Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all,
Vanilla are planning an update to the site on April 24th (next Wednesday). It is a major PHP8 update which is expected to boost performance across the site. The site will be down from 7pm and it is expected to take about an hour to complete. We appreciate your patience during the update.
Thanks all.

Climate Change is Normal and Welcome in My Opinion

123457

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,118 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    Exactly! Everyone keeps talking about studies this studies that. The studies will say what ever the money wants them to say.

    If the government felt that climate change was a problem, they would introduce policies that would force electricity supply companies to reimburse homeowners with solar panels/private windmills for the surplus electricity they give back to the grid. But they don't, despite this being in complete contravention of the EU Clean Energy policy.

    And yet the government, via RTE, choke us to death with this climate change fearmongery on a daily basis. It is just incredible.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,187 ✭✭✭Andrewf20


    Hysteria is higher because of recent trends in the data worldwide. The making of energy (for our consumption generally) is considered a leading reason for global temperature increases. Cars are a subset of that. I have to admit that I am also suspicious about the electric car thing. I have a gut feeling they are far more dirty than we are led to believe. However - cat converters reduce emissions but they don't eradicate them. I think more people are driving today than 40 years ago and they are also driving more.

    You still havent answered the question. What if you are wrong about the causes of climate change and that it is actually getting critical & it is primarily driven by humans. Where's the contingency?



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,187 ✭✭✭Andrewf20


    I think its serious if the scientists do. But there could be other forces at work here. I.e. The psychology of a politician who will more than likely have their own self interests at heart which is keeping their job. I dont think the politicians could stomach implementing radical change because they know the electorate wont take it either.

    To consume less, we basically need to become much poorer. Imagine the riots if fuel prices doubled and clothes and other items were tripled in price. Then you would have to deal with huge job losses on a massive scale.

    And this is why I reckon we are screwed. We have become too used to a comfortable lifestyle which demands heavy levels of energy consumption and we are not will to compromise it in any real way.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    Catalytic converters don’t get rid of CO2. particulate matter or NOX.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    The conservation of energy law dictates that energy cannot be created or destroyed it merely changes form.

    The IPCC recently put out a report saying human activities have caused climate change , they reviewed 14000 scientific papers and have concluded that this is unequivocal.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    this may help to inform on some of concepts around the IPCC report.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,216 ✭✭✭Shoog


    Opinions are like assholes everyone has one. Meanwhile there are facts and the facts tell us we are heading into big trouble with climate change. What the opening commenter thinks is fortunately irrelevant to reality where climate change is happening.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,673 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    There is no shortage of clean breathable air. Do you spend your life kneeling behind idling buses with your face half a metre from their exhaust? Most of the population don't live in Dublin. Ireland has substantial wind over most of the country for significant periods, which is why wind turbines work. Vehicle exhausts don't hang around long before they are blown off to the Uk and Europe.

    There is an air quality monitoring station near Carna in Connemara, that consistently records the cleanest air anywhere in Europe.

    I live in the countryside and the wind blows most of the time and the air is always pristine. If you live somewhere where you can occasionaly detect a whif from vehicles, just remember it was those eco stupid Greens who had legislation passed to try and tax nice clean CO2 from petrol powered vehicles out of existence in favour of NOX and carcinogen laden diesels. BY far the largest component of a petrol vehicles exhaust is H2O. For each litre of petrol burnt you get about 990g of water in the form of vapour.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,727 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk



    Air quality can get bad in many parts of Ireland not just Dublin.



  • Registered Users Posts: 733 ✭✭✭Heraclius


    Papers on climate change are published in academic journals every day for peer review. I'd say you (or those with views like you) could try to publish your papers too. If there's solid evidence that human emissions aren't changing the climate the world will be delighted.

    The bad news for you is that even the fossil fuel industry is moving on from denying there's a problem to claiming there's no solution.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty




  • Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx




  • Registered Users Posts: 19,673 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    I have a close family member who is a scientist who lectures at a university. She basically said the way anthropogenic global warming had been politicised meant science and the scientific method was esentially dead. You get the apparent massive consensus because research funds allocation works on a faulty model in that funds go to proposals that are likely to support the accepted narrative and status quo and applications proposing contrarian views won't get a look in.

    Then there is the cancel culture whereby academics who have expressed disbelief in the Global Warming theory have been attacked with calls for their sacking in many instances, making many academics fearful of expressing negative opinions openly. Academic institutions value their image and prestige above all else.

    This family member doesn't believe in anthropogenic global warming. She went over some of the seminal papers and arguments and was horrified at the open manipulation of ground station temperature measurements where the data was altered to fit the narrative, which is why the individuals involved famously refused to publish the raw data.

    A scientist speaking out against the AGW religion needs the courage/stupidity of someone trying to speak up for a witch and against the church and the burning of witches in general - if the mob didn't tear the contrarian limb from limb, or lash them to a stake and burn them alongside the accused witch first, the church would have stepped in and done it.

    There may be apparent near 100% consensus among climate scientists, but that is not the case with scientists from all disciplines.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,673 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    You realize that if the cold still winter nights mentioned are frequent or significant, then that is a very good argument against the ipracticality of heavy reliance on wind power?



