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organic farming

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Comments

  • #1112
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118817498#Comment_118817498

    I can if I don’t go in to the scheme.



  • #1113
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭endainoz


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118817612#Comment_118817612

    I only use meal for weaning because of the price. If 220 a hectare is only handy money for you then fair play I'd love to be in your position! Sure look the scheme certainly isn't for everyone, it has to suit your own system and ground. Unfortunately there's many that wouldn't even look into it and dismiss it as a total waste of time so at least you went much farther than that and did a bit of research into it.



  • #1114
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118817901#Comment_118817901

    I did a bit of research and can apply some of the techniques.

    But if you are already in some of the schemes then the draw down is less. Add that to the fact you would have to build a shed the size of an aircraft hanger and the extra inspections/ hassle added to the fact you may or may not be able to sell as organic then it’s not viable for me



  • #1115
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭endainoz


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118817927#Comment_118817927

    The drawdown is less? I don't understand that point. You can't get paid on certain things like LIPP GLAS land if that's what you mean, unconfirmed yet but it seems like this won't be the case in the new CAP.

    I have no idea or your numbers obviously but they must be quite large. Organic inspections are fine, they're not going out of their way to penalize you, I've have four so far and they have all gone grand.

    But anyway, you've obviously made up your mind so that's fine, as I said before it doesn't suit everyone.



  • #1116
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    I can see where you are coming from B. Wood chip solved some of the straw problem for me, but we have our own wood and chipper.

    The paperwork is a bitch, but for organic to work it has to be traceable. Any printed document that comes here from them has such a tiny font size that you would want a **** magnifying glass to read it. They must be trying to save paper or something, yet everything has to be on paper, they don’t do email at all.

    This is the last year of glas, whatever they replace it with should be eligible for a double payment or at least allow us to select options to do so on as much land as possible.

    With castration I am just selling weanling bulls to conventional farmers while in conversion anyway, may not finish cattle in future again. I rang good herdsman a couple of times to see what kind of beef they wanted for the future but never got a reply. The premium for organic beef isn’t enough IMHO. If there are any ex organic farmers on here it would be interesting to hear why they left.

    With fertiliser price gone so high, I don’t regret going organic yet anyway, but it’s not going to suit everyone and I can see why you made the decision. If you are in a part of the country where you can grow some grain for your own use it is easier. I am off now to do some overdue paperwork.

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



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  • #1117
    glanman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,874 ✭✭✭glanman


    Any know of the organic suppliers of MSS are covered in the dept scheme? Too late to contact them today bit if no answer here I'll get onto them tomorrow. The blend on the dept announcement has red and white clover, could cause trouble if wanting to graze to n spring?


    It's been extended to the 14th April by the way.



  • #1118
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 20,926 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118879948#Comment_118879948

    I considered bit. However you cannot use these fields for Reap in future. The seed suppliers have put up the backs by 20 euro each from what I heard.

    Government spec is very high in clover. You will have to reseed again in 3-4 years.

    I have looked at MSS and my own opinion is that in a beef system they are best used for grazing as opposed to silage. In a sage based system because you cannot spray you will have an issue with docks.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • #1119
    lalababa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,773 ✭✭✭lalababa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118549745#Comment_118549745

    Has the organic beef factory price risen with the conventional increase?



  • #1120
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Do you still need the big shed space for a dexter suckler cow?



  • #1121
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118905004#Comment_118905004

    Would you even need a shed for them? I think they could be out-wintered.

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



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  • #1122
    tractorporn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,626 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118905004#Comment_118905004

    Yeah its one of the downsides a cow is treated the same if she's a dexter or a Charolais all need 6m²



  • #1123
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118913932#Comment_118913932

    That’s gas. All of these schemes seem to be more about jobs for the boys and girls than the reality of farming



  • #1124
    Rusheseverywhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭Rusheseverywhere


    And the bull needs 10m2 and if not with cows access to pasture or exercise area of minimum of 30m2

    https://www.farmersjournal.ie/livestock-housing-considerations-for-organic-farming-659132




  • #1125
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    It's a min of 1m2 per 100kg LW, so if a Dexter cow is only 350 kg, she only needs a min of 5m2. All dairy cows need 6m2 min. Unless the Journal got it wrong?

    How heavy is a Dexter cow?

