Vaccine Megathread No 2 - Read OP before posting

Russman · 24-06-2021 09:54AM

Red Silurian wrote: »

Perhaps they haven't been slow but they have been slower than their USA and UK equivalents

Have they really though ?
A quick google search says Pfizer submitted to the FDA on 20th November and were approved on 11th December, and they submitted to the EMA on 1st December and were approved on 21st December. I didn't double check the links/stories but it seems there wasn't much in it either way. Plus I think its a fuller authorisation here in Europe as opposed to emergency use in the States.

astrofool · 24-06-2021 10:09AM

Red Silurian wrote: »

Perhaps they haven't been slow but they have been slower than their USA and UK equivalents

a) It's fully dependent on when the companies submit, the EMA can't approve a vaccine that hasn't been submitted for approval (AZ hit this particularly, waiting a long time to submit that ended up being a cover for their lack of supply)
b) The CDC and EMA have very high standards for approval that takes longer, the UK has been approving quickly under emergency approval, as this requires less data, the companies were able to submit faster as well, the EMA and CDC have been taking very similar amounts of time, the CDC still hasn't approved AZ, the UK approved J&J and Moderna after the EMA
c) the time to approve has had very little effect on the roll out as it has all been supply driven
d) The EMA has multiple vaccines in rolling approvals with continuous data being submitted in order to cut the approval time down but as we have 4 good vaccines, the need to approve faster has been diminished
e) Novavax don't have a quantity of vaccine ready to go, when they do submit and if they get approved, the vaccines won't follow for months (as happened to the UK after Moderna approval)

Will be interesting to see if you repeat this line in another few weeks time

Le Bruise · 24-06-2021 10:11AM

First jab done and dusted in Greystones yesterday. Really smooth process, barely even felt it and only a sore arm as a side effect. Even got out for a game of touch rugby last night!

Roll on normality (in 6/7 weeks

)

Scuid Mhór · 24-06-2021 10:34AM

Which MVCs in Dublin are doing MRNA vaccines right now?

Red Silurian · 24-06-2021 10:35AM

astrofool wrote: »

a) It's fully dependent on when the companies submit, the EMA can't approve a vaccine that hasn't been submitted for approval (AZ hit this particularly, waiting a long time to submit that ended up being a cover for their lack of supply)
b) The CDC and EMA have very high standards for approval that takes longer, the UK has been approving quickly under emergency approval, as this requires less data, the companies were able to submit faster as well, the EMA and CDC have been taking very similar amounts of time, the CDC still hasn't approved AZ, the UK approved J&J and Moderna after the EMA
c) the time to approve has had very little effect on the roll out as it has all been supply driven
d) The EMA has multiple vaccines in rolling approvals with continuous data being submitted in order to cut the approval time down but as we have 4 good vaccines, the need to approve faster has been diminished
e) Novavax don't have a quantity of vaccine ready to go, when they do submit and if they get approved, the vaccines won't follow for months (as happened to the UK after Moderna approval)

Will be interesting to see if you repeat this line in another few weeks time

My point has very little to do with vaccine rollout although we are in the middle of a pandemic so the sooner that a vaccine gets approved the sooner a rollout can start.

The EMA really showed their uselessness in December 2020 when they were they approved the Pfizer vaccine almost a month after the UK. Considering their rolling review mechanism I see no reason for any delay between a company applying and getting approval

I don't think my line on this will change

Scuid Mhór · 24-06-2021 10:37AM

Scuid Mhór wrote: »

Which MVCs in Dublin are doing MRNA vaccines right now?

Re-quoting this just in case it gets lost.

Lyle · 24-06-2021 10:38AM

Been keeping an eye out for coverage on side effects in Pfizer and Moderna abroad before any might happen here that the papers will probably lose their minds about.

This is a good in-depth update from the CDC in the US about myocarditis and pericarditis after Pfizer/Moderna jabs. Few more cases than they expected but still very, very low numbers, incredibly rare in the grand scheme of things with tens of millions of doses given.

