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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,158 ✭✭✭realdanbreen


    To any Russians lurking here.

    I'm just watching the news.watching children with limbs blown off. Another 6 year old who witnessed his mother burn to death in front of him in their car. I hope the Russians who did this burn in hell. I hope the Russians who ordered it burn in hell . and I hope the Russians who are doing nothing to overthrow the tyrant burn in hell.



  • Posts: 7,946 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Russia and the US have been fighting proxy wars, not directly. The Korean war is the only one they have fought each other directly, and that was limited to air. And at a time when it was far less possible to do global damage. It wasn't going to mean the end of the world.

    Questions for you - do you think NATO are craven Chicken Littles for not engaging Russia directly in Ukraine?

    And if you do what comparable military experience have you got to think they are wrong?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 894 ✭✭✭Bayonet




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,248 ✭✭✭✭Sand


    Is it a pariah state though? The states that are sanctioning Russia are basically US/UK/EU and US partners like Australia, New Zealand and South Korea. Nobody in South or Central America, Africa or mainland Asia (excluding SK) is participating to my knowledge. China in particular has underlined its support for Russia ( an official made a very interesting comment that China well remembers NATO bombing its embassy in Belgrade) despite US pressure. Even the president of US neighbour Mexico has refused to participate, saying they did not see the conflict as their problem and they wished to maintain good relations with all countries. What is interesting is that the US has not been able to command a more global response.

    And does anyone in the US view Russia as a genuine threat to the US itself? Biden has underlined that he wont commit US troops so even he doesn't seem convinced of that. I'd have though after only just ending a 20 year debacle in Afghanistan, most Americans are heartily sick of forever wars on the other side of the globe.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 894 ✭✭✭Bayonet


    Sure. But then an ICBM might hit Dublin and you've got no way to deal with it.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 395 ✭✭Slava_Ukraine


    Unlikely, not certain - but unlikely to happen. If it does, it does. What is your preferred reality? The rest of your life posting on forums speculating on what happens next? Not a dig at you CW.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,395 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    You're obsessed with the idea of the end of the human race. It's not a reason to avoid standing up to belligerent and violent actor on the edge of Europe. There is a question of right & wrong. Are you happy to stand by and watch another Srebrenica and then wring your hands afterwards?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,395 ✭✭✭✭Furze99




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,430 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    I would say it is at the moment, yes. North Korea is not banned from competing in the World Cup and the Olympic Games but the Putin pariah regime is. Suggestions that China might send military aid to the regime wiped many hundreds of billions of dollars off their shares on the stock exchange within minutes. We're talking about the most toxic and hated country in the world right now.



  • Posts: 7,946 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I agree it's unlikely, and I've had to calm children and adults we are not heading towards nuclear war. Am I the only one?

    BUT, it is possible. That possibility increases significantly, imo, if NATO engage Russian troops in Ukraine. Its not the big man thing to say, but its reality. It really is.

    Do I think what's happening in Ukraine is terrible. It is, but I think it could get a lot worse AND its also NATOs position.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,226 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Ehh Napoleon invaded to teach the Czar a lesson as he was reneging on his agreement, had hit Fench luxury goods with trarifs amd wouldn't let Napoleon marry his sister.

    So what else was Napoleon meant to do. 😉

    Wilhem invaded after Russia had invaded East Prussia so fair is fair.

    If you start it then you got to take it.

    Yes Hitler invaded, but then again Stalin had invaded and carved up Poland with Hitler, he had also taken the Baltic states and tried to take Finland although the Finns gave the Red Army a bloody nose.

    Actually Putin should have read history, Ukraine is turning out to be another Finland.

    I am not allowed discuss …



  • Posts: 7,946 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Because I can see that happening. I've no ego here. I'm in agreement with NATO.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,185 ✭✭✭Polar101


    I wouldn't be an expert, but I think it says those are Panzerfaust 3's, which both the Netherlands and Germany sent to Ukraine. The Ukrainian armed forces have already published photos where their troops are equipped with those, so it doesn't sound like they were all scrap metal. These weapons are generally from the early 90's, so they ought to be usable.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy



    The bollox8ng from Germany has been mentioned on by all sides, most stridently by those in the Ukraine who are killing Russians and are finding the German promised deliveries are junk when delivered or else not coming.


    Germany talked up for the media but still want a quick resolution to this and that means a Russian victory.


    The 100bn rearmament plan will fade in to obscurity as well in years to come.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 34,783 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    I'm super excited for the day your whataboutery living it up in absolute paradise in Europe gets to experience what actual.whataboutery looks like in Russia.

    I'm in no doubt about how much you'll enjoy it. It will be stellar. A joy to behold. When is it that you'll be shipping out to experience this bastion of free speech where menly men get to do menly men things and all this lefty woofty nonsense isn't around.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,917 ✭✭✭GM228


    Sometimes the work of the Irish Air Corps goes unnoticed, like transporting a sick baby from Poland (originally from Kyiv) to Crumlin CH:-

    I wish him and his family a healthy future.



  • Posts: 19,174 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 34,783 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    There's no ICBM hitting Dublin. Enough of this horseshit already

    Fantasy land crap.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭greenpilot


    This thread has wound down to its bitter end.



  • Posts: 7,946 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It's a very useful thread and I'm sure it will continue.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    That sounds worrying. They are probably going to make an example of it and carpet it with shells.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,891 ✭✭✭✭briany


    Hard to say if the next American administration would disengage. We know what the Biden administration's basic stance is - "Russia are dickheads, but we cannot confront them directly, 'cause y'know...", but the Republican party of the USA does not appear to have its message straight on Russia at all. They're still putting out feelers on what's resonating. Is Biden doing too much or not enough? Is this really all NATO's fault and the invasion is basically fake news anyway?

