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Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

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Comments

  • #12872
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117821929#Comment_117821929

    I could be wrong but did they not also catch over 400 cases with the testing? Even if it’s only 50% accurate surely it’s better than nothing, everyone I know back in London is using these once or twice a week and just living a normal life now, sounds good to me!



  • #12873
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,279 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822052#Comment_117822052

    Yeah, fair enough. I suppose we have competing versions of common sense: NPHET's version was "anti-gen tests won't stop mass gathering being superspreader events, so let's have neither antigen tests nor music festivals", and UK govt version is "return to normal whilst using all available tools to make it safer".

    Do I care much about music festivals being superspreader events? In 2020: yes; right now: not really.



  • #12874
    Royale with Cheese
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,369 ✭✭✭Royale with Cheese


    I'm just back from a weekend in Denmark, which has officially under half the rate of cases we do, and I'd point blank refuse to believe it has anything to do with the behaviour of either population. Life very much as normal over there. Busy shops, restaurants, bars, full metro service. Barely a mask in sight and heard a few people around me openly coughing and spluttering. I'd wonder is it just that people have stopped getting tested as much on the continent, whether that's because of antigen testing or just an attitude of we're all vaccinated now so why bother.



  • #12875
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117821527#Comment_117821527

    I don't like the premise that we're now calling it 'stupid' for vaccinated people to socialise in large groups.


    I just attended a festival in the UK. 50,000 people. Pubs and restaurants fully open, the premier league with full stadiums every weekend and yet the world isn't falling apart. Really makes you wonder what the point of it is in Ireland.



  • #12876
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,279 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822174#Comment_117822174

    Denmark are doing 4x the testing that we are, so that's not it. Their positivity rate is 1.5%.

    edited to fix bad stats



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  • #12877
    FishOnABike
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,857 ✭✭✭FishOnABike


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822052#Comment_117822052

    Whether it's good or not depends on how or in what context it is being applied. As an additional screening measure in an environment where people will be anyway e.g. healthcare worker, meat processing plant, school or college it will help reduce the number of CoViD-19 positive people who would otherwise be there.

    If it is used to facilitate something which people would not otherwise be doing it will add to the number of CoViD-19 positive people mixing, perhaps with a false sense of security, as it may be letting through as many people as it is catching.

    It could be used in the former case as an indicator requiring targeted PCR screening and / or temporary containment measures.



  • #12878
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,279 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822256#Comment_117822256

    I don't think anyone disputes that. The issue is whether a music festival (for instance) falls under "something which people would be doing anyway" at this stage in the pandemic when "88% of adults are now fully protected" (source: Paul Reid).



  • #12879
    techdiver
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,542 ✭✭✭techdiver


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117821783#Comment_117821783

    Now that is ultra bizarre! They accuse you of being irresponsible for doing more than they are doing? The group think around this stuff is unbelievable!



  • #12880
    Martina1991
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,548 ✭✭✭Martina1991


    Ireland doesn't use widespread antigen testing because it's use and performance is seriously limited. These tests do not perform to any acceptable standard for the purposes people want them to be used. Vaccines, hand hygiene and masks are of more use. It is not worth setting up another new testing strategy from scratch costing another billion euro for very little gain.

    It's not NPHET taking a huff against it. There is no real evidence to support it.

    https://blogs.bmj.com/bmj/2021/07/11/why-all-the-secrecy-around-innova-lateral-flow-tests/



  • #12881
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,190 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822241#Comment_117822241

    In the absence of anything more obvious, I think we have to look at the CTA with the UK as the most obvious cause of our high numbers.

    We always said that the reason zero covid couldn't work, was because both countries had to be on the same page. Which means that in essence we are a single epidemiological area and remain so even now.

    Or it could be down to travel in general; have Irish people been engaging in more travel than other countries?

    If that is the case, then we might actually see our case numbers start to improve as a result of schools coming back, and less people travelling in and out of the country.

    It's a noodle-scratcher alright though.



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  • #12882
    Toodles_27
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 184 ✭✭Toodles_27


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822299#Comment_117822299

    Absolutely - I was lost for words to be honest. Utterly bizarre stance.

    Also, when our other daughter tested positive 5 days later (again, caught by antigen at home 1st) and the contact tracer rang about her, she wanted to know if I knew where she could have picked it up….now, considering she was a close contact of 2 confirmed cases I would have assumed she would be ‘in the system’ - whatever that system is. Bewildering.