Highest level of care received (Sample of 29 Chart Confirmed Cases)
Outpatient - 1 (3.4%)
Emergency department - 4 (13.8%)
Inpatient hospitalization - 22 (75.9%)
Intensive care unit (ICU) - 2 (5.7%)

Median length of hospital stay - 1 day (Range 0–13)

Discharged to home at time of chart review - 29 (100%)
Follow-up visit noted at time of chart review - 27 (93.1%)

Seems very positive that its a tiny proportion of adverse impacts vs jabs administered and its a highly treatable side effect despite sounding a bit scary.

Source: https://cdc.gov/vaccines/acip/meetings/downloads/slides-2021-06/03-COVID-Shimabukuro-508.pdf

EDIT: I do think these numbers show that NIAC or whoever should look at this and advocate for AZ to be made available to men aged 18 - 39. AZ clotting seems to impact women more than men and the MRNA heart stuff impacts men more than women. Seems a no brainer to use our surplus of AZ to get more men of that age demo done faster than they'd be done waiting for MRNA and it'd technically be safer for them to get AZ anyway.

dominatinMC · 24-06-2021 10:51AM

Turtwig wrote: »

That was the initial aim. This time a year ago we'd have been delighted with a vaccine efficacy greater than 50. Then we got three that prevented serious illness, infection and transmission. The real world data from the UK suggested that four weeks after the first dose the vaccines deployed there prevented infection in almost 90% of cases.

Fast forward less than four months, we now have vaccines that prevent infection less than 50% of the time four weeks after the first dose. That is significant ground lost.

The vaccines still prevent severe illness and death. People definitely need to have that part emphasised to them. That does not mean we should brazenly dismiss the ground lost. If we still had the original wildtype or even the alpha variant things would be considerably easier. As it stands we're lucky the UK is a few weeks ahead of us in the spread of the delta. We will get time to assess just how much the link between hospitalisations and infections has been weakened by the vaccine. We will also get to see just how much impact this variant has on the impact on the unvaccinated population cohorts.

The best thing about the vaccines is that once we have a larger proportion of the population fully vaccinated. We can afford to be more relaxed about, well, everything.

Whilst I share your concerns (Jesus I'm beginning hate that word now :pac:), I am encouraged by the report which PHE issued last week which stated that both AZ and BioNTech vaccines offered >90% protection against hospitalisation. And, as you say, that is the metric which people need to be made aware of. So the bottom line, vaccines work. And of course, the T-Cell response is another aspect which has yet to be established fully, from the limited pieces I have read, there is further grounds for optimism here.

IRISHSPORTSGUY · 24-06-2021 11:39AM

funnydoggy wrote: »

Wasn't the vaccine tracker supposed to be back this week? I'm jonesing for a fix of those sweet, sweet numbers..

Source?

VonLuck · 24-06-2021 11:41AM

This may have been asked before, but I got the Pfizer jab this morning and am scheduled for my second in exactly 3 weeks time. The information booklet they gave me said that it should be in 4 weeks. I assume the booklet is out of date and they didn't put the wrong date on my vaccination record?

Lumen · 24-06-2021 11:43AM

VonLuck wrote: »

This may have been asked before, but I got the Pfizer jab this morning and am scheduled for my second in exactly 3 weeks time. The information booklet they gave me said that it should be in 4 weeks. I assume the booklet is out of date and they didn't put the wrong date on my vaccination record?

AFAIK the Pfizer dose interval has always been 4 weeks and that hasn't changed.

GP or MVC?

bennyineire · 24-06-2021 11:44AM

VonLuck wrote: »

This may have been asked before, but I got the Pfizer jab this morning and am scheduled for my second in exactly 3 weeks time. The information booklet they gave me said that it should be in 4 weeks. I assume the booklet is out of date and they didn't put the wrong date on my vaccination record?

The booklet is a guide, 3 weeks interval is the minimum interval for Pfizer

VonLuck · 24-06-2021 11:46AM

Lumen wrote: »

AFAIK the Pfizer dose interval has always been 4 weeks and that hasn't changed.

GP or MVC?

GP. It's a bit confusing having conflicting information.

