Suicide Squad Sequel

silverharp · 10-08-2021 05:59PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117733102#Comment_117733102

the main counter to you points are that all film genres are cyclical , Film Noir , Westerns etc. if the trend was similar then you would start entering the deconstruction/reimagining phase to which films like Logan and Joker fit the bill. There will still be plenty of films made , they just wont be as significant. If you wait around long enough you might even get remakes lol.

Acosta · 10-08-2021 06:20PM

Perfect copies of it leaking online are also going to hurt it at the box-office.

I enjoyed it, but wasn't blown away. I was looking forward to it because of Gunn directing. Not a patch on either of the Gaurdians movies, but well worth the watch.

pixelburp · 10-08-2021 06:24PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117734199#Comment_117734199

Notwithstanding we're arguably taking about a remake of sorts here, we already saw the remake part of the cycle with the Sony Spider-Man films rebooted with Andrew Garfield. Though in that case it was more IP protection from a studio that had another breathing down its neck.

I don't subscribe to audience fatigue either TBH. The MCU has created its own niche in cinema history, one that kinda circumvents the usual talk of genre cycles. The MCU is the only TV Show in cinema. It exists outside the principles of genre cycles IMO.

Where I think the conversation becomes more accurate instead IMO is the market is saturated by others trying to be the MCU. And failing; Hollywood was always the race to be second after all. Even DC had become wedded to aping the MCU, til it started taking this Anything Goes approach when audiences said no.

The Phantom Pain · 10-08-2021 09:58PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117733584#Comment_117733584

I don't think the millions of people who lost their lives to this pandemic would agree just so you can have what you perceive to be more "interesting" films.

Also, there are more of those smaller films being made than ever before. You just have to find them. Mark Kermode frequently covers them.

Fysh · 10-08-2021 10:49PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117735100#Comment_117735100

There is a distinct hum of badly telling your nan how to suck on ovarian dietary elements to telling a poster like johnny that he can find out about small films by watching or reading some Mark Kermode reviews... Are you also going to tell him about a small fanzine called Empire that also offers some good suggestions for lesser-known fare? ;)

You may not agree with him, but the issue of opportunity cost in film (both in production/distribution budget and in terms of available exhibition slots) and the functional disappearance of the mid-budget film as a format from many studios is a reality of the industry over the last couple of decades. It's one thing for a single blockbuster tentpole film to generate profits that can go into a number of projects, some of them smaller/more personal/riskier/whatever, but another when the tentpole films mainly fund further tentpole films.

johnny_ultimate · 10-08-2021 11:23PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117735100#Comment_117735100

I am not for one second suggesting the pandemic hasn’t been (and still is) a human catastrophe of major and devastating scale, so please don’t accuse me of doing so. We’re in a film forum talking about its impact on film-going, a minor but interesting and developing side chapter of an extraordinary period of history.

It is a fact that a side effect of the past 18 months has been an unprecedented and ongoing disruption of the existing Hollywood business model. Personally, I believe that was a model long overdue a shake-up given a small number of corporations’ and indeed franchises’ dominance of multiplexes, pushing smaller films ever further to the fringes or in many cases streaming platforms. Many great and well-established filmmakers have expressed their frustration at how inflated budgets have made smaller projects more difficult to usher to life. If a few $200m flops encourage studios to do new things or perhaps just scale back a little from hyper-expensive mega blockbusters focus-grouped to within an inch of their life… I simply feel that’d ultimately be beneficial in the long-term for audiences and filmmakers alike. If an MCU film is less of a guaranteed hit, for example, then it could provoke a shake-up and new approaches to draw bored or simply reluctant audiences back.

This is intended as no insult whatsoever to people who enjoy franchise or superhero films - hell, I enjoyed The Suicide Squad as a funnier, cruder and more colourful take on your average superhero blockbuster! I’m simply stating that I believe mainstream film on the whole would be in a healthier place creatively if the budgets weren’t so inflated (and therefore ‘too big to fail’) as that IMO limits the types of stories and styles being explored. The last 18 months have been unspeakably awful for so many people, and there’ll be all manner of long-term debilitating consequences for art and business alike. But there’ll also be opportunities to maybe do things better in the future too - and that’s certainly not confined to cinema.

And yes I’m 100% aware there are a plethora of great smaller films being released, as I watch as many of them as I possibly can. They’re just increasingly shunted off to independent and arthouse screens (in many cases, not even those) while the latest ‘tentpole’ releases dominate more and more screens.

The Phantom Pain · 10-08-2021 11:41PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117735353#Comment_117735353

I actually wasn't necessarily suggesting that he locate them by watching Kermode's shows; I was more highlighting the frequency of such films as he seemed to be making out as if just by having these big studio tentpole movies that we are being deprived of the oh so superior smaller budget indies.

The Phantom Pain · 11-08-2021 12:09AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117735492#Comment_117735492

That's not what I said, is it?