  • #12883
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,061 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822331#Comment_117822331

    It's hardly that bewildering, the contact tracing is never going to be 100% fool proof. For one thing, it relies on everyone being honest for it to function properly.



  • #12884
    shesty
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,917 Mod ✭✭✭✭shesty


    Can't figure it out at all to be honest.We have a high vaccination rate and yet it is still spreading quite a bit. I suspect the Government/NPHET can't really either.They have been doing a kind of "whack a mole" thing since last November - one week it's schools and playdates, 2 weeks later they are telling us too many people have gone back to workplaces, then it is young people going to several social events on one night while infected, now we are back to parents at the school gate being warned again.All of these at one point or another have been cited as the "reason" for cases "spreading"since last November.

    I have long lost interest in their many warnings at this stage.I take my own responsibility for what I can, and outside of that, I can't do much else.



  • #12885
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,061 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822404#Comment_117822404

    I think while it's still spreading, the difference is they are now confident that the spike will not become an out of control spiral into disaster. We have a spike, but we're nearing the peak or have already reached it.

    I've zoned out as well to be honest.



  • #12886
    FishOnABike
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,857 ✭✭✭FishOnABike


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822281#Comment_117822281

    Agree. It's just something that needs to be factored into the overall assessment.

    If the CoViD-19 prevalence is around 2% in the general population then a one off antigen test might reduce the prevalence to around 1% by excluding the half of the cases it does detect.

    400 CoViD positive out of 40,000 is better than 800, especially if that 400 are more likely to have a lower viral load. However the impact of the undetected 400 still needs to be taken into consideration.



  • #12887
    GooglePlus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭GooglePlus


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822404#Comment_117822404

    We've 10 times more in hospital with Covid now than we did this time last year, although it's safe to say that Delta is more transmissible and movement/gatherings are now less restricted across Europe and within Ireland. I wonder what the numbers would currently look like without vaccines and I wonder how things will fair out, considering we already have nearly 90% of adults fully vaccinated.

    A few short months ago, I would have expected the numbers to be bottomed with such a high vaccination rate but it seems that as we go on, our expectations are subtly reigned in and adjusted. If we had a crystal ball in 2020 and could see things now, I wonder how we might have changed our approach in all of this.



  • #12888
    JRant
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,157 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822404#Comment_117822404

    We are past the point whereby the government are lagging what the public are doing anyway and this has been the case for months now. Most people are just doing their own thing and getting on with life. Pubs not open - grand we'll have people around to the house for a few drinks. It's been going on so long now that it beggars belief we are at the end of August with so many restrictions still in place. People have decided that with vaccination they are going back to normal, regardless of what NPHET/government think.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • #12889
    greenheep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54 ✭✭greenheep


    I don't understand how Romania and Bulgaria aren't totally out of control with delta considering how far behind us they are with vacination



  • #12890
    muddypuppy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 322 ✭✭muddypuppy


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822241#Comment_117822241

    I don't know if this is the case for Denmark (but I think so), but Antigen testing really brings down the positivity rate elsewhere. The reason is that people seek PCR only when they feel bad, are a close contact, are referred by a GP etc... while you use Antigen testing to be able to go out if you're not vaccinated and just "to be sure", so there is a huge bias.

    As an example, yesterday Italy did 223.086 tests with a positivity rate of ~2.6%. This looks a lot better than Ireland, until you break it down by PCR and Antigen. Out of all the tests 81.254 were PCR tests with a positivity rate of 7.12%, and 141.832 were antigen tests with a positivity rate of 0.12%.



  • #12891
    shesty
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,917 Mod ✭✭✭✭shesty


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822543#Comment_117822543

    Their reporting may not be great.We may not be seeing a full picture



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  • #12892
    greenheep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54 ✭✭greenheep


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822591#Comment_117822591

    True but if their hospitals were bursting they wouldn't be able to hide it so it can't be that much of a disaster as per Italy in March 2020



  • #12893
    pawdee
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 558 ✭✭✭pawdee


    Just got this text from our daughter's school........

    "Unfortunately we have been informed of a positive case of covid 19 in your childs classroom. The HSE has deemed your child IS NOT a close contact and therefore no action is required at this time. We would appreciate greatly if you would be extra vigilant if your child shows any symptoms of Covid 19 and not to send your child to school if in doubt. Thanking you for your cooperation."

    I'd have thought that sitting in the same room as someone with covid would qualify you as a close contact? I suppose the HSE knows best.



