€22 million in fees claimed on single medical card

skimpydoo · 26-06-2021 9:23pm #1

This is rather shocking how can this be allowed to happen, whilst those who deserve a medical card are waiting to get one.

https://twitter.com/wereontheditch/status/1408717225423409154?s=20

Eduard Khil · 26-06-2021 9:27pm

Not a very reputable sauce

Ninthlife · 26-06-2021 9:29pm

skimpydoo wrote: »

This is rather shocking how can this be allowed to happen, whilst those who deserve a medical card are waiting to get one.

https://twitter.com/wereontheditch/status/1408717225423409154?s=20

Would like to see a breakdown of what the 22m is made up of

Sleeper12 · 26-06-2021 9:29pm

Alternative facts or fake news?

26-06-2021 9:33pm

skimpydoo wrote: »

This is rather shocking how can this be allowed to happen, whilst those who deserve a medical card are waiting to get one.

https://twitter.com/wereontheditch/status/1408717225423409154?s=20

Does a 'Homeless Clinic' have just the one card for every client therein???

Seems a bit strange,,,

Maybe I've misinterpreted the OP, but if it's the one card for every resident/member of the clinic; then it's definitely wide open to abuse

Ninthlife · 26-06-2021 9:37pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Does a 'Homeless Clinic' have just the one card for every client therein???

Seems a bit strange,,,

Maybe I've misinterpreted the OP, but if it's the one card for every resident/member of the clinic; then it's definitely wide open to abuse

I thought a medical card was exclusive to an individual and linked to PPS number

26-06-2021 9:44pm

I can remember years ago seeing the local doctors receptionist in the local pharmacy handing in a bundle of loose prescriptions. I'm sure the fiddling of the system is still rife

0ph0rce0 · 26-06-2021 9:45pm

Ninthlife wrote: »

I thought a medical card was exclusive to an individual and linked to PPS number

It states it's a generic card. These organisations must get some sort of single card to be used on everyone.

It says in the article used for Travellers, Roma and Junkies.

Like everything in this country I wouldn't be shocked to hear at least half of those millions have ended up to fund someones lifestyle.

26-06-2021 9:45pm

Ninthlife wrote: »

I thought a medical card was exclusive to an individual and linked to PPS number

So did I, but from the OP it appears ambiguous as to whether it's the one card per individual; or whether the card covers everyone registered with the organisation...

Wouldn't surprise me with charities/NGO's etc regarding the amount of latitude they have, plus possibly not subject to the same rules as ordinary individuals/Joe-Josephine Soaps... It's not as if this stuff is well advertised - if that's the case, as it may well be (might not be)... No surprise at all.

Dempo1 · 26-06-2021 9:57pm

Sounds like a pile of S**** to me.

On a day to day basis the monatary aspect of a medical card would be GP fee's , priscription charges, A&E fees, and hospital stays fees. The story on the surface seems to suggest the medical card was being used like a credit card with no limit, which is beyond absurd. There is no monetary gain other than the fact the homeless charity does not have to pay out fees for services mentioned every time they bring a person to see a GP or get medications etc. Gp"s and pharmacies equally run tight ships.

Whilst charities generally have got pretty bad press, I'd find it hard to believe their clients are being sent to a GP or hospital in an attempt to somehow avoid charges for such medical services or abuse medical cards.

I don't know if a Medical Card is issued to a specific charitable entity but it would make sense to have some mechanism in place whereby a charity dealing with homeless people can bring clients to get urgent medical attention without having to carry hoards of cash, fill out endless forms etc.

I suspect a large portion of the fees being alledged are probably for medications and I can only assume homeless people have greater medical needs than the rest of the population.

I have a full medical Card for which I'm genuinely grateful it's for a long term medical issue requiring a lot of monthly meds and regular GP visits, bloods etc. It's not something that can be abused, I wouldn't even know how too.

This story is gutter journalism that clearly knows little about how a homeless charity works and the medical needs it's client have.

It's hard enough to get a homeless person's name, let alone DOB, try get a homeless person apply for a medical card or understand how the system works.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 26-06-2021 9:58pm

Ninthlife wrote: »

I thought a medical card was exclusive to an individual and linked to PPS number

Generic medical cards stopped being issued in 2011. According to the article there's around 100 still in circulation.

According to the article its been issued since 2007. Thats 14 years. Depending on what Homeless charity its been issued to its possible that this could be legitimate use.

Peter McVerry trust provided support to 7,800 in 2020. If all of those people get supported by this medical card it would make sense.

Its also possible that the medical card was issued to a much smaller charity where it doesn't make sense.

I do feel that as generic medical cards are no longer issued exisiting generic cards should be withdrawn.

CoBo55 · 26-06-2021 10:00pm

Eduard Khil wrote: »

Not a very reputable sauce

YR? Best you can get IMO.

Dempo1 · 26-06-2021 10:03pm

0ph0rce0 wrote: »

It states it's a generic card. These organisations must get some sort of single card to be used on everyone.

It says in the article used for Travellers, Roma and Junkies.

Like everything in this country I wouldn't be shocked to hear at least half of those millions have ended up to fund someones lifestyle.