"TBH, if the pandemic puts an end to ‘too big to fail’ $200m blockbusters as the norm… that’s not a bad thing."

"It is a fact that a side effect of the past 18 months has been an unprecedented and ongoing disruption of the existing Hollywood business model."

Noting a side effect of the pandemic as a positive when it pertains to something as trivial as film entertainment is tone deaf and icky.

Also, what does "healthier place creatively" even mean? You do realise these are entirely subjective opinions? The industry is not going to shift to cater to your needs. The tentpole releases dominate more screens because they have mass appeal, get over it. The fact of the matter is these big budget movies you despise are entertaining more people, more specifically the family household. And the idea that a big budget automatically limits the styles and stories being explored is absolute rubbish and demonstrably false.

kerplun k · 12-08-2021 11:16PM

First time going to the cinema in about 2yrs.... yaaaay.

Now onto the film. Jeez, that was a mixed bag, it was definitely an experience,

On one hand the film was beautiful but on the other it was gross. People in my showing actually walked out and I can see why. Maybe it’s my age or the fact that I haven’t been to the cinema in such a long time, but I felt a bit nauseous at some of the more gory bits and the third act gave me a bit of trypophobia.

It was all a bit gratuitous as well, it definitely could have been scaled back without compromising it.

I don’t want to say too many bad things about this because I did enjoy, but when I was watching I just kept thinking about those old James Gunn tweets that got dragged up from about 10yrs back, Gunn has a shock/gross out, edgy, sense of humour, and it's not always necessarily funny. I think with GoTG he found his sweet spot, but here he seems to have reverted to his earlier style. TSS lacks the swagger of GoTG and unfortunately the humour falls a bit flat, it does land in parts, but not enough to cover some of the more off colour jokes that just came across as a bit icky.

10 minutes into this I got a reminder of one of the reasons why I love the cinema and that’s because of the sound. The score in this is awesome, it’s been 2 years since i could watch something with the volume cranked all the way up and not have to worry about lowering anything down because it gets too loud. No babies to worry about, no neighbours, not worrying about anyone in my living space... just take in the glorious sounds, every explosion, every crash, bang and wallop. Deadly.

You have to applaud Gunns visual style, it’s zany, it’s unique and it’s worth the admission alone. I also think this was margot robbies best outing as harley quinn but I’m thinking WB are probably starting to realise MR/HQ isn’t the golden goose they thought she was.

overall, it was just great to get to the cinema again. 😀

orecir · 13-08-2021 02:08PM

Shocked how poor this was, especially with James Gunn directing.

Went with two mates and we were all disappointed. The first one was better.

Fysh · 13-08-2021 05:36PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117747641#Comment_117747641

Out of curiosity, what did you like better about the first than this one?

I thought Ayer's effort was an alright action film let down by some very jumbled editing (itself the result of being forced to cut the planmed ending very late in production), but I can't think of anything I would say it did better than Gunn's film.

orecir · 13-08-2021 07:06PM

It was far too cartoony for my liking and the humour felt very forced in places.

Also Elbas character was basically Will Smiths from the original in all but name. Smith is a far superior actor for me also.

Film needed to drop at least 30 mins of runtime.

santana75 · 13-08-2021 08:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117747641#Comment_117747641

Thought I was the only one who preferred the first one

kerplun k · 13-08-2021 09:51PM

Shout out to John Murphy. The music was brilliant. I haven’t stop listening to the OST on my Spotify today. The music blended with some of Gunns visuals was a real highlight for me.

Fysh · 13-08-2021 11:20PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117749125#Comment_117749125

Thanks for replying :)

I think the cartoonishness actually made it work better for me. The premise is a bit daft and wouldn't stand up to something like the po-faced seriousness Snyder's films aim for, so for me leaning into the oddness meant that it all felt internally consistent. I can see it being a bit of a struggle if if doesn't work that way for you, though.

Elba's character is very obviously a do-over of Smith's, although personally I preferred Elba's version. Smith's version didn't really land for me, it was a bit too Yes He's A Contract Killer But He's Lovely Really Because He Cares About His Daughter for me. Gunn's more abrasive and gruff take on the same basic character arc felt more believable to me, but I'm sure part of that is because I like Elba more than Smith as an actor.

Oddly enough watching it I didn't feel the film was over-long but thinking about it now, I might find it dragging a bit a second time around. I definitely enjoyed the Big Bad fight in the new film more than Ayer's, again partly because it leaned into the cartoonish weirdness.

pixelburp · 14-08-2021 07:23AM

I loved the final fight so much. Not just that it wasn't a sky beam but it felt like a properly defined fight with immediate stakes, while its heroes had a purpose within the scuffle. Everyone brought something to the table and Waller's pick of the team made sense in the end. And just the idea of the big bad being an accidental nemesis was such a good change. The javelin's ultimate purpose also a bookend deserving of a chef's kiss...

