is entering dairying still an option

Are they trying to turn it around or looking for an out?

Sad to hear that. I hope the stress of the decision isn't getting to them.

There was a talk on a local farm a few years back about guys entering dairy.

Basically, the guy speaking said don't let money be the only motivation for entering dairying.

He referred to dairying as senior hurling, basically, unless you are considered an excellent farmer at your current farming enterprise, dairying is not for you.

Why British Friesians cows

Go for a high ebi /hol/fr type cow with a good maintenance figure of 15-20€

yiull get nice sized cows that will graze and will do 550 kgs plus as mature cows

bf/fr will only do 450-500 kgs as cows and have very little milk in the back end

Ask these lads telling you their making 1000 odd profit per cow will they let you see their last 3 years of accounts to verify this, even sign a nda and pay them a few hundred for providing the accounts, and have your accountant look them over to verify, its boils my piss when drystock men think dairying is willy wonkas golden ticket and been cheered on by lads filling them with s***te

Another hurler on the Ditch here, but are British fr’s genetics not improving all the time to give high milk solids? Or it is that Holsteins are improving all the time too?

This idea of going spending 2-3 year on a dairy farm is not an option in reality. Going working as hired labour on a dairy farm for 12-14 euro/ hour for someone in there mid 30 may even with a family is not dealing with the reality of life.

At 13/ hour he have 520/ week before deductions. Maybe around 470 after deductions. That is not a runner.

I know a lot of larger dairy farmers like us to believed that there running costs are only 2-3 euro per cow less than there turnover. As for accounts you need to be able to read them. Interesting thing a lad that deals with a few large dairy farmers said to me a few weeks ago.

'' most of them consider that there profit is what is left in the bank at the end of the year after every expense from what is spend on the wife's car to the bag of coal bought in the co-op along with paying the tax man is all sorted''

Where most smaller operations win is attention to detail. A 1200 liter cow is turning. This year a 5500L cow will turn 2.5k, a 7kL one over 3k. I know lads like to think.that it takes only a few euro less than that in costs but there is a decent margin there no matter what lads say.

A lad with a tidy 60 cow operation turning 180k plus this year would have the reality of a 60-70k income even more even if the account did not reflect it.

The HO cow is probably improving faster. As well the huge development is this middle of the road HO cow suitable for grass. Along with that while lads may rail against JE cross when it come back to 75%HO you have a tidy cow for a grass operations with excellent solids from what I am told.

As In getting out. Of dairying?

Mostly you will be dealing with larger dairy farmers again. There was great threads on this 5 years ago. The dairy farmers taught that we should be happy out with 80-90c/day from 12 calf to point of calving. At that time I had it coated at 1.4/day if I remember right.

There was a couple of bugbears. Most want there stock only on your place. That means only add on is calf to beef operations where you have to buy your calves from them.

Next your stocking level would be huge in autumn with 8-10 month heifers and 20-22 month point of calving heifers.

Some dairy farmers want access to grass only carrying everything back to there own sheds in December.

A lot of beef operations are on more marginal land where targets are harder to meet.

For my own case I would like to do something like that as an alternative to Sucklers. Probably best talked about in another thread without hijacking this one

On a slightly side note, friend of mine milking 150 cows was badly let down by fella who worked for him. He basically left before calving started. He had some others to turn to but only part time. Friend looks old and grey beyond his years. He was well set up before expansion so they be no money issues and family have been strong dairy ppl for generations. Its impossible to get 'the right' person to work on dairy farms nowadays. id say he is regreating he ever expanded. I don't envy his position.  

He doesn't even need to go full time, Dairying is pretty repetitive, A few weeks even. Even to do a bit of relief milking to get a taste for it.

He could possibly try a bit of relief milking to get the idea. Work it around with his contracting. If he finds himself not liking maybe having to go and do a milking on a Sunday morning because he would have rather planned for something else that weekend, then that in itself might be a realisation of the commitment.

That is the reality of employing people. Not know what he was paying him but I imagine in the 12-14/ hour. Probably got s job elsewhere on 2-3 euro/ hour more. Niece works in a small business it's a twenty mile drive. She got a new job less than 5 miles from home on a euro fifty per hour more. However she had to start straight away so could only give her present employer two and a half weeks notice. She had a holiday booked for the week she was starting and that is going by the wayside as well.

There is no loyalty in the sub 15/ hour market. 1-2 euro per hour can make a huge difference to employees like this.

Saw a lad lately go from a 15/ hour job to where he will be earning 50-55k per year in a multi national company. Health inurance paid as well as pension contribution of 1.5 times his contribution up to 10% of wages.

He was asking me about the pension and I explained that fir every tenner he puts it, it's costing him 6 euro and the company will pay 15. So for his six euro he getting 25 into his pension.

If he earns 50k and puts in 3.4k company will put in 5k and it costs him 2k net.

OP admitted that because if his skill set he has limited employment opportunities. He also want to stay farming full-time.

If he was willing to get a job I tell him stay at the drystock part time. Those type of jobs are available mostly around larger towns and cities. Ideally you need a basic third level qualifications at present.

You might be better off to expand your contracting services and let your wife tip away in some handy job .Cattle haulage ,piped slurry ,hedge cutting ,reseeding and dung spreading are some of the jobs to consider.Milking cows is grand but you aint paid for the amount of hours put in .You will hear about highly profitable 500kg solids herds but that would be A1 quality land ,A1 quality management and basically sleeping with cows and spoon feeding them

If you're absolutely certain you like cows...go for it.

15 unit second hand parlour..

4 rows milking

Buy replacements

Every calf out the door..

40K easily..where else would you get it

You would get 40k easily enough without any outlay or responsiblity in most multinational or pharmaceuticals, as well as additional income in part time farming sucklers etc

40k is certainly not considered easy in a dairy set up

That's a 100k a year role when I think about it.

Be as well of on an oil rig, health insurance and pension paid extra.

If your considering the job for money, if not ignore the above, but I suspect most are

I transitioned from sheep to cows last year. I was working on different diary farms since 2014. I worked in new Zealand style farms and high input winter milk farms. I milked as often as I could to see whether this is what I wanted to do. I bought calves and reared them to incalf heifers using my own funds. I borrowed for the building of a shed, parlor, handing facilities, collecting yard, slurry tank, feed area and a wall for a calf shed. Before I went down this route I got a job offer to go out to Saudi Arabia working on dairy farms. I know of two other lads who done it. One fella loved it the other hated it.

You can make the system as easy or as difficult as you want. I enjoy farming from a young age and I worked at different things for a while. I'm glad I made the move. It's like any job, you either love it or hate it. It's seven days a week if you want it to be.