Lumen · 24-06-2021 11:52AM

VonLuck wrote: »

GP. It's a bit confusing having conflicting information.

I would put money on human error then.

MerlinSouthDub · 24-06-2021 12:19PM

Our doses used data on the ECDC vaccine tracker seems to be updating most days now.

https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#distribution-tab

3.7 million doses used (same as Paul Reid said yesterday)
4.2 million doses received (this figure hasn't change all week, so excludes our Pfizer delivery of 317,000)

That means we currently have about 800,000 doses in stock, about 700,000 of this is Pfizer. Possibly we've used another 100,000 doses since this data was submitted to ECDC.

Probes · 24-06-2021 12:24PM

VonLuck wrote: »

GP. It's a bit confusing having conflicting information.

My missus had 2nd dose after around 3 weeks, CDC seems to think this is fine anyway.

Lumen · 24-06-2021 12:27PM

MerlinSouthDub wrote: »

Our doses used data on the ECDC vaccine tracker seems to be updating most days now.

https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#distribution-tab

3.7 million doses used (same as Paul Reid said yesterday)
4.2 million doses received (this figure hasn't change all week, so excludes our Pfizer delivery of 317,000)

That means we currently have about 800,000 doses in stock, about 700,000 of this is Pfizer. Possibly we've used another 100,000 doses since this data was submitted to ECDC.

I have little faith in this data until someone in the HSE makes a statement about vaccine stocks.

I don't watch any briefings but are none of the journos asking about this?

Even (?) on Twitter the level of numeracy and literacy seems really poor.

Take this Tweet for instance. Nobody seems to have noticed that 1.2 + 1.2 does not equal 3.5.

https://twitter.com/DonnellyStephen/status/1405517786810519559

CZ 453 · 24-06-2021 12:28PM

MerlinSouthDub wrote: »

Our doses used data on the ECDC vaccine tracker seems to be updating most days now.

https://vaccinetracker.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/vaccine-tracker.html#distribution-tab

3.7 million doses used (same as Paul Reid said yesterday)
4.2 million doses received (this figure hasn't change all week, so excludes our Pfizer delivery of 317,000)

That means we currently have about 800,000 doses in stock, about 700,000 of this is Pfizer. Possibly we've used another 100,000 doses since this data was submitted to ECDC.

Is the stock amount held back for dose 2? So if they give someone dose 1 there is a held back dose 2 for that person.

RavenBea17b · 24-06-2021 12:30PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Telegraph reporting that all cases among vaccinated people have been mild or asymptomatic. Looks like with the Delta variant it's being passed from unvaccinated -> vaccinated but not the other way around.

Vaccines work, the whole premise of them was to reduce and stop serious covid and hospitalisation. Lets get those arms vaccinated. Sadly, there will always be small but significant part of the population who refuse, not just that they cant have a vaccine, point blank refuse.
Boosters will be a regular part of life I suspect.

RavenBea17b · 24-06-2021 12:39PM

Lyle wrote: »

Been keeping an eye out for coverage on side effects in Pfizer and Moderna abroad before any might happen here that the papers will probably lose their minds about.

This is a good in-depth update from the CDC in the US about myocarditis and pericarditis after Pfizer/Moderna jabs. Few more cases than they expected but still very, very low numbers, incredibly rare in the grand scheme of things with tens of millions of doses given.

Highest level of care received (Sample of 29 Chart Confirmed Cases)
Outpatient - 1 (3.4%)
Emergency department - 4 (13.8%)
Inpatient hospitalization - 22 (75.9%)
Intensive care unit (ICU) - 2 (5.7%)

Median length of hospital stay - 1 day (Range 0–13)

Discharged to home at time of chart review - 29 (100%)
Follow-up visit noted at time of chart review - 27 (93.1%)

Seems very positive that its a tiny proportion of adverse impacts vs jabs administered and its a highly treatable side effect despite sounding a bit scary.

