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The future of the British monarchy after QE?

  • 14-11-2021 1:03pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,898 ✭✭✭✭


    What, do you reckon, is the future of the UK monarcy after Queen Elizabeth?

    She is missing events at the moment due to ill health which is leading to speculation over how ill she may be.

    You'd have to be very churlish not to acknowledge she handles the position with dignity and has been seen to be somewhat removed from the chaos that often accompanies the rest of the family. Her reaction to Diana aside she has been an exemplary representative.

    But do you think British attitudes to the monarchy may change more when she is gone?

    My own opinion is that it very well might because she was always kind of seen as an aloof rock of stability in the monarchy.

    What happens when that's gone?

    Time will tell but what do you reckon?

    Is the very future of the monarchy in doubt?



«13

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,123 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    She has come to dominate the brand, even become the brand. Given that she is dying, slowly maybe, the risk is that little is left after her demise.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,145 ✭✭✭Xander10


    The world won't stop turning.

    They will carry on as a tourist attraction.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Dunno, there's a kind inertia to the situation, I'd say it would take something like the Abdication Crisis to push them into changing their system.

    Charles isn't wildly popular but I think most people recognise he is a sincere guy, plus his reign likely won't last long.

    I'd say if Brit republicans could observe our farcial presidential elections up close for a few days they'd run screaming back to their constitutional monarchy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,926 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Regardless of how farcical you think our elections are at least the people get to decide.

    If the monarchy is to be abolished the people of the UK have no say on who their head of state is, one way or another.

    It requires an act of parliament and conveniently the monarchy itself has to be agreeable to abolishing itself and sign it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    When Liz passes (and I think it will be soon) then Charles will take over, I give him five years in the job just to show a steady hand at the controls before he steps aside and allows William to take the reins for the next few decades.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭screamer


    Embattled whilst they try to prove that Brexit is a success, the brits will cling to the monarchy for the nostalgia of “Great” Britain and so I don’t believe their monarchy is in jeopardy from the public.

    I had long thought Lizzie would abdicate in favour of Wills, and give it a chance to modernise, however she’s far too much of an old guard figure to have such radical ideas. Charles has shown he takes what he wants regardless the consequences, and he’s waited over 70 years for that crown.

    It will actually take for the royals themselves to say no more, we don’t want this life for their monarchy to end. Don’t see that happening for at least the next 2 generations anyways.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,123 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    I think that's likely.


    The one thing that is certain is that every option will have been looked at and planned on for years



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    I don't want a say over who occupies the purely ceremonial role of head of state, if we need to have one at all. I wish there was another way of doing it like sortition or nomination by something like the Council of State. Remember how De Valera treated the Governor General's office: picked some randomer who lived in the Dublin suburbs and was barely seen in public, just did the minimum required by the job; that would be my ideal presidency.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,926 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    You'd be happier in a monarchy. Good luck with that.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    QE11 is going nowhere soon. The vast majority of the Brits love her. She's adored by sections of NI. Also, she's as Stoic as they come and will be Queen for another 5-10 years, even if her public duties drastically decline. Charles (no spring Chicken himself) will step in as deputy, as he does currently.

    And don't expect a dashing Queen Consort Kate on the throne anytime soon. That's 20_25 years off.

    Incidentally, the same people who adore her in NI will hold their nose when Charles becomes their King. But, they'll do what they do best... suck it up.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    It would be a wise move to do that, however I wonder if we're going to see a period of time where the British Monarch is going always be elderly. If Charles lives as long as his parents have, William will be pretty old by the time he gets his turn...and so on...

    George VI was relatively young when he died (56) and that was after years of being a very popular war-time King. Then handing over to a very young Elizabeth gave the British monarchy a boost that it think it managed to ride all of these decades since. Passing the Throne between elderly men for the next 50-odd years might not help its survival.

    I also feel that Liz's end is near. I fully expect my news apps to explode with notifications in the middle of the night one day within the next year, if not soon after that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    A very scaled back monarchy, shorn of all the Windsors' flummery; yeah, I'd be happy with that. Haven't looked into it too much but some of the Scandinavian countries might be closer to my ideal of how it would work.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,338 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    I think the future is Charles will become king when his mother clocks off. She won’t abdicate because she made a promise on radio when she turned 21 to do the job for life. And there is little to no chance of Charles passing it to William because he’s the longest reigning(?) Prince of wales and he wants his turn.


