Vertical wind turbines?

kenmc · 08-01-2022 11:15PM #1

Is there a reason we don't have the same push for microwind as we do for solar? Quick Google gives a 2kw vert turbine for just over a grand (https://www.tesup.ie/product-page/atlas20-48v-2kw-wind-turbine-IE) (apologies if link is not allowed) - potentially 48kwh on a perfect day, but more importantly, not restricted to sunshine, typically windier in winter when solar output is lowest too? So even it was trickling along at 10kwh a day on average it would surely do a huge amount in terms of knocking down the electric bill in lots of houses? Coupled with solar would be even better too?

Or what am I missing?

Jonathan · 08-01-2022 11:22PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058226757/vertical-wind-turbines

Planning laws make it almost impossible to operate in an urban area. Needs to be as far away from your perimeter as it is high (so basically if it fails it won't land in the neighbour's garden).

08-01-2022 11:25PM

decided to look for a review of that model from someone who is not a supplier

you might want to look at this guy's experience!

https://powerforum.co.za/topic/7804-tesup-atlas20-review/

I've always heard that micro-wind is a waste of time and money

Wind is a "scale" thing

solar works out cheaper on all fronts, even in Ireland.

kenmc · 08-01-2022 11:28PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118441664#Comment_118441664

Is that not just "normal" turbines though, not vertical ones? I could mount one on the gable of my house, it'd be a metre, metre and a half above the ridge line, so no risk to neighbours

kenmc · 08-01-2022 11:36PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118441679#Comment_118441679

I didn't do any research on specific, was just the first example I saw a price and dimensions

graememk · 08-01-2022 11:36PM

+460 for an inverter too.

Drawback is that the startup speed is 4m/s which is 14km/h, although will generate down to 3m/s

Then mounting/clearance from neighbours etc becomes issues.

I have thought about it too. But realistically I'd need to actually go and measure the wind where I'd put it.

Vertical do tend to deal better with less clean air than traditional turbines.

Sure it's rated for 2kw. But what does it need to get that power... Or what does it actually generate at start up speeds.

bullit_dodger · 08-01-2022 11:39PM

Yeah, I'd be a huge fan of wind in principle. We'd a good discussion on wind and some variations on the turbines.

Ridgeblade Wind Turbines — boards.ie - Now Ye're Talkin'

Sadly the physics just isn't there in an urban setting in Ireland. Air (despite what you think) is too turbulent down around your typical urban height. You need to go up about 60 ft, and then it becomes pretty good apparently. With the zoning laws in Ireland it would be ... problematic.

If I lived out in the countryside though, I'd have on in I reckon (horizontal) that is. Vertical axis ones are simplier but don't have the same production as the horizontal ones.

graememk · 08-01-2022 11:50PM

Power curve, it generates 3 phase ac, then the charge controller rectifies it to DC, then either a battery is charged or sent to an inverter.

It's quite big too. 1.2*1*1m.

idc · 09-01-2022 12:13AM

I got a weather station last Christmas just for keeping track of wind speed. Now it is only 3.7m off the ground so most of the time it's never really fast enough. For last 3 months average was 2.8 m/s but I figure during January will get some longer pipe and see how it improves with height.

graememk · 09-01-2022 02:21PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118441896#Comment_118441896

May I ask what you got?

my nearest weather station with wind data, Is malin head. But its always windy there! Red line is 4m/s - (average windspeed per day) - you can pull hourly windspeeds from met.ie too.

Looking at the power chart, really you need to be getting 6-7 (grey line is 7) to generate anything decent.

idc · 09-01-2022 03:20PM

Bresser 5 in 1 weather station

https://www.bresser.de/en/Recommendation-Lists/bresser/BRESSER-WIFI-color-weather-center-with-5in1-profi-sensor.html?mtm_campaign=Doofinder&mtm_kwd=7002580&mtm_source=English&mtm_medium=OnSite&mtm_cid=GreatBritain&mtm_group=SiteSearch

graememk · 09-01-2022 06:06PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118443961#Comment_118443961

Been looking for some sort of connected weather station for a while. (Rainfall mainly)

And if I can pull the data out live (ish) I'll be able to estimate production, and account for day/night use too.

