont work any more.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 975 ✭✭✭oinkely


    Jaysus, I'm rightly feiced so - rim brakes, alu frame, 9 speed durace. A triple whammy of obsolescence!

    Have no experience of discs on road bikes - but have never found any real issue with rim brakes on road. One very wet morning going to work on a rim brake mtb with xtr v brakes i did have a little trouble heading down through bray town. Pulled over and added a few turns to the cable barrel adjuster and was grand again. To be fair i did look briefly at changing for a disc brake bike but figured the spend wasn't worth it, and most likely the divorce from an extra bike would be far more traumatic so moderated my riding on really wet days to take into account the vagaries of rim brakes.



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  • Posts: 903 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I've bought a set of SwissStop Flashpro BXP (neither green nor yellow flash are still made, yellow king seems to primarily be for carbon).

    If they end up being significantly better than what they have on them, I'll send you a thank you PM!



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