    The British royal family has an extra generation where the other European royal families have young monarchs with young heirs(majority of them female) and the Europeans monarchies seem okay to abdicate, such as the Dutch queens since the early 20th century have done.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,123 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    She is dying, that's happening now.


    The monarchy is an essential part of English identity and will continue to be, especially working class English identity.

    Lot of people never understood that or why.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,567 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Short to medium term the monarchy is in good shape and will continue.

    Long term probably safe enough too barring some unforeseen catastrophic event.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    Over here in Norway, the monarchy is pretty minimal compared to the British version. There's a King, his head is on the coins, but apart from the National Day and a handful of other things you barely ever hear about him or his not-so-large family. Also the Norwegian royals are mostly self-financed with a couple of farms they run.

    Very much a low-hassle ceremonial figurehead for the state who rubber stamps government acts a-politically. Seems to work very well for them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 468 ✭✭Shao Kahn


    Sounds like they're completely unnecessary and things would function perfectly fine without them then?

    The Brits have Princess Charles, who will slot neatly into the spot when queen lizard-breath pops her clogs!

    I always thought they should have got a good taxidermist to stuff lady die, and roll her out for special occasions.

    I mean, would you really notice any difference? Most monarchs are practically inanimate objects anyway. They make some pointless public address, that is carefully crafted to mean nothing and offend no-one. You could just put an empty suit of armor next to them with a pre-recorded tape, and it would get the job done just as well. 😄

    "Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives, and it puts itself into our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." (John Wayne)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭NickNickleby


    not a fan, then? 😁

    I'm no fan of any monarchy myself, prefer an elected Head of State. But I wouldn't care if the office was abolished tomorrow.

    As for the British Monarchy, I think they really love their Royal Family and it will continue to exist. I suspect the opinion will be that once the Queen dies, sure its about time poor old Charles had a go. He'd probably be a safe pair of hands as he's totally non-controversial. Then the golden couple will step up to the mark and be beloved by all. So I don't think the British monarchy is in any danger.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    But doesn't the same go for a purely ceremonial elected president of our type? Most countries seem to find a need for someone at the top of the pyramid to sign the bills and cut the ribbons and all that, however they are chosen.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,026 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    I worry about her health. I noticed that people always die no more than 2 weeks apart from significant family members. My parents died 1 and 2 days from my DOB.


    Prince Philip died on April 9th, while Queen'a DOB is 21st of April. Today is Prince Charles' birthday. I wouldn't be surprised if we hear bad news soon.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 25 Mirafiori


    I don't think it is within her gift to pass the monarchy directly to William. That could only happen if, either before or upon her abdication, Charles declined the throne. Maybe that is what you meant - if so, apologies.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    What do you mean she is dying? If you are her physician you're breaking a plethora of rules divulging seriously private medical info.

    If you mean, she's a 95 year old woman and beyond a normal lifespan... Her mother lived to be 101. Elizabeth will get the VERY best medicine can offer. I wouldn't be going out buying a mourning suit any time soon. A sore back... and you're writing her off?! I see another 5 years easy - and I wouldn't bet against her outliving Charles.

    The working class in the UK are the least influential class, and are rule takers rather than makers. The working class have the most vested in the monarchy, they need that to feel 'great' as in 'Great Britain' - it makes living in a council flat all the more bearable I imagine. But, I don't disagree, I think the UK royals will be there at the end of the 21st century. Do I think they'll be there in 2/3 hundred years. Probably not, imho.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,926 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    There has been a huge shift in the space of 5 years in how the young think on this, with 41% favouring an elected head of state. I can only see that growing as we move into an era of Charles and a line of males succeeding to the throne. Also, if Charles succeeds with drive to ensure Camilla is called the Queen, support will go off a cliffedge.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Camilla will never be called Queen because she won't be a queen, same as Phillip was never called king.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    There's a difference. You can have a Queen consort, but you cannot have a King consort... how do I know this stuff 😄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Camilla would become "princess consort" not queen camilla.



  • Registered Users Posts: 468 ✭✭Shao Kahn


    Yes, you're quite right old boy...

    Living in a council flat, in some sh!thole part of the UK - in the dying vestiges of a once great empire - is made all the more bearable by keeping alive that dream you could one day drag yourself up by your bootstraps to become king / queen of your country!

    It's what we all dream of really!

    "Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives, and it puts itself into our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." (John Wayne)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,926 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    If reports are to be believed Charles is trying.

