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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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Comments

  • Posts: 7,946 [Deleted User]


    Those videos are very informative. You can clearly see, even on state media, the Kremlin cannot maintain the narrative. The camera always pans to someone embarrassed by whoever is ranting. Even the ranter gives it away by saying, 'I didn't want to talk about the warship'... because it's a national embarrassment. Even on air they laughed at the in-joke about the special military operation. It's subtext like this that will get picked up by the people.

    TL/DR Even in state controlled media it's very hard to keep to the script.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,874 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Closing off entry to the Black Sea is it? That’s the excuse the Turks came up with. Lol



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,416 ✭✭✭sjb25


    They are very good the one on britain is an eye opener tell you that



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,073 ✭✭✭JoChervil




  • Posts: 7,946 [Deleted User]


    Yes, but only my joke.

    Although, not sure humour translates so well here - hence a certain post/thanks a few posts above.

    And before anyone says there's no room for humour in a war situation I'd refer them to the Ukrainian videos extracting the utter piss out of Russia. It's good to poke fun at the circus bear.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,219 ✭✭✭wassie


    hair.jpg

    1995 called and said it wants its hairdo back...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,416 ✭✭✭sjb25




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,140 ✭✭✭Gregor Samsa


    1995 is way in the future for quite a number of Russians.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,789 ✭✭✭greenpilot


    Absolutely. I was shocked. Just 16 well targeted cruise missles, conventional, not nuclear, would render the UK Military useless and would cause widespread social, civilian and logistical damage that would take years to rebuild.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,327 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    "This means war!!" and in the same breath "What's the special military operation then?". "Our flagship sank because of an internal fire" and in the same breath "Ukraine must suffer because they sank her!".

    They're really wrapping themselves in knots, knots of their own making. That's what you get when you treat anything approaching truth as propaganda and mix in a fear of not following the Official Line, which wanders all over the place. You end up with a language that makes no sense.

    Confusion like that is not good when you have the real threat of escalation and mouthpieces talking about WW3. Now I'm still at the stage of thinking that's all they are, simplistic mouthpieces shouting slogans for the hard of thinking on "their side", not too far removed from those shouting "orcs" and "slava Ukraine!" on our side when many of them would have been hard pressed to point to Ukraine on a map this Christmas. The hope is those at the top are not thinking like the mob, though they do have to be aware of them.

    So far, it doesn't look like they are thinking like them. The mob were screaming for NATO no fly zone over Ukraine, those at the top didn't listen to them and for very good reasons. I suspect the same will be in play in Russia. Putin might go rogue, but I doubt his commanders will. We live in hope.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,327 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    The Turks give few fúcks and have given the finger to putin before and don't automatically follow the US either.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,815 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Militarily, what would be the impact if it was providing an air defence umbrella?

    Does it mean it's more risky for Russian aircraft/drones in the area?

    Or will Ukraine be able to fly in the area? What area are we likely talking about? Kherson and surrounds or as far east as Mariupol? Would the Russians have land-based coverage on their side once you get to the Donbas region?

    Will Russia now have to concede the airspace to the West of Crimea? There isn't a direct replacement for Moskva



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,306 ✭✭✭✭Drumpot


    Is there any real hope that Putin fails? And when I say fails, he doesn’t get whatever victory he can spin in May, he doesn’t use more damaging weapons and he is retired?

    Has he already failed? I see russia threaten Sweden and Finland again, but if they join NATO , whatever gains they got in Ukraine will be somewhat countered by other losses.

    At this stage, regardless of what Putin spins, surely his allies outside of Russia must be less then impressed. He looks more like a damaging useful idiot with nukes for disrupting the west , then an actual proper super power ally. Makes me think of the “in war, the pawns go first” analogy.

    In some ways, is the Ukraine war only part of the plan. I think of the rise of “strongmen” and far right leaders in western countries, which may end up doing more damage to divide western countries. Hopefully Putins war has actually done damage to this moronic idealistic sentiment.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,477 ✭✭✭zv2


    Wibbs: "This means war!!" and in the same breath "What's the special military operation then?". "Our flagship sank because of an internal fire" and in the same breath "Ukraine must suffer because they sank her!".

    I keep getting the impression that because the Russian government has got used to treating its citizens like children they take it for granted they can do the same with the west. They seem to forget we have George Orwell.

    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,306 ✭✭✭✭Drumpot




  • Posts: 2,986 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    If US and other Western Countries confirm that the weapons they supplied sunk that ship then they should give Ukraine as many more of these missles as they want as ships are mobile. Now that it is resting at the bottom of the Sea it can't cause mischief elsewhere later.

    Ukraine is the best Artillery firing test ground in the world at the moment.

    Warfare with high tech hardware is really proving itself and Western leaders aren't having to deal with corpses of soldiers being shipped home.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,416 ✭✭✭sjb25


    Yeah everybody who says ireland will be fine the raf or royal navy will help us should watch it



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Found this interesting video, a detailed look at the ambush at Brovary (where the tank commander was killed and the column shelled). It's in german but the closed captions are accurate





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,477 ✭✭✭zv2


    Apparently 45,000 Orcs are dead or injured at this point. Troop losses will have a big effect on how this war goes.

