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Do you have to disclose whether you’ve had vaccine?

245

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,959 ✭✭✭GerardKeating


    Would this then fall under the catagory of Secondary legislation?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Not really, existing SIs don't need legislating once they don't change. It's easy to do for transport and hospitality, far harder where people have a right to be educated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,195 ✭✭✭Ger Roe


    That is the big question for employers at the moment. They have a duty of care to both vaccinated and unvaccinated employees and in some circumstances the risk of infection might mean changes in employment conditions for either or both groups. It is going to be a long winter of court cases if the Gov doesn't get some guidelines out and back them up with advance legislation, if necessary. Not the 'announce it and see' approach that they have been doing, resulting in U -turns and late curtailed Dail debates to rush through necessary retrospective laws.

    To be clear, I am not saying what way the decision should come down on vaccination in the workplace, but some decision needs to be made and backed up - one way or another, otherwise employers and employees are in for a hard stressful time in hard stressful times.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    It seems to be wait and see but for now vaccination is not a requirement to return to wok. Leo, the relevant minister, doesn't want to get involved in it if he can help it. We're also looking at winter from a current dynamic environment of high vaccination rates and a fairly high disease prevalence. It may be very different in 4 weeks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,236 ✭✭✭mcmoustache


    They can ask but you have no obligation to tell them. The school is still obliged to accommodate your child. Schools will want to create as safe an environment as is possible so will likely segregate the vaccinated kids from those who's status is unknown or withheld. At worst she'll be sat near kids of people who don't vaccinate their kids for bad reasons as well as those who don't vaccinate them for good reasons like yourself so all in all, I wouldn't worry too much.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    What is this, a throwback to US segregationist times? I see a whole pile of legal cases in this approach never mind what the DES would do to a school.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,368 Mod ✭✭✭✭RacoonQueen


    If someone doesn't want to/doesn't disclose if they've had a vaccine or not, I would assume that means they haven't got it. So you're answering the question anyway by not disclosing. If you've had the vaccine you are just going to say you've had it. You'd have no reason to not disclose.

    I don't believe she's 'obliged' to disclose though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Someone might also believe that it's none of anybody's business. Getting a vaccine does not bring with it a requirement to share it with the world.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,368 Mod ✭✭✭✭RacoonQueen


    I'd be very surprised if many people who are getting vaccinated would think like that. Very normal small talk at the minute is 'did you get your vaccine yet?'. Most people won't think twice before asking this, I've actually had to stop people in work from asking it, they assume everyone is ok with getting vaccinated and don't see the problem with just asking as part of a normal, friendly conversation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Not my experience of small talk, people have moved on from COVID in every form. I really have no idea how many people of my acquaintance have been vaccinated nor would I ask nor expect to be asked.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 217 ✭✭ohnohedidnt


    Aren't we all lucky that there wasn't more people like you around when the "perfectly safe" Pandemrix swine flu vaccine was being rolled out. Imagine how many kids would have suffered if they were to be denied an education unless they took it.



  • Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I have been vaccinated to get into some countries. I also get vaccines at work, who keep a record of my vaccinations.

    Work also keep records on the covid vaccination status of employees.

    I agree the only people who have an issue saying if they have a vaccine are people who are not vaccinated.

    They don't have to, it's not mandatory, but in general people who have vaccines don't have an issue saying they do.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Not always that clear cut. Some may have issues with the type of segregationist proposals that some posters are suggesting.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,821 ✭✭✭quokula


    The vast vast majority of people who are vaccinated don’t have the twisted conspiracy theorist worldview of people who refuse to be vaccinated and can therefore see the value in institutions like schools having that information so they can accommodate everyone and keep them safe more effectively.

    Sure, there will be some vaccinated people who want to keep it a secret for some reason, but if someone refuses to say it’s almost certainly because they have decided not to get it and have some weird ideological opposition to it.

    And people who haven’t been vaccinated for genuine reasons will almost certainly want to disclose it because they’re the ones being put most at risk by the irresponsible and will want the school to help protect them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,435 ✭✭✭bladespin


    I’ve been vaccinated but would refuse to disclose if asked in an official capacity (most know unofficially anyway), it’s private and confidential information, where do you draw the line on what information you give away.

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  • Posts: 14,769 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Have you shown your cert to enter a bar/restaurant, or do you plan never to enter one again?



  • Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Does that mean you won't go to a restaurant or pub yet? Not that there's anything wrong with not going! Just wondering.

    confidential information about my vaccinations are also the business of my employer, im front line and there was enough moaning and complaining to get all front line vaccinated, it's fair enough. wouldn't be sure about other employers though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,435 ✭✭✭bladespin


    I didn’t go to many to begin with but have happily shown the cert, there’s a law requiring this, it’s not voluntary disclosure, there’s a big difference between that and an employer or school asking for information they’re not legally entitled to ask for, if it’s law then fine, if not then no.

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  • Posts: 14,769 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You have no problem sharing private confidential information, along with your name/number to have a pint, but you wouldn’t want to share it with your employer/school where you spend more time, come in close contact with more people?

    There is no law requiring you to go to a bar, if you do not want to share your confidential medical information.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭Multipass


    I’ve been vaxxed, but I don’t want to live in this new dystopian society where such a question is even considered. F@€k all of that, that’s why I won’t answer. And no, I don’t show a pass either, though I’ve taken a lot of pleasure in eating in, and going for drinks in places where no-one is taking any notice of this stupidity.



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  • Posts: 14,769 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Did you object to being asked for ID to show you were above the legal age to drink? It’s not dystopian, what rubbish. Lots of us enjoyed drinking in bars where ID wasn’t checked, when we were kids.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,500 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    I think it is abhorrent of someone to try and compare getting a vaccine during a pandemic to racist segregation, the people that do this are absolute tosspots with no idea of history or what suffering really means. "ooh, I can't eat inside a restaurant because I won't take a free vaccine, I'm Rosa Parks", childish imbeciles.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    It is but it is also equally abhorrent to suggest that an education system should use some form of segregation of children because of a vaccine status. There is a middle ground in this which is becoming increasingly deserted.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Some people have a clearly defined sense of privacy, no conspiracies or anything else. That is their right.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,500 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    No, it's not "equally" abhorrent, either own your statement and keep digging or retract it, you'll be forever known as the poster conflating their first world problems with racist segregation of black people. Your move.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    It's a proposal for segregation and I see the analogy, you clearly and strongly disagree just as I strongly disagree with the proposal in the first place, but we move on.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,500 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    You've climbed down from "equally" to "analogy", but won't retract, that's fine, you get to own that analogy forever more, just don't be taken aback when you're brought up on it in the future.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,435 ✭✭✭bladespin


    No, as said, if they’re legally entitled to ask then fine but I’m not for volunteering if I don’t want to, walking into a restaurant is my choice but in the workplace it’s not, they’re overstepping by asking imo, no problem showing the Cert if I go for lunch with my boss etc but I’m not going to make a declaration if I don’t have to.

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,993 ✭✭✭FileNotFound




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 383 ✭✭Unicorn Milk Latte


    Interesting. I was wondering if vaccinated people mind disclosing, or if it's mostly the unvaccinated.

    I'm strongly privacy minded, to a degree where I stopped using Facebook and Instagram, and use DuckDuckGo instead of Google, and gmail exclusively as a spam catcher account. But I would have zero issue with telling anyone that I'm vaccinated for Covid - or for Tetanus or Polio, for that matter.


    One important thing to consider is the motivation for asking. I would imagine that the motivation for a school to ask is that they have the safety of kids in mind, and are looking for pragmatic ways to keep kids safe.



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