How exactly would the use of a medical card fund someone's lifestyle? whilst you may not know how they work, I do and I can tell you it certainly doesn't fund my life style, it probably helps keep me alive. I take it very seriously and am very grateful to have it, covers substantial monthly prescription charges I would have without it, along with covering regular GP visits, bloods etc.

26-06-2021 10:04pm

Probably been around for years; yet as of 15 minutes ago I'd never heard of a generic medical card..... Yet another reason to not disbelieve the 'multiple buggies' tales.. Both being under the auspices of the Health Board/HSE.

0ph0rce0 · 26-06-2021 10:06pm

Dempo1 wrote: »

How exactly would the use of a medical card fund someone's lifestyle? whilst you may not know how they work, I do and I can tell you it certainly doesn't fund my life style, it probably helps keep me alive. I take it very seriously and am very grateful to have it, covers substantial monthly prescription charges I would have without it, along with covering regular GP visits, bloods etc.

Ahh relax it's nothing to do with your medical card. I wouldn't trust an Irish charity to cut my grass. These so called "Charities" have been robbing the state blind for years.

CoBo55 · 26-06-2021 10:07pm

0ph0rce0 wrote: »

Ahh relax it's nothing to do with your medical card. I wouldn't trust an Irish charity to cut my grass. These so called "Charities" have been robbing the state blind for years.

My brother says the same and he worked with a certain big charity for years. Never mind the state, they've been robbing unsuspecting customers too, there were numerous DD's being taken from my father's account.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 26-06-2021 10:10pm

Dempo1 wrote: »

How exactly would the use of a medical card fund someone's lifestyle? whilst you may not know how they work, I do and I can tell you it certainly doesn't fund my life style, it probably helps keep me alive. I take it very seriously and am very grateful to have it, covers substantial monthly prescription charges I would have without it, along with covering regular GP visits, bloods etc.

The article linked in the op has been expanded over the last while.

Its a generic medical card held by a homeless charity. The charity runs a number of medical clinics and employs quiet a number of medical staff. The question is if they are over claiming to fund the doctors lifestyle.

Its a huge amount of money to be on a single card.

Dempo1 · 26-06-2021 10:11pm

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

Generic medical cards stopped being issued in 2011. According to the article there's around 100 still in circulation.

According to the article its been issued since 2007. Thats 14 years. Depending on what Homeless charity its been issued to its possible that this could be legitimate use.

Peter McVerry trust provided support to 7,800 in 2020. If all of those people get supported by this medical card it would make sense.

Its also possible that the medical card was issued to a much smaller charity where it doesn't make sense.

I do feel that as generic medical cards are no longer issued exisiting generic cards should be withdrawn.

The criteria involved in getting an invidual medical card is rigorous and rightly so, getting one for a charity would have extra layers of criteria requirements . I personally feel a specific charity dealing with homeless services could not function without a group card.

Notwithstanding the complexities dealing with the homeless, it would be logistically impossible to issue personal medical cards to individual clients coupled with charities having to fund every GP, hospital visit, pay for prescriptions at full price and then process refunds etc.

Darc19 · 26-06-2021 10:14pm

Quite concerning that someone would think that the ditch is a reputable source.

Dempo1 · 26-06-2021 10:16pm

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

The article linked in the op has been expanded over the last while.

Its a generic medical card held by a homeless charity. The charity runs a number of medical clinics and employs quiet a number of medical staff. The question is if they are over claiming to fund the doctors lifestyle.

Its a huge amount of money to be on a single card.

I apologise, I did not see that part of the story, please forgive my rant. I would say regardless of the charity directly employing medical staff, those staff would have them same strict ethical rules and oversight that such professionals would have working either privately or in the public system.

If there's an ounce of truth in the allegations (and I hope there is not) I would be beyond disgusted, not just the alledged abuse of the system but just as importantly the abuse of homeless peoples situations.

corner of hells · 26-06-2021 10:17pm

I work in homeless services and have been for about 13 or so years , a KPI of most residential services is to ensure each resident has a medical card of there own.
Not as easy as you with particularly with someone living a chaotic, transient lifestyle but most or nearly all end up getting their own card.
Who I work for currently has a house medical card , I seen it used twice in 10 years.

Dempo1 · 26-06-2021 10:17pm

Darc19 wrote: »

Quite concerning that someone would think that the ditch is a reputable source.

Could be worse, someone thinks they are a reputable Sauce

gmisk · 26-06-2021 10:18pm

Darc19 wrote: »

Quite concerning that someone would think that the ditch is a reputable source.

True that.
The fact Paddy Cosgrave is involved should give people an indication.
I remember them building up this huge story...with a countdown...and it was Micheal Martin without a mask...standing miles away from someone at an awards things for a photo op...lol

skimpydoo · 26-06-2021 10:18pm

Darc19 wrote: »

Quite concerning that someone would think that the ditch is a reputable source.

What would you call a reputable source?