    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,984 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Turkey have closed the Black Sea to warships (of any nation) not already there since the start of the war...

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/jillgoldenziel/2022/03/02/how-turkeys-blocking-russia-from-the-black-sea-harms-neutral-states/?sh=33b54b4faa6d

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,845 ✭✭✭threeball


    They haven't been dealing with corpes being shipped home because the Ukrainians are doing all the fighting. Bit twisted logic to think the weapons are the reason.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,984 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    They don't confirm it I'd imagine to keep the Russians guessing.

    Ukraine claims they hit it with a home produced Neptune missile strikes in combination with a diversionary drone attack.

    The UK was already planning to send Harpoon anti ship missile to Ukraine.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,074 ✭✭✭thomil


    There are several aspects to this. A Slava class cruiser carries 64 S-300 Surface to Air missiles, which is a highly effective and long range air defense system, combined with the necessary air search and fire control radars to ensure those missiles hit their target. These radars are likely going to be more powerful than those used with the mobile S-300 batteries that both Russia and Ukraine field, simply because the generators on a ship of that size have a much higher output. The radar will have a blind spot when it comes to low flying targets at around 50-100 km out from the ship, due to the pesky fact that the Earth is a sphere, but for high altitude targets, it can easily reach out to 300 kilometers away. The ship also has shorter range missiles and gun systems, but those are mostly for self defense, so I'll ignore them here.

    That's the direct weapons fit on the ship itself. However, the Slava class were designed as flag ships from the ground up. Originally, they were designed to lead task groups of frigates and destroyers in the North Atlantic and coordinate strikes with the then new Kiev class aircraft carriers and the soon to be built Project 1143.5, which ultimately became the Kuznetov class of aircraft carriers. This means that the ships have extensive command and control facilities, the Russian data link system that allows other ships and aircraft to directly feed data into a Slava's combat systems and vice versa and a suite of communications and electronic warfare system.

    That means that ships like Moskva can not only engage air targets themselves, but can also direct fighter aircraft onto hostile targets, coordinate its air defense effort with other warships and land based SAM batteries and control other air assets. Granted, all of that is most valid when both the ship and any supporting forces operate at peak training and maintenance but even so, the loss of Slava is massive. It means that Russian forces in places like Kherson are more susceptible to Ukrainian air attack, that local fighter units have likely lost the "big picture" when it comes to enemy air movements and that coordinated strikes against Ukrainian assets within the former range of Moskva's sensors have just gotten a whole lot more difficult.

    Good luck trying to figure me out. I haven't managed that myself yet!



  • Posts: 2,986 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    What the Westerners now need to do is figure out if the forces used for a quasi proxy war are like Ukraine who are in it to win it or craven Afghans with no appetite for a fight. A lot is being learned about foreign military policy from this "special operation" in the Ukraine.



  • Posts: 25,917 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Been trying to get a thought straightened out since yesterday but yeah, Russia has gone all the way to dystopia. It's like something from a bad film or a video game. Consider most of Russian territory, it's wide open and inhospitable and ya wonder why there are towns in places like that with little resources, or sometimes there'll be a large industrial complex but the people working in it get nothing. The history of Russia and where it influences is one of periodical ethnic cleansing, mass transferring of people and murder.

    To me, and I'm sure there's bias, but Ukraine almost seems like it escaped the worst of the USSR in some cultural terms during those days. Finding out how much tech was developed in Ukraine rather than Russia has been eye-opening (even though I knew it 15-20 years ago it just kinda left my head), it's perhaps a sign of the more open, more collaborative culture that would be allowed in Ukraine compared to Russia in those days, despite Russia's vast population and access to/control of funding. The 15-20 years after the fall of the USSR was an opportunity for NATO/Europe to draw Ukraine in but they blew it to an extent. How easy it would have been, I don't know. Of course, plenty of the Russian and USSR influence was still around which played a part. The denuclearisation and pretty much disarming of the state left it much more vulnerable than it otherwise would have been. This was and could be sold as normalisation of relations but it's Russia so of course they see it as an opportunity to occupy, cleanse and annex some non-Russian lands.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,559 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Your man is talking complete sensationalist scutter.

    If Russia started raining down missiles on the mainland UK, the reaction would be swift and quite possibly non conventional.

    Our potato eating arsés would be the least of anyone's concerns.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,477 ✭✭✭zv2


    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,138 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    This update gives an interesting insight into any accusation the Ukrainians are inflating Russias losses for propaganda. Just before the Moskva was sunk, the toll was 19,900, so the updated figures look like thay are only including the losses from ground operations you'd expect at the current attrition rate.

    It appears they might be waiting to confirm the losses from the Moskva before adding them, because had they just guestimated and included thm the figure might well be 350 higher than that.



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  • Posts: 25,917 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    2000 APVs??



This discussion has been closed.
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