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,727 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    I was just making the point it can get pretty bad in different parts of Ireland, not just Dublin, I don't know anything about wind power and how it works tbh



  • Registered Users Posts: 733 ✭✭✭Heraclius


    It is a fair bit harder to spoof science journals than social science journals. If there was serious evidence that humans do not influence the climate by producing greenhouse gases it would be shouted from the rooftops because it would allow us to carry on as we are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 733 ✭✭✭Heraclius


    Taking your points in sequence:

    Can you be sure of that or do you just feel that? Atmospheric physics is a hard science.

    The IPCC report has estimates of the size of our influence actually. It gives a tighter estimate than before of the impact of a doubling of atmospheric CO2 above pre-industrial levels for example. The impact of doubling CO2 is estimated at between 2.5oC and 4oC.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,399 ✭✭✭dalyboy


    I agree with everything you said except where your relative said that scientific method is dead. What your relative probably said is that scientific consensus (peer review) is dead as it’s become politicised and toxic resulting in bully-boy tactics being applied to attain a desired goal.

    The scientific method is a different animal altogether. The results of testing in the scientific method are 100% irrefutable and determine without a doubt a cause and effect to what’s being tested.

    To date there has NEVER been one study regarding man made climate change that incorporates the scientific method. Obviously the reason for that is we would need a second earth/planet to apply the method to engage the testing of variables.

    So what we are left with is a bunch of opinions formed from observations and these opinions are being gathered under duress and fear of career cancellation if they’re not part of the echo chamber of climate doom and gloom.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1




  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1




  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    You see this is another example of people not being properly informed. Fine if you live under a dome sealed of from all the rest of the world then you don't have to worry about anything but your own emissions.

    If combustion engines where 100% efficient then they would only put out water and CO2, but there not, there nowhere near that in fact. There is a reason why all diesel vehicles now require AD blue or rely on exhaust gas recirculation tech and its not because they allow the engines to run better. Water vapour is not the cause of climate change CO2 is and there are more petrol vehicles in the world than diesel.

    We are in this mess because humanity still relies on digging up dead fish and dinosaurs for energy.

    If you believe the greens are to blame for amount of diesels vehicles on the roads then your are miss-informed have you not heard of the diesel gate, governments all across the world were duped by car manufacturers.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,673 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Due to the aforesaid cancel culture, I am not saying.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1




  • Registered Users Posts: 19,673 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    No: higher up the ladder than that. Real science, where you get to propose hypothsies which are subject to experimentation with the results open to analysis and verification.

    Climatology is a science in the same way that economics is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,118 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    You don't need to be a climatologist to see how fudged the numbers are



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    So a physicist then or perhaps a meteorologist eh? Climatology is a real science go ask nasa. Economics is not a science and nobody ever claimed it was.



  • Registered Users Posts: 555 ✭✭✭tim3000


    You have yet to answer the questions I put to you in a previous post. Do you agree that humans are pumping millions of tonnes of carbon into the atmosphere?

    Your assertion that nature is a perfect balanced system goes along way towards explaining your world view. You seem set on the assumption that nature if left will sort out this mess. However what you fail to grasp or deliberately ignore is that nature cannot adapt to this specific scenario as fast as we are creating it. We are destroying the means that nature would employ to scrub co2 from the atmosphere while we emit GHG.

    I must remind you that perfect symbiotic systems are in fact more prone to destruction as they are so finely tuned. Nature can go off balance, the Permian-Triassic as a classic case in point. A volcano in Siberia belched millions of tons of this "harmless and inert" Carbon Dioxide into the atmosphere.

    This harmless and inert gas then acidified the oceans causing a mass extinction of marine life. It took nature millions of years to rebound from this great dying. Are you noticing a similarity here?

    There is plenty of proof about the correlation of co2 levels and temperature increases. This is an extremely well understood relationship.

    Pumping co2 into this delicately balanced system must have an effect, if not climate change then what? By your own logic It can't remain static as it is perfect.

    Also in relation to the proliferation of humans not damaging this perfect harmony you seem to thing nature has. On every continent that humans have expanded to, our ancestors he driven to extinction nearly all the megafauna that lived alongside them. This is a salient example of how humans can proliferate to the throw a system off balance.


    I wouldn't be bothered watching such propaganda as that.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 48,282 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    as the saying goes; chemists defer to physicists, physicists defer to mathematicians, and mathematicians defer only to god (but good luck finding a mathematician humble enough to admit that)



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,187 ✭✭✭Andrewf20


    At the end of the day, these arguments could go around in circles for the next 30 years. The fact that there is an argument in the first place is indictive of the real possiblity that man made climate change is a real issue.

    If there is no contingency planning for this possibly, your argument falls very short. If you are wrong, the consequences will be horrific and possibly irreversible.



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,118 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    The only propaganda here is the climate alarmism. We never hear any opposition to this so how is the video propaganda?

    Yes, I believe humans are emitting carbon dioxide into the atmosphere. Why shouldn't we? You talk as though humans are an alien life form destroying a planet that would have been otherwise great without us. Whether the earth likes us or not, we are part of it no matter what. We came from the earth, we use materials that come from the earth and then we go back to the earth at the end. There is nothing we can do that can irreversibly damage the system that we are part of.

    What about animals, they emit carbon dioxide too? And natural forest fires, and volcanoes and the oceans themselves emit carbon dioxide at an enormous rate. Human impact is a drop in the ocean.



Advertisement