Source: https://cdc.gov/vaccines/acip/meetings/downloads/slides-2021-06/03-COVID-Shimabukuro-508.pdf

EDIT: I do think these numbers show that NIAC or whoever should look at this and advocate for AZ to be made available to men aged 18 - 39. AZ clotting seems to impact women more than men and the MRNA heart stuff impacts men more than women. Seems a no brainer to use our surplus of AZ to get more men of that age demo done faster than they'd be done waiting for MRNA and it'd technically be safer for them to get AZ anyway.

I think the same press release commented that the number of instances of myocarditis was over the expected threshold. Hence it is so important to update the adverse reactions notices, - for what ever medication or vaccine. that way, research can be carried out etc.

rameire · 24-06-2021 12:46PM

Lumen wrote: »

I have little faith in this data until someone in the HSE makes a statement about vaccine stocks.

I don't watch any briefings but are none of the journos asking about this?

Even (?) on Twitter the level of numeracy and literacy seems really poor.

Take this Tweet for instance. Nobody seems to have noticed that 1.2 + 1.2 does not equal 3.5.

https://twitter.com/DonnellyStephen/status/1405517786810519559

OAP's and healthcare and cohort 4 and 7 didn't need to register.
The registration would link in with when the online registration portal opened for all others age related.

Edit: But three comments now would suggest it is not clear what is meant.

OwlsZat · 24-06-2021 12:47PM

Lumen wrote: »

Take this Tweet for instance. Nobody seems to have noticed that 1.2 + 1.2 does not equal 3.5.

https://twitter.com/DonnellyStephen/status/1405517786810519559

1.2M fully vaccinated = 2 x 1.2M = 2.4M
1.2 first doses = 1.2M

Total vaccines administered = 3.6M

Wolf359f · 24-06-2021 12:52PM

OwlsZat wrote: »

1.2M fully vaccinated = 2 x 1.2M = 2.4M
1.2 first doses = 1.2M

Total vaccines administered = 3.6M

Add in J&J being a single jab and the figures look like they line up.

corcaigh07 · 24-06-2021 12:55PM

Firebolt185 wrote: »

Has anyone registered twice in different locations? Or can can you change your location ?

I’m 35 and registered in south Dublin . Grew up and family house in Cork. All my 35 year friends in cork have got text and date for first vaccine already.

I'd imagine your PPS number and my mobile would conflict if you try to register again.

eoinbn · 24-06-2021 12:59PM

OwlsZat wrote: »

1.2M fully vaccinated = 2 x 1.2M = 2.4M
1.2 first doses = 1.2M

Total vaccines administered = 3.6M

Accounting for J&J

1.13 * 2 = 2.26
Add in J&J
2.26 + .07 = 2.33

2.33 + 1.2 = 3.53

josip · 24-06-2021 12:59PM

Scuid Mhór wrote: »

Which MVCs in Dublin are doing MRNA vaccines right now?

Aviva doing Pfizer next Monday

24-06-2021 01:08PM

Does anyone know what Ennis are doing now? Hopefully there soon for mine

Lumen · 24-06-2021 01:12PM

OwlsZat wrote: »

1.2M fully vaccinated = 2 x 1.2M = 2.4M
1.2 first doses = 1.2M

Total vaccines administered = 3.6M

Nope.

The tweet says

1.2 million people fully vaccinated
1.2 million who registered have now received at least one dose

At least one dose includes people with two doses.

Can nobody read or write English any more?

MerlinSouthDub · 24-06-2021 01:19PM

Lumen wrote: »

I have little faith in this data until someone in the HSE makes a statement about vaccine stocks.

I don't watch any briefings but are none of the journos asking about this?

None of the "journalists" have asked about this. It's absolutely baffling that we haven't been given proper data on vaccine deliveries. IT systems are irrelevant for this - it's 4 deliveries a week, you could write them down and tot them up on a piece of paper.

The only reason we are not being told the number of vaccines delivered is that going as fast as we should be.

Raoul · 24-06-2021 01:32PM

VonLuck wrote: »

GP. It's a bit confusing having conflicting information.

I got it from Pfizer themselves and it was 19 days between the two doses. So I wouldn't worry.

Vaccine Megathread No 2 - Read OP before posting

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