    It's an arbitrary system Timber, which can be changed. There is no such thing as royal/blue blood, you do know this I hope?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I think princess consort would be the more acceptable. BUT, she COULD be (and Charles will want) Queen Consort. Whether he gets his wish is another story. I think the UK public have been coming around to Camilla. I think the Crown series showed her in a good light.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Seems to me animosity towards CPB has faded over time. I'd say most people have come to accept that she is the woman Charles should have been married to all along and that she, Charles and Diana were victims of outmoded attitudes in the Royal Family. Would many people really care that much if she is called Queen?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Thinking everyone lives in "council flat, in some sh!thole part of the UK" is the same as thinking every Irish person lives in some shìtty village in the bog end of nowhere with the constant smell of slurry as company.

    But yeah, keep up the good work old chap you're nothing if not amusing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 468 ✭✭Shao Kahn


    Where did I say everyone lives in a council flat? 🤔

    "Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives, and it puts itself into our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." (John Wayne)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    It won't happen because the British public wouldn't allow it to happen, Charles knows this and its why when they married it was agreed that she would be known as Princess consort if/when Charles ascends the throne, it's the same reason why she's never been known as the Princess of Wales.

    When William ascends then Kate will be queen's consort and be known as Queen Catherine.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Charles has been playing the waiting game. He's much more than the Prince Charles of the 90s. He's already being deferred to when it comes to how the family act. He was involved in Prince Andrew's 'retiring' decision. If King Charles wants Camilla to be Queen Camilla who's going to say no?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,699 ✭✭✭Montage of Feck


    The slave begins by demanding justice and ends by wanting to wear a crown.

    -Albert Camus

    🙈🙉🙊



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭Immortal Starlight


    I think the future of the monarchy will be just fine. Nothing short of a nuclear bomb will root them out of their palaces and diamonds. The British public seems more than happy to have them although I can’t imagine why so it looks like they will be there always.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,344 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    QE really is a unifying force. The vast majority of Brits have never known another monarch.

    I wonder if her passing may lead to stronger independence movements in NI and Scotland as people lose a little of their sense of "Britishness"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,926 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    You are clearly buying into a very squeaky clean version of what is going on, where people are above reproach and promoting their own agendas. I suspect the skullduggery and positioning is a little bit more vicious than that behind the scenes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    If that's what you think then I can't help you other than say maybe do a little research and find out for yourself 🤷‍♂️



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    I'm not "buying" into anything, I'm giving my opinion on what I believe and nothing more.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Why not look and find out for yourself 🤷‍♂️



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,404 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    When she dies the UK will indeed stop turning, I'd expect 2 weeks of shut at least.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,338 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Based on what ? All the queens in Europe who aren’t the monarch are called queen of whatever country they are from. Now, whether with the Diana stuff that maybe like Camilla is technically the princess of wales but not refereed to it, then fair enough but when Charles becomes king Camilla will have the right to known as queen consort. And Charles doesn’t need to push anything either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,999 ✭✭✭bmc58


    The British people love them even though they own thousands of places in England that their predecessors took from the common people by force.They are like a virus that cannot be eradicated.It (the virus) has infected the English and will never be eradicated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,926 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Well, I disagree there Timber...not accepting that it is possible Charles is working behind the scenes trying to get Camilla referred to as 'queen' is buying into the official version.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr



    "Although technically Camilla should be Queen Consort when Charles succeeds his mother and becomes King, the couple have decided against that title. 

    Clarence House has previously confirmed that Camilla will not take on the title of Queen Consort and instead will be known as Princess Consort.

    This change was agreed at the time Charles and Camilla married in 2005 due to the controversial nature of their relationship following the death of Diana, Princess of Wales. 

    At statement released by Clarence House this year said: “The intention is for the Duchess to be known as Princess Consort when the Prince accedes to the throne. This was announced at the time of the marriage and there has been absolutely no change at all.”



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,644 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    From years of butting heads on all things British I think I already know that we will never agree on this Francie so I'll leave you to believe whatever you believe



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,999 ✭✭✭bmc58


    Have you not beed looking at the British news lately? Many missed/cancelled apperances at important events that she never missed.Elizabeth is seriouly ill ,inspite of the spin from Buckingham Palace.After all she is 95 years old and her time is coming to an end.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    But you know the answer already. Instead of the previous reply and further follow up would you not just prove your point?



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