Civil Service - Post Lockdown - Blended Working?

25-01-2022 04:16PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531499#Comment_118531499

You seem like a sufferer of Stockholm syndrome.

Instead of asking why everywhere isn't more like your place, ask why your place isn't more like everywhere else. You are bemoaning the fact that you have to work 9 to half 5, if you're lucky. Possibly longer. And you appear to be happy for others to be forced to do that, without being adequately rewarded, instead of rejoicing in the fact that the more this becomes the norm, the more chance you have of getting those hours yourself.

And besides, your post doesn't negate the point being made by the previous poster. People had their contracts and terms of employment, including their wages, hours and conditions, unilaterally changed for the worst. It is an absolute farce that it has taken so long for this to be rectified. If you think it's such a handy number, then there's no shortage of comps up on public jobs to get your teeth into.

HerrKuehn · 25-01-2022 04:38PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531597#Comment_118531597

WFH isn't anywhere in your terms and conditions though is it? Perhaps your employer should also be concerned about unilaterally changing your conditions for the better without getting anything in return for it? Maybe its best for the CS to stick with old practices like tea breaks and half an hour to cash a pay cheque.

gmisk · 25-01-2022 04:40PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531686#Comment_118531686

That half an hour thing to lodge a cheque is long gone I am pretty sure....plus I think it was 15 minutes.

HerrKuehn · 25-01-2022 04:42PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531691#Comment_118531691

I know its gone, it took us having to call in the IMF to get rid of it. Not exactly a sign of a modern and dynamic CS, more one that is stuck well in the past.

gmisk · 25-01-2022 04:50PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531700#Comment_118531700

I don't know when it officially went, but I literally don't know anyone who used it when it was available. My guess is unions would have fought it removal like they for most things (for good and bad).

CS/PS has its issues no doubt, but the non modern and dynamic thing varies massively by department.

In the ICT area the CS/PS is massively hamstrung by low wages compared to the private sector, specialist panels etc are a relatively new thing and are limited as well. This leads to being over reliant on contractors and a lack of investment in their own resources.

Anyway back on topic. Hopefully the option of blended working/wfh is available to anyone who has proven themselves capable of doing so over the last 2 years. I have a team of 5 and would have no issue with my team working from home, they have shown themselves to work just as hard and productively outside of an office environment.

25-01-2022 04:55PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531691#Comment_118531691

It was stopped for new entrants in 2003 (only 19 years ago!) and for everyone else in 2010!

But sure, there is no telling some people.

HerrKuehn · 25-01-2022 04:56PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531751#Comment_118531751

I know when it was removed. It was amazing that it still existed in 2010.

gmisk · 25-01-2022 04:57PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531751#Comment_118531751

So it was gone 12 years ago...and 19 years for new entrants.

I literally know no one who used it.... I don't think it should be used as a stick to beat everyone who works in PS/CS.

As I said in my other post, unions fight for everything (both in a good and bad way imo).

25-01-2022 05:09PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531757#Comment_118531757

So if you already knew, why are you bringing it up now? Over a decade later for most, and in some cases, nearly two decades?

HerrKuehn · 25-01-2022 05:19PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531806#Comment_118531806

It shows the resistance to change in the CS/PS and the type of mentality like @Flinty997 has where someone who does nothing should be put on some sort of meaningless task rather than actually deal with the issue.

25-01-2022 05:27PM

be good if the usual suspects who know nothing about the public sector other than what they heard their uncle spout while drunk in the 80s could leave us to discuss the thread topic as pertains to our actual employment

25-01-2022 05:38PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531891#Comment_118531891

Same every time. Ill-informed knee-jerkers jump in with two feet, spouting off about something from donkeys years ago. That banking time, by the way, was another condition removed without any compensation for it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531686#Comment_118531686

You're right, it wasn't. And now it will be brought into law for pretty much everyone, not just civil servants.

Do you agree that any/all employers should be able to just change your contract when it suits them?

25-01-2022 05:41PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531849#Comment_118531849

What it shows is your resistance to accept that the civil service has changed massively over the last 20 years.

Probably best to let the civil servants discuss issues that are relevant and actually apply in 2022.

billyhead · 25-01-2022 05:55PM

I think the general civil service wide guidance will possibly be 3 days in and 2 remote.

