The Guardian tells us that Christmas is saved by "rightwing politicians"

Christmas is inclusive, everyone is invited, everyone can have a Christmas Tree and Santa visit and all that stuff that makes it beautiful. The push, which is as real as it can be, is to strip it clean of its Christian origins, it's religious meaning to Christians and its name - all these won't make it inclusive, persons of any religion can enjoy the non-religious parts of Christmas and just ignore it's religious meaning.

yeah but you need to go back further than someone saying "Happy Holidays"..

I suppose there is a bit of a point there - the "Christ" in "Christmas" is probably the only clue that this was once a Christian holiday and by saying happy holidays we are taking away the last Christian thing about it.

regardless - no one is in reality "pushing" for this.

Maybe right wing politicians the world over should focus first on applying the values of Christian origins to Christianity instead of the regressive, self centered, careless version of the religion they display in their words and actions on a daily basis. Whether it is talking about the sanctity of life while arguing against the right to have an abortion as they vehemently oppose gun control legislation which might help prevent mass shootings. Or demanding free will when it comes to vaccines and asks while opposing same sex marriage Or being opposed to the idea of rescuing people at risk of drowning in the middle of the English channel while talking about being compassionate, they sure like to pick which battles need to be fought in the name of religion and which don't.

I think we differ as to what percentage of right wingers are more comfortable with the points I outlined than are not. No doubt there are extremists on both sides of the conversation, but left wing extremists want to help as many people as possible, right wing.... don't. That for me is a fundamental difference in the ideologies of both sides of the political coin.

I put a long post in the 'Abortion in America' thread I think it was pointing out the, in my view, the fallacy of the 'two sides' argument. Feel free to dig it out and respond to it, I've asked others to do so but no one as yet has done so.

As I said, I've no problem with acknowledging that there are extremists, and there are many wolves in sheeps clothing on the left side of the debate, not to mention opportunists and blinkered views etc etc. But, fundamentally, right ideals prioritise that of the individual and less regulation over that of society and shared agreements and understanding. I can see the arguments for the former, but as the world becomes more and more populated, and integrated, the need for the latter is more and more the case.

No different than living on your own and being able to wash dishes when you want and what volume to have the TV at etc versus living with housemates and acting with your housemates in mind as well as your own.*

• It's way more complex than that, but, I'm sure you get the point.

Or they did know that but thought it would be great for stirring shít up anyway. I know which my money would be on.

Xmas isn't the only celebration during December so saying "Happy Holidays" covers everyone.

But it seems a certain percentage of christians love to feel persecuted that their particular holiday isn't no1 or the most important.

edit

And yet you have self appointed yourself as an arbiter, of who can and who can't celebrate Christmas.

Surely the point is that you celebrate whatever you want and not have to worry about the offense of others, who should not really be offended by someone else celebrating their chosen holiday. My happiness should not offend you.

if one is secure in their religion, it shouldn't matter that someone else critiques it.

The biased discrimination against European culture is precisely the end result of allowing other cultures to set up their culture within ours.

This "Christmas" thing is yet another in a long line of such things. It's not particularly important, but this is the principle of death by a thousand cuts. It's just another cut.

No bashing of anyone, it's simply cause and effect.

If there were legions of central Americans having set up shop within the middle East and were campaigning against middle eastern culture, you'd say "that's crap, but it's fair because it's happening here too."

But it isn't happening anywhere else, it isn't happening to any other culture or people (perhaps the uighur in China, but that's actual genocide).

So it isn't fair, or equal. And what we'll be left with is zero culture. We will have a non-culture, a vacuum. People of nothing, for nothing.

Meanwhile every other group of people on Earth are allowed carry on as usual, they don't have to "worry" about making themselves "inclusive", or to rename their traditions, or to have themselves behaviourally modified for the benefit of others.

In short, it's a whole bag of stinking faeces. You get what you deserve, you lose what you allow.