    Animal type

    Minimum indoors areas (net area available to animals)

    Liveweight (kg)m2/head

    Calves, beef cattle, bull beef, suckler cows

    Up to 100kg1.5

    Up to 200kg2.5

    Up to 300kg4.0

    Over 350kg5.0 with a minimum of 1sq m /100kg

    Dairy cowsPer cow6Breeding bullsPer bull10

    from the ifj article

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #1126
    Rusheseverywhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭Rusheseverywhere


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118914684#Comment_118914684

    It is 5s metres minimum and a condition of min 1 sq m per 100kg so an 900kg kilo CH cow of which I have too many needs 9sq metres.



  • #1127
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118914943#Comment_118914943

    What would it cost today to build a shed, even a basic straw bedded shed with a concrete floor???

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #1128
    tractorporn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,626 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118914684#Comment_118914684

    Yes the journal are wrong a cow needs 6m² regardless of size that's the way the inspector explained it to me



  • #1129
    Easten
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 849 ✭✭✭Easten


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118917870#Comment_118917870

    At 6m² you would only fit 3 cows into a 4.5m X 4.5m (a common slatted house pen size for reference). And those pens are bedded on Straw. Jazus the Cows are going to be in luxury



  • #1130
    Rusheseverywhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭Rusheseverywhere


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118917870#Comment_118917870

    I had a housing inpection recently and was per the Journal specs. The Specs are below from the Government a 375 calf needs 4m2 and his mother if 900kg need 9 so that cow calf unit need 13m2.

    https://assets.gov.ie/95090/80516670-f4c4-4cb8-adab-dd9e8478c101.pdf




  • #1131
    Rusheseverywhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭Rusheseverywhere


    40 decent cows with strong calves and a bull need 530 sg metre shed



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  • #1132
    tractorporn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,626 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118918831#Comment_118918831

    Who are you with, my IOA inspector measured my shed for 6m² per cow and 10m2 for the bull. 60m² shed was fit for 10 cows



  • #1133
    Rusheseverywhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭Rusheseverywhere


    Was going to say that is who you have. I am OT



  • #1134
    Rusheseverywhere
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 321 ✭✭Rusheseverywhere


    IOA much handier I am the only lad I know in Organics not with them.



  • #1135
    tractorporn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,626 ✭✭✭tractorporn


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118918941#Comment_118918941

    Yeah I hear that alright, I have had no dealings with the OT but lads have said they are sticky alright, and they put up the price this year according to endainoz. Sure just transfer over, lad beside me hear did it in 2020 said it was no hassle.



  • #1136
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭endainoz


    Does anyone here have experience finishing organic cattle off grass? I know little about finishing in general but just wondering if organic lads are subject to the same penalties for stock that's too old? What sort of target weights/age would the factories be normally looking for? The nearest organic factory to me would be good herdsman in Tipp.



  • #1137
    blue5000
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭blue5000


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118918941#Comment_118918941

    You're not the only 1, around here I only know 1 with the IOA, everyone else is OT.

    Does anyone know when the 'magic day' arrives on organic farms? I still have at least 1 silage field to graze here. Might even be 2.

    If the seat's wet, sit on yer hat, a cool head is better than a wet ar5e.



  • #1138
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 20,926 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118972570#Comment_118972570

    Magic day has not arrived on any dryish farms yet anyway. Need a few showers. Cold breeze all.the time.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • #1139
    148multi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,294 ✭✭✭148multi


    Magic day looked like the winning horse after the last rain, but it is a long way off now.

    The east breeze doesn't seem that cold but growth seems to have almost stopped.



  • #1140
    endainoz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,820 ✭✭✭endainoz


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118973730#Comment_118973730

    The drying easterly breeze always seems to come late April. Lads that grow veg in the west know when it comes that it's the right time to plant. Growth is slow for sure, but the soil temps are perfect, just need a bit of rain to get things to take off now. We had the opposite last year of an unseasonably cold month of may and it really stalled the growth. A few handy showers will work wonders. I'd be guessing lads that paid extortionate prices for fert with the hope of cutting in may are sweating now though!



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  • #1141
    148multi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,294 ✭✭✭148multi


    Very much so, in weather like this it takes grass to grow grass.

    Think there's frost promised this week.



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