BusConnects Dublin - Bus Network Changes Discussion

In simple terms what are the precise issues that you have, and what were you expecting?

I will correct you on one point. There are currently five 25a buses departing the terminus at Supervalu between 06:00 and 06:59. Allowing for the additional journey time from Adamstown, there will now be seven C1 departures - that's two extra buses, from Arthur Griffith Park inwards during that period, and not one, which is when the capacity issues arose was it not? During the same time period, there are currently four 25b departures between 06:00 and 06:59, and now there will be seven C2 departures.

The frequency of the C1 and C2 are precisely what the was said they would be when the plan was published in 2019 and the final version in 2020 - including Saturdays. The Saturday drop on the C1/C2 was clear when the plan was published in 2020 - https://busconnects.ie/media/1988/a3-frequency-tables-061020-fa.pdf

There are only a few instances of gaps of 33 minutes Mon-Fri and that's just at the terminus. They will close up as the routes are being scheduled to try and give even headways from Woodies inwards between the four C-Spine routes combined, and on the C1/C2 combined from Foxborough inwards.

I think that you are probably a little off the mark in saying that the L routes will make absolutely no difference to the C1. The L53 was added in the final version of the plan and it will reduce pressure on both the C1 and C2 west of Liffey Valley as people making the local journey to the shopping centre may use that bus instead particularly as it takes a more direct route, thus freeing up seats on both the C1 and C2. I accept that it doesn't mean increased frequency on the unique part of the C1 between Griffeen Road and Arthur Griffith Park, but it should free up some seats on the C1 buses serving those stops.

It is fair to say that a lot of the Saturday traffic on the 25a/25b is between Lucan and Liffey Valley, rather than it all being to/from the city, and both the L51 and L53 will take up some of that slack in the general area both taking more direct routes.

I do take your point that frequencies on the routes replacing the 25a/25b or 66 and 67 are not massively increasing, but I suspect that you may have had incorrect expectations, as that was never ever part of the BusConnects plan.

What BusConnects is about is:

• Extending operating hours;
• Increasing frequencies at the margins, especially in the mornings
• Integrating timetables to deliver consistent headways along the spines (thereby spreading loads out more evenly)
• Introducing new local and orbital routes which may (my emphasis) reduce the numbers of people needing to travel through the city centre

In fact the original plan was to reduce the number of buses to/from the city centre across the network, and it took people power to reverse that.

With any network redesign there are going to be winners and losers - it's never going to be perfect.

There is now at last a piece on the BusConnects website on the C Spine launch.

BUT, I am still staggered that there are no simple explainers for places such as River Forest and Castletown that are losing their direct bus to the city as to how people should now make their journey.

At the very least I’d expect a combined hybrid timetable showing which buses to get and where to change and a clear map.

Many people don’t use journey planners or have online apps.

It will probably come as no surprise to many here that having looked at the potential connection locations and the full stop-by-stop timetables that the connections work and don’t work in equal measure.

I expect a lot of confusion about this, and anger when people have waits of 15-18 minutes for connections when once they had a direct bus!

Similarly all of the Express routes no longer serve Baggot Street or Waterloo Road, going via Pembroke Street and Leeson Street, but that certainly isn’t clear from any of the literature.

Plus, T-5 days away and I still have no idea how I’m supposed to know when to ask for the short fare!

If they are at the entrance to housing estates, how far could people have to walk to the entrance to the estate in the first place - sometimes stops might seem to be closer on the main road than they ought, but when you look at the potential walking distance from the furthest house in the estate to the entrance then it can be justified.

Some of the on-street information rollout for the changes tomorrow is now bordering on an absolute farce.

The NTA clearly have have not got a clue about how to do this properly, and have in my opinion zero quality control.

The best/worst that I’ve heard of so far is the new style TFI bus stop for southbound Dublin Bus routes on Westland Row being physically installed on the wrong side of the road (i.e. it is on the northbound side).

A map has been published on the website showing incorrect routings and the interactive map doesn’t work properly.

I am aware of one bus stop panel that has timetables for one spine route missing.

Far more importantly, no route descriptions are provided at all on the timetables at bus stops. Some stops have linear maps showing the routes, but the vast majority in the city centre don’t. This becomes all the more relevant by what follows.

Routes C1 & C2 have timetable panels inbound that very helpfully tell prospective passengers that the buses are heading “Towards St. John’s Church”, but nothing else. There are at least 11 churches that this could be in or around Dublin. Utterly useless info for anyone who isn’t aware that it’s in Sandymount.

Outbound the C3 is going “Towards Hayfield” on the timetable panels and the X25 “Towards Kingsbury” despite both terminating at the same stop in Maynooth. The X30 outbound timetables tell prospective customers that it goes “Towards The Paddocks Drive”. Useless info again. It’s actually Dodsboro in Lucan.

There are now two separate bus stops at stops numbered 400 and two numbered 7588 on Pearse Street with bus routes split between them, and similarly two stops numbered 350 on Townsend St.

There are two stops numbered 317 on Westmoreland St, a small distance apart, both labelled for the 26 and 70N. Which one is to use I don’t know.

All of the new N4 Express routes serve stop 7587 on Pearse Street, but the stop doesn’t indicate this at all. There is one exception, the X31 which for some unknown reason serves stop 400 instead. This means the X31 and X32 are shown as deviating from one another on the linear map at their terminus on Earslfort Terrace.

Neither of the stops opposite Pearse St Garda Station tell you where to go now instead to catch the new routes.

None of the timetable panels have any information about the new fares and I still am not sure when to go to the driver for the short fare. In fact when to go to the driver and when to use the right hand validator isn’t explained anywhere either.

Some regional/intercity routes have been branded on bus stop flags as being Dublin Bus routes.

Add to that, the last L59 on Saturdays leaves Hazelhatch at 23:28, two minutes before the last train from Heuston arrives at 23:30. That’s before we even talk about how some of certain connections have, at certain times of the day, either excessively long waits or are far too tightly timed, where people used to have a direct bus.

You could not make any of this up.

It is actually almost worse than the drastically poor information rollout of Network Direct phase 1 by DB twelve years ago - DB and GAI have upped their game significantly in this regard and a lot of this good work is now being undone by the NTA in this rollout.

Ideology has been put before basic practical customer information and there are so many mistakes in the information on street that it is shocking.

I am beyond angry at the level of incompetence on display here by the NTA. Utterly shambolic.

I don’t see any reason why timetables would not be adjusted In the future to meet demand. That’s essential for any public transport network.

But scheduling on the basis of even headways along the spines is definitely a good idea as it means a consistent bus service rather than the mismatch of services that are there now along most corridors.

As someone who had the misfortune to have to use the N4 routes inbound from Liffey Valley in a past life I can say that the 66/a/b were timetabled previously inbound so that a 66 and 66a travelled together from Leixlip, and then nothing happened for another 30 minutes before a 66 and 66b did the same. Two buses completely wasted. The 67 was timed closely to them from Lucan inwards. Which meant a shocking service for anyone along the corridor. That had to change.

I would imagine that Dublin Bus may keep some buses available for auxiliary departures in the mornings if they find they need them where the demand exceeds supply with the scheduled departures.

In my comments in my earlier post about a further BusConnects 2, I was really referring to further redesigning of routes, as I thought that was what bk was alluding to. I don’t see wholesale network changes across the network happening, but rather more localised route changes or extensions to meet new demands as they arise.

But I certainly see no reason tImetables will be cast in stone (and routes may have changes too if the rollout doesn’t go to plan).