The starfish zombies were gross, real body horror stuff but Starro itself just wanted to go back to the stars, píssed off at humanity for its torture. Its last, dying line was kinda heart breaking and I didn't expect to feel genuine sympathy for the last act antagonist; a giant starfish. That was the genius of this script - frequent, genuine heart within the outlandish gore.

And the tone just sat better than the chaos of the first film. You could really tell Ayer's film was meant to be much grittier, more akin to Synders films than the forced goofball style wedged in by the marketing company who actually cut the final film. Gunn's approach felt much more consistent, and properly, playfully subversive this time. The competitive killing scene possibly the highlight there - whose punchline had me in stitches. Not to mention the frequent "mother vision" moments. The earlier attempt had that self-serious earnestness that never gelled, never came together and has sagged the mainline DC films. That constant attempt to ignore how silly everything was; Gunn understood the natural incongruity of superheroics and leaned in.

Plus if you want a good example to compare a good way versus bad, the needle drops between the previous version and this one is night and day. The difference between a hammer and a scalpel.

The run time was an issue mind you; the midpoint lagged a little as Harley's solo scenes killed the pace a tad (but then, her big John Wick set piece was fantastic so wouldn't want to lose it), ditto the night club one; but I was never bored, never irritated by the contrivance or attempts at humour. I said in my original comment this film was knowingly stupid; it had an identity, a voice and personality.

James Gunn should run the DC stable IMO, not Zack Snyder. Go full R rated insanity; The Boys without the nihilistic, adolescent cynicism. But alas, the financial failure of this film means we're unlikely to see another one like it.

EoinMcLovin · 17-08-2021 06:35PM

https://twitter.com/screenrant/status/1427265228316807176?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1427265228316807176%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=

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givyjoe · 17-08-2021 06:45PM

Genuinely don't understand why so many people like this film, thought it was absolute garbage from beginning to (mostly) end. Worse than the first one.

silverharp · 17-08-2021 09:22PM

given the Dr who actor in it, had the thought that the whole starfish malarkey would have made a good xmas Dr Who

Gwynplaine · 19-08-2021 09:42AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117768376#Comment_117768376

Thanks for the heads up, the first one was atrocious.

Sad Professor · 19-08-2021 08:15PM

I had very low expectations for this and ended up really enjoying it. Definitely the James Gunn of Super rather than Guardians. The trailers don't do it justice and make it seem like more of the same but really this is what the first film should have been.

Jump_In_Jack · 24-08-2021 02:48PM

I felt it was overly long, too gory for a child, yet too dumb for an adult. I'm sure there will be plenty of people that will enjoy it though, just not for me.

The Phantom Pain · 24-08-2021 03:11PM

Interesting. ^^^

I wonder why a film like Deadpool connects with audiences but not The Suicide Squad . Deadpool has a lot of goofy stuff in it but there isn't the same undercurrent of negativity. It also has a higher cinemascore.

24-08-2021 03:29PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117797783#Comment_117797783

I think its because Deadpool is truly an adult film, and adults truly have the money to go see it and even go and rewatch it in the cinema

Foxtrol · 24-08-2021 04:07PM

People have an attachment to Deadpool whereas this was an ensemble movie with nearly all the characters are completely disposable.

I enjoyed this movie but it was missing Gunn's normal quality of getting you to care about the characters. It was a cool idea to bring out all these characters that basically no one has heard of but when you're introducing so many you end up with gore for the sake of it.

The Phantom Pain · 24-08-2021 05:17PM

I guess the film conditions you not to get attached to characters because you know they'll likely die.

pixelburp · 24-08-2021 05:51PM

It's an interesting compare and contrast I suppose in the rare field of R rates superhero films. Deadpool was a definitive comedy complete with gags, punchlines and puns, with occasional splatter;, whereas the humour in Suicide Squad was often drawn from its brazen vulgarity and gore. It pushed itself as transgressive IMO. I think the former was an easier sell. And the brand of Ryan Reynolds probably drew in the casual curious, whereas I still maintain the literal, titular closeness of this sequel to the maligned original was a mistake.

Slydice · 16-01-2022 02:33AM

Gave this a watch. It did feel like a Suicide Squad film.. but.. somehow.. it also felt like it dragged on a bit. Wierd.

It did feel like it delivered on what it promised and ticked all the Suicide Squad boxes.

If anything, it felt like it lay the groundwork for a vicious sequel..

Waller, I am guessing, needs to re-establish that she's in charge.. although with the Peacekeeper setup.. it looks like Warner Bros might want to take the whole thing in a softer funnier direction.

One stand out performance in the film was Alice Braga. I was like.. she needs to be in a predator film immediately!.. and then I checked and remembered she was in Predators and I don't have any bad impression of her performance there too. I checked what else she's been in since then .. not much that I've seen: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0103797/

Feels like she should have gotten more actioney roles. She totally reminds me of the lead alongside Arnie in the running man.. who was Maria Conchita Alonso.. who.. hah 🙂 now that I check turns out was in Predator 2 😀: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000744/

Suicide Squad Sequel

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