    Putin did gauge one thing correctly - the current American political system cannot agree that the sky is blue. Russia could invade the United States tomorrow, and some Americans wouldn't believe it because CNN were reporting it. Others would actively help the Russians if the Russians announced they wanted to reinstall Trump. Europe, on the other hand, has showed surprisingly strong political unity. Even those countries that were at odds with the EU, like Poland, Hungary and the UK, are at least singing from the same hymn sheet on the matter.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    The Dutch ones are quality, an awful lot of the German ones are scrap, what little they have delivered.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭greenpilot




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 395 ✭✭Slava_Ukraine


    I guess my point here was to say do we put up with this terrorism forever from Russia? I totally get yours.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 894 ✭✭✭Bayonet


    Ah, so Russia will allow the Irish to send in troops to Ukraine with no repercussions? That's a bold bet. I wouldn't want to roll those dice.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 894 ✭✭✭Bayonet




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,354 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    You may have missed this bit...

    "they've either been at war with or invaded by a western entity in the most major conflicts that Europe has ever seen"

    The reasons for the conflicts don't really matter. The lasting effects of them do, however, and they can be invoked as a propaganda tool. All the "yeh but.." won't change that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,031 ✭✭✭circadian


    At no point during this war have the Russians told the truth or done anything in good faith. They'll bomb the **** out of it regardless.


    My guess is the response will be "go **** yourself"



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 4,924 ✭✭✭thomil


    If I may...?

    That Twitter user is talking out of his derriere! The weapon shown there is a German weapon indeed, a Panzerfaust 3 anti tank weapon. I don't know where he's getting the "scrap" from, because the paperwork shown in the tweet is simply the maintenance record for the weapon, which outlines the inspections and documentation checks for the weapon. The page shown in the second image of that tweet ends with an inspection on December 4th, 2012, however there are numerous additional pages behind it, indicating that the weapon has undergone its regular checks as required.

    Generally, modern weapons are designed to last for quite a while, having a shelf life of at least twenty years. Provided the page shown in the Tweet is the first page for the inspection log, which would indicate that the weapon was delivered to the Bundeswehr (the Federal German Defence Forces) in 2005, this weapon would still be below that mark and good to use. You can bet that even some of the Javelins or Stingers that have come in from the States are as old as this Panzerfaust 3. Also keep in mind that Germany sent 1000 of these Panzerfaust 3, together with 200 Stinger missiles, to Ukraine already.

    There has been one major issue with weapons deliveries from Germany, and that's with a shoulder-launched surface to air missile called the 9K32 Strela, NATO designation SA-7 Grail. This weapon, while quite a bit older than the Stinger, is generally comparable, if slightly less capable. However, it is a standard-issue MANPADS with the Ukrainian Armed Forces and as such very much in demand. Germany inherited several thousands of these weapons from the East German Nationale Volksarmee (NVA, National People's Army in English), where it had been standard issue. The weapon remained in use with the Bundeswehr until 2012, when it was decommissioned and mothballed.

    The weapons were kept in storage and thus remained listed in the Bundeswehr's inventory. However, as Strela was no longer an active weapons system, it didn't see any more active maintenance, unlike systems such as the Panzerfaust 3 or Stinger. I presume that when the request from Ukraine for such weapons arrived, the clerks in the Ministry of Defense simply checked their computer to see if they had any in stock and saw the 2700 missiles listed, which resulted in the positive feedback to the initial request. It was only when soldiers went into the warehouse to check the weapons the day after the request that they discovered what was really going on and that a lot of those missiles were just not safe to use anymore. 700 missiles were completely unsafe, with micro fissures in the propellant casing leading to the propellant partially oxidising, whilst other had severe corrosion issues. A lot of the transport and storage boxes had gotten mouldy, meaning that the warehouses where these weapons are stored are now off-limits to anyone without a hazmat suit. Having said that, 500 missiles that were operational were sent to Ukraine as soon as possible. I'm not sure what"s going on with the remaining missiles, I hope they're getting thorough inspections and the ones that are still usable get sent to Ukraine ASAP.

    Whilst I'm thoroughly appalled at the way the government back home in Germany is handling the invasion of Ukraine, there is some perspective needed when it comes to actual military aid. To put it bluntly, Germany doesn't have as much to give as many would think, certainly not when it comes to infantry or man-portable weapons. Ever since reunification, the Bundeswehr has been systematically wound down, with base closures on a massive scale, the radical decommissioning of all Warsaw Pact weapons inherited from Eastern Germany, numerous half-baked "defence reforms" that ended up achieving sweet foxtrot alpha, apart from providing nice payouts to "consultants" and lobbyists for the defense industry. Things reached their lowest point in 2015, when none of the brand-new German 212A submarines were safe to put to sea, a new class of corvette was introduced that did its best to gas its own crew due to a design flaw in the exhaust system, the availability of the Eurofighter Typhoon fleet fell to such a low level that Poland had to cover some QRA missions, and so on. Right now, most of Germany's parachute regiments haven't had a practice jump in years, mostly because they can't find enough serviceable parachutes and harnesses. The Army is equipped with transport helicopters in which the cabin floor crumples when soldiers in combat boots step on them. Things have gotten better since 2015, the submarine fleet is back operational, the issue with the Braunschweig class corvettes have been fixed and the Eurofighter availability has risen to 70-79% of aircraft being available for operations on any given day, but there are still numerous issues that will take years to fix. For all its outward appearances, Germany isn't too far off equipment-wise from the Russian Army.

    Good luck trying to figure me out. I haven't managed that myself yet!



This discussion has been closed.
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