Hopefully it might shine some actual numbers on wind. But as always it's location location location

idc · 09-01-2022 06:19PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118444792#Comment_118444792

They have loads of different versions with varying connectability! The unit i has wifi connection but that only allows me to link it to weather cloud or wundercloud. Not sure its possbile with my version to get a better live feed other that the display it comes with.

bullit_dodger · 09-01-2022 06:29PM

The MetEireann API will return the forecasted winds for you lat/long. E.g.

http://metwdb-openaccess.ichec.ie/metno-wdb2ts/locationforecast?lat=53.27;long=-6.32

Which you can parse and extract out the windspeeds. Whatever about the solar radiation (which I've yet to validate with how the radiation forecasts compare to my own actual production) I know the wind forecasts are usually pretty good....at least within the forthcoming 24 hrs. Further out than 24hrs, the chaotic nature of the weather is harder to forecast, but all you need really is 12-24 hrs.

We talked about it in the other thread, but if your "out da country" and have the ability to setup a 800-1000w turbine on a 20-30ft pole, I'd say for less than €2K you could get yourself a 500-800watt turbine up and running with charge controller hooked up to a battery bank. I'd imagine it would have a reasonable return on vestment, if not, it would still be a superb fun project. Surprised there aren't more people on here in rural areas who have one?

idc · 09-01-2022 06:40PM

I'm on the border of urban/rural ! In housing estate yet over the back wall is endless fields!!! Hence why using my own measurements might make more sense!! Just need to make it a bit higher

bullit_dodger · 09-01-2022 07:17PM

I know, it's the curse of a housing estate. Even borderline like you idc, I'd say you would struggle. Possibly not with the wind side of things, but the neighbors and/or planning laws. I'd love to give one a lash - but I think anything decent (say 500w) would have a rotor diameter of 2ft plus. Even a super quiet one the bearings rotating away for months at a time will wear out and a squeek or some noise will develop and the neighbors will (rightly) complain that it's keeping them awake at night. Or they'd just complain for the sake of complaining.....there's always one neighbor who's like that, isn't there? Then they be off to the council that the pole is too high for the plot of land out my back yard, etc.

However, out in "proper" rural countryside with your nearest neighbor 200m or more away - ohh I'd be out with me shovel and spade digging the pit for the foundations no sooner than you could google "best wind turbine 2022" :-)

graememk · 09-01-2022 07:46PM

Although looking on youtube, Theres a few videos on the tesup atlas 2.. Not one of them good. All with failures, Belts breaking, vanes been torn off etc.

uyou'd forgive one, but if multiple people have put it up, and then months later have failures.

As for a big turbine? id be better off going more panels and more batteries!

idc · 09-01-2022 07:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118445264#Comment_118445264

Interesting will have to google that, as i usually end up on the Tesup webpage when I occasonally check out what turbine options are available should i ever be mad enough to install one in my urban setting!!!

graememk · 09-01-2022 08:03PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118445315#Comment_118445315

The two that ive come across so far.

: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYyfnzsxd8xSwtUqGi8gSgg

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPt1wV781Ne4yP2tz0angOg

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl5odxNGVqzG4BQIfIIGnvQ

They all start out promising, but just finish disheartening!.

graememk · 09-01-2022 09:10PM

For reference, this is the inverter that Tesup use : If someone wants to ali express it :D

https://pvshop.eu/Groowatt-MIC-2000-TL-X ,

Note the startup voltage is also 50v

unkel · 09-01-2022 09:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118444928#Comment_118444928

I'm the same. Had a vertical axis wind turbine on top of a 6m pole. It doesn't work. Forget about it, unless you live in an area on a top of a hill where you can install a tall mast (>20m)

Jonathan · 10-01-2022 12:45AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118445388#Comment_118445388

While not vertical turbines, Toys For Watts might be of interest to those here. He also had a Atlas turbine but that didn't end well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMYw8MrKVPo

dathi · 10-01-2022 10:08AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118441689#Comment_118441689

https://eurecca.ie/planing-permission-for-wind-turbines/

not allowed to attach them to your house

kenmc · 10-01-2022 12:48PM

That seems to describe horizontal rather than vertical though (6m diameter, clearances between ground and "lower tip")

unkel · 10-01-2022 01:05PM

Don't even think about attaching it to your house.

kenmc · 10-01-2022 01:06PM

I won't, just thinking out loud.....

bullit_dodger · 10-01-2022 02:00PM

I've posted this a few times previously, but for those of you who haven't seen this.....got to admire the lads skills.

Building A 3 kW Off Grid Wind Turbine - Build Guide & Plans In The Description! - YouTube

How he builds the turbine blades out of fiberglass ....... yeah, pure skills.

To the OP, sadly as mentioned can't see it anywhere a runner unless you live out in the sticks. You will very likely not get the rated power output, but that's ok if you are getting 500w off a 1Kw turbine it's still 500w supplementing your solar in the winter. But the challenges of neighbors, planning permission laws etc make life difficult in ireland.

Vertical wind turbines?

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