Dempo1 · 26-06-2021 10:19pm

corner of hells wrote: »

I work in homeless services and have been for about 13 or so years , a KPI of most residential services is to ensure each resident has a medical card of there own.
Not as easy as you with particularly with someone living a chaotic, transient lifestyle but most or nearly all end up getting their own card.
Who I work for currently has a house medical card , I seen it used twice in 10 years.

Thank you for your service, I've long admired those who work in this difficult charitable sector. I made similar observations as you did.

SEPT 23 1989 · 26-06-2021 10:22pm

I don’t get over excited about people who need medical cards

There but for the grace of God go I

magicbastarder · 26-06-2021 10:27pm

Eduard Khil wrote: »

Not a very reputable sauce

whoever wrote that story certainly didn't go to journalism school, it's very badly written.

26-06-2021 10:30pm

Darc19 wrote: »

Quite concerning that someone would think that the ditch is a reputable source.

Doesn't mean they're wrong though... A lot of obsession in general about reputable sources.. Will be debunked soon enough if untrue...

CIARAN_BOYLE · 26-06-2021 10:31pm

Dempo1 wrote: »

The criteria involved in getting an invidual medical card is rigorous and rightly so, getting one for a charity would have extra layers of criteria requirements . I personally feel a specific charity dealing with homeless services could not function without a group card.

Notwithstanding the complexities dealing with the homeless, it would be logistically impossible to issue personal medical cards to individual clients coupled with charities having to fund every GP, hospital visit, pay for prescriptions at full price and then process refunds etc.

As these generic group medical cards are no longer issued I'd hope they have been replaced by a better system of some sort.

As such everyone should be moving onto the new system whatever it is. Legacy systems no longer open to new applicants are very abusable in general.

26-06-2021 10:31pm

Dempo1 wrote: »

Could be worse, someone thinks they are a reputable Sauce

Doubt that

Most likely having a giraffe is all

Sheep Shagger · 26-06-2021 10:34pm

No other source is even mentioning this?

skimpydoo · 26-06-2021 11:31pm

Sheep Shagger wrote: »

No other source is even mentioning this?

No other source mentioned the Leo Leakage story when that first broke.

tdf7187 · 26-06-2021 11:32pm

0ph0rce0 wrote: »

Ahh relax it's nothing to do with your medical card. I wouldn't trust an Irish charity to cut my grass. These so called "Charities" have been robbing the state blind for years.

If so, they must have followed the example of the bankers and the MNC's. But you probably don't want to talk about that, do you.

tdf7187 · 26-06-2021 11:34pm

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

I don’t get over excited about people who need medical cards

There but for the grace of God go I

Fair play, I personally didn't need one until recent years and probably would have slightly looked down on those who did.

0ph0rce0 · 26-06-2021 11:35pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

If so, they must have followed the example of the bankers and the MNC's. But you probably don't want to talk about that, do you.

There was no mention of banks or MNC's here? If there was, why wouldn't I want to talk about that?

Idiot

Ninthlife · 26-06-2021 11:47pm

Like others I never knew a generic medical card existed. So there are or were charities with these and it would reduce any direct costs for medical treatment or pharmaceutical supplies for the clients they were serving/treating.

Given how medical cards work it would only cover GP visits, A&E, reduced prescription charge, some optical and dental treatments.

I'd be auditing it regardless and try account for every penny

Get Real · 27-06-2021 12:00am

Simple way to question the reputable source for this is to ask, can the claims they're making be ascertained?

Does a former board member of this charity have a private practice that this card is frequently used at? To the tune of millions a year?

Is it true that the next highest amount for the same time period used by a charity on a generic medical card is 7 times lower than this one?

Definitely something fishy if those things are true. Pure libel and very dangerous accusations to be making if they turn out to be false.

I'm always skeptical of any article or piece published, and the motives behind it, regardless of topic or area. But, if they're making statements like that, that end up verified, could be weight behind it.

eviltwin · 27-06-2021 12:36am

corner of hells wrote: »

I work in homeless services and have been for about 13 or so years , a KPI of most residential services is to ensure each resident has a medical card of there own.
Not as easy as you with particularly with someone living a chaotic, transient lifestyle but most or nearly all end up getting their own card.
Who I work for currently has a house medical card , I seen it used twice in 10 years.

I also work in the area of homelessness and can concur. One of the first things we do is set people up with an individual medical card. I’ve never heard of a generic card so would be very interested to know what charity this refers to.

corner of hells · 27-06-2021 12:45am

eviltwin wrote: »

I also work in the area of homelessness and can concur. One of the first things we do is set people up with an individual medical card. I’ve never heard of a generic card so would be very interested to know what charity this refers to.

Calling it a generic card seems a bit odd , what we have is a medical card number , ive no idea where the physical card is , i know there a few going around.

Any im aware are most certainly not abused, at a guess id imagine they are used for very chaotic ,disenefranchised individuals not regularly accessing medical services , pharmacies etc.

AndrewJRenko · 27-06-2021 1:01am

CoBo55 wrote: »

, they've been robbing unsuspecting customers too, there were numerous DD's being taken from my father's account.

Strange how that's never come into the public domain, isn't it?

€22 million in fees claimed on single medical card

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