BoJo banished - Liz Truss down. Is Rishi next for the toaster? **threadbans in OP**

Clearly the mental gymnastics are your own with your flight of fancy examples, ignoring the completely obvious point breezy was making that Boris going to Ukraine and strongly showing his support is one of the simplest and most effective things he could do to play in to his attempts to wash away the Partygate issue given his repeated claims that because of the war in Ukraine, now is not the right time to talk about stepping down or facing consequences for his own actions.

It's absolutely transparent what Boris' plan was by going to the Ukraine. Whether the Ukrainians praise him for it or name streets after him is irrelevant. He's using the war in Ukraine to say there's more important things happening than the British Prime Minister breaking the law and therefore he needs to stay.

Whole the Ukrainian war is obviously more important, there's no reason Boris needs to remain as PM because of it.

I disagree. Europe was very quick to set up systems to accommodate Ukrainian refugees. If the UK followed suit but did it slower than the EU, then it would have been embarrassing when you consider how they like to think they're much more legislatively nimble and quick than the lumbering EU with all its red tape.

So once the EU made their decision, the UK couldn't follow. They had to take a different approach. Brexit means controlling the borders for loads of people. They don't seem to be being ironic when they say "our compassion is unlimited but our resources aren't" they genuinely think they're the most generous in the world already.

Very much agree. It's a wierd situation where him going down to Kyiv is a bit of a morale boost for the Ukrainians (which I like), but at the very same time he's clearly trying to cloak himself with the conflict in an attempt to deflect how feckless he really is.

It also feels like his trips to Ukraine are almost like some of those people who "Hike the Andes for Charity". On the surface it might look like it's "for a good cause", but really they're just going on a mountaineering holiday which they believe they can use for moral clout later.

@Rawr

It is virtue-signalling of the highest order, especially with Pitri Patel announcing what seemed like next day that refugees were going to be sent to Rwanda.

Ah, there are so many councils and so little interest and ability to poll them, that I wouldn't bother to guess. I predict the tories will lose seats. That's about as far as I'd go.

I saw one prediction that they'd lose 800 seats but that seems wild. Other predictions seem to cluster around losing 500 seats being a bad result. So if I were to make a prediction it would probably be around 400 seats lost on aggregate. But that's just based on how the media tends to exaggerate.

Not long to wait now. One of my mates in England was taking tomorrow off to stay up all night to watch the results come in.

That election there was a lot of extra overall votes gained in already Labour areas.

There is a huge shift happening in English demographics which means some previous Tory areas are open like in some west London councils or suburban councils. Only a few will change overall control but I think it will point to a trend ad to where future votes are going.

I think Labour can forget the red wall. The brain drain there will turn it into another West Country in the towns and rural councils but will lead to gains in urban and suburban areas. It will also open up the Home Counties in a big way.

Of course it makes sense. Once the EU acted quickly, the UK couldn't do the same thing more slowly. What was the point of leaving the EU if they do the same thing but less quickly? One of the strongest arguments for brexit was being more nimble and less open.

They needed to be either quicker or less open than the EU.

Sure. But that's not how the UK sees it. They've told their people thst the EU is the lumbering ogre, tripping over its own red tape.

There are great videos of James O Brien, where pro-Brexit callers talk about how leaving the EU will mean they can get rid of all the EU mandated laws. Then he asks them to name some laws and they can't name a single law. They just know the EU imposes terrible laws and they're slow and undemocratic.

Following the EU couldn't happen with refugees. They needed to either be faster or less open. They could have been equally open if they did it faster than the EU, but once the EU acted faster, they didn't realistically have the choice to follow their lead.

They don't say they did nothing.

Just a snapshot of the counting but so far it's not looking as bad as predicted for the Tories. Its not good but not as bad as predicted mostly because Labour failed to scoop up their lost votes. Tories lost 6 councils. 3 went to Labour, one to lib dem and 2 to no overall control.

Labour not doing as well as they hoped and Lib Dems and greens are the piggest proportionate winners. Lib dems up over 20% and greens over 100%.

I understand a lot of councils only start counting at 9am so more results through the day.

Ah the "not as bad" party line begins in earnest.

It's well known the Tories themselves were pushing the high numbers so they can throw out the "not as bad" nonsense. They are being eviserated .

It's also well known that most of the councils in this election were Labour councils anyway so the overall changes would be marginal.

Yeah I am repeating myself. And so are you. We've stated our positions then.

Yeah fair enough. It really shows thslat the Tories are the only part that can form a government on their own. Whennrheynlose voters, they don't go Labour. Between thst and Labour losing almost all 50ish seats in Scotland, they're likely to need the SNP, Lib Dems or both to form a government. And that's if they can stop the Tories getting an outright majority.

The English are just predisposed to tolerate toffs being in charge and being corrupt. They wouldn't put up with it from Labour as they see them as being more like themselves. "Born to rule, arzeholes" sounds like a pejorative but it's actually the Tories best weapon.

The "could lose 800 seats" thing was also a blatant attempt to frame 400 as being some valiant performance.

Its Essex. The newly wealthy population there were convinced en masse by Thatcher era politics that ladder-pulling is a good thing.