  • #12894
    PTH2009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,284 ✭✭✭✭PTH2009


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822671#Comment_117822671

    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0830/1243606-coronavirus-ireland/



  • #12895
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822331#Comment_117822331

    All that would do is put people off from ever interacting with a contact tracer again. I’m finding the way this is being handled very poor. The vaccination programme has been excellent but beyond that the systems seem very patchy and illogical.

    If you take my niece for example, she returned to primary school this week and her parents had been expecting there to be simple measures like CO2 monitors in place.

    None of that is there yet and she’s been mentioning that ventilation is inadequate, they complained to the principal and we’re more or less told that she was suffering from school anxiety and they needed to cop on. There was widespread media coverage saying this would be in place. It isn’t. Why isn’t it? Who is responsible for why it isn’t? The school? The department? The principal didn’t seem to give a damn either way.

    It’s like the left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing and instead of logic being applied, it’s patronising or blind rule following by officialdom.

    I also had bizarre stuff like being asked for my phone number and name while sitting outside, along a river front on a windy day. This wasn’t even a terrace, just a seat on the quays and I’m fully vaccinated.

    I was thinking afterwards, if I had been flagged by that place as a close contact, it couldn’t have possibly made any sense as I was 3+ meters from anyone and in an extremely well ventilated outdoor area. So I’d be isolating for no reason if it came up.

    Then contrast that to calling into a hospital to collect a relative: phone call which went like “are you vaccinated? Yup! Have you been in contact with anyone with covid recently: nope. Have you any covid symptoms? Nope! Grand so, see you at 3pm then at ward such and such.”

    I'm hearing some people saying they’ve been asked for information at Irish airports, and others saying they walked through without anyone checking anything. That’s not the case going into France or Spain for example, documents are being checked consistently.

    It’s all very illogical and inconsistent from what I can see of it and the antigen testing position is highly out of step with the rest of Europe and North America.

    Why do a bunch of medics in what is a very small country think they know better than colleagues across the entire EU Abbas much of the planet? And yet, we accuse the British of island mentality exceptionalism anytime we see it…

    You can have a bunch of very draconian rules on paper, but having a system that is logical, smooth and most of all, consistent would be far more useful!



  • #12896
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,190 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    @pawdee wrote:

    I'd have thought that sitting in the same room as someone with covid would qualify you as a close contact? I suppose the HSE knows best.

    Nah, they have ways of assessing this, and based on last year it seemed to work pretty well. I know people were generally incredulous that two kids in a room all day wouldn't automatically be close contacts, but the data in general indicates that (somehow) kids don't spread it to one another as readily as the rest. I'm sure the mitigations in schools are also having some effect.

    There were a number of these every time schools returned last year. Kids who came straight off the plane from their holidays, into the classroom for a day, before being pulled back out again after a sibling/parent became covid positive. Whole class gets the standard "case of covid... not a close contact" email.



  • #12897
    Toodles_27
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 184 ✭✭Toodles_27


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822839#Comment_117822839

    The much talked about Co2 monitors that the DES have been proudly slapping each other on the back about still haven’t arrived in a good portion of schools. Certainly our primary and secondary school are still awaiting their arrival according to correspondence received from both schools last Friday.

    The secondary school purchased a very small amount of their own last year funded by the PTA.



  • #12898
    godzilla1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 435 ✭✭godzilla1989


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822543#Comment_117822543

    Or Ukraine or Poland or Czech

    Delta are all the cases there as well, but it's no issue.

    What's going on here is insane, myabe it will be a problem for them too eventually, but I personally think they have way more natural immunity which is way better as re-infections are very rare.



  • #12899
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822896#Comment_117822896

    That’s just absolutely incompetent, although to be fair, it’s exactly what I was expecting.

    There were the entire, very long Irish summer holidays to get this done and ready.

    They should be asking the minister to step down over something like that tbh.

    We’ve also had 3 incidents so far this year of a younger kid (6) coming home having sprayed or rubbed hand sanitizer into her eyes. The way it is being handled just doesn’t really make me think the mitigating measures are being planned or executed very well.



  • #12900
    godzilla1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 435 ✭✭godzilla1989


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822886#Comment_117822886

    What ways?

    Last year was Alpha, Delta is way more transmissible.

    It's airbourne and gets to you like passive smoking

    HSE still at March 2020 with wash your hands and keep 2 metres apart?



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  • #12901
    Space Dog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 664 ✭✭✭Space Dog


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117822543#Comment_117822543

    My friend is Romanian, she said you have to pay to get tested in Romania, even with symptoms. There are no free tests anymore, so people choose to not get tested -> low incidence rates.



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