25-01-2022 06:06PM

They are also going to have to look at how these patterns will affect worksharers - I can see that getting complicated.

I know I've been asked by a worksharer doing a split week 3/2 if it meant they would be back in "full time" the way they were pre-covid or will it be pro-rata, somehow.

caviardreams · 25-01-2022 07:26PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118529294#Comment_118529294

This is the nub of it. If there was the opportunity to veto it for an employee missed deadlines repeatedly and failed to answer emails in a timely way it would fix a lot of issues and probably be an incentive for people to raise their performance.

But there isn't, and there won't be.

martysparty · 25-01-2022 07:46PM

Is this a problem that you are aware of (people missing deadlines, not answering emails etc)? Just curious if its an issue as its not something I've heard happening. And if it is an issue why don't line managers sort it out?

Abcdefg1234567 · 25-01-2022 08:47PM

Has there been any indication when the blended work policy will be published? I've to go back to the office next week and my concern is the longer I'm in, the harder it will be to get out again

25-01-2022 09:07PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118532762#Comment_118532762

Have you been told to go back full time?

We were told today that we don't have to go back in immediately, and that any return will be staggered and cautious.

Abcdefg1234567 · 25-01-2022 09:46PM

No, two days initially but I'm worried it will increase to full time very quickly

Shuffl_in · 25-01-2022 09:51PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118532762#Comment_118532762

Leo Varadkar: “We’d intend to have this legislated before the summer recess and certainly in place this year.”

God knows when. I'm sure they'll get us back full time for a few months to remind us that's the 'norm'.

Abcdefg1234567 · 25-01-2022 10:06PM

I thought Leo's comment was in relation to the "Right to request remote work" legislation, and not the CS blended work policy? I assumed they were two different things entirely, or am I being completely daft?

I thought the blended policy was supposed to be implemented by April 1st? Summer is way too long to wait!

caviardreams · 25-01-2022 10:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118532488#Comment_118532488

Yes, very familiar! All you can do as a manager in the CS is chase up and remind, and once the zoom call is over, they can just ignore you again. Or if you email (as everything needs to be a paper trail) they just ignore it. HR won't let you start a PIP in case it ends up in the WRC and even if you do, it will still end up in the WRC and the employee plays the stress / bullying card and the manager gets the heat.

In the private sector it's fine, as there is a clear consequence of missed deadlines and emails - demotion, dismissal etc. or bonus foregone at the very least, so the line manager can say "deadlines need to be met or X" - in the CS all you can say is "deadlines need to be met.... no, wait, what do you mean, I'm not bullying you". In short - there are no consequences in the CS so managers are powerless, and it's not the managers fault it's the system and culture.

TaurenDruid · 25-01-2022 10:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118531938#Comment_118531938

That banking time, by the way, was another condition removed without any compensation for it.

What compensation would have been fair? "You took away my 30 minutes to go to the bank and cash my cheque!" "Yeah, and we stopped paying you by cheque - your wages go directly into your bank account now, and you have an ATM card, so..."

Shuffl_in · 25-01-2022 10:32PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118533134#Comment_118533134

I assume that at the end of the day they're one and the same. Though I concede it may be me that's daft. I'll hope you're right.

We've been told we're back in two days a week from Monday. I expect this will increase shortly after.

25-01-2022 10:41PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118533134#Comment_118533134

It was supposed to be implemented by Q2, but then the numbers went up, everyone was told to work from home again, and threw a spanner in those works.

Its two steps forward, one step back.

25-01-2022 10:44PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118533187#Comment_118533187

I've successfully completed a PIP. It depends on HR on how strong they are. All the WRC do is ensure due proccess was followed. If it was then not much can be done.

25-01-2022 10:46PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118533224#Comment_118533224

There was no resistance to the removal of the banking half hour by staff, its just something that gets dragged up to be thrown into our faces every now and again.

But my Dept did have staff still being paid by cheque in 2010! Some staff refused to give their bank details for EFT!

caviardreams · 25-01-2022 10:47PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118533296#Comment_118533296

Yeah, I think it's just hit and miss with HR and whether they want an easy life themselves or not. In a lot of cases, it's taking the easiest option rather than the right option. Good to know it can happen in some cases though!

25-01-2022 11:02PM

civil service blended working is a separate thing to the legislation covering right to request remote working

Civil Service - Post Lockdown - Blended Working?

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