Brexit Impact on Northern Ireland

With Brexit, the only issue was employment-related pensions for Eurocrats; the EU doesn't provide anything analogous to social insurance pensions.

The solution adopted was for the UK to accept liability for a percentage of the EU institutions' accrued pension liabilities up to the date of leaving. They don't have particular responsibility for the pensions of Eurocrats of UK nationality; they pay X% of the cost of all Eurocrat pensions accrued up to Brexit date. )X% is the same percentage that the UK paid towards all EU budget items in the years before Brexit.)

That woudn't really work for NI because NI leaving the UK is not really analogous to the UK leaving the EU.

Some UK public sector pensions are funded - e.g. for local government employees. The contributions paid have been invested and there;s a big pot of investments out of which the pensions are paid. That could continue, obviously, or the pension fund could be divided into separate GB and NI funds (in proportion to accrued liabilities). That's a matter for negotiation. (In fact the NI local government pension fund may already be separate from the fund(s) for local government officials in the UK - I haven't checked.)

Other pension liabiltities may not be funded, but paid out of current revenue. Assume that this is true of, say, teachers in NI. The UK government is likely to say that the NI Dept of Education is, duh, an NI government department and, just as its assets will cease to be UK government assets when NI leaves - the UK government won't own the schools - so its liabilities will not be UK government liabilities - the UK government will not pay teachers wages, or former teachers' pensions. The Irish government will step into the shoes of the UK government, both as the ultimate owner of the schools, and as the ultimate payer of the costs of the education service, including pensions. That, at any rate, will be their opening position (I confidently predict).

You can make that argument in relation to employees and retirees of what is obviously an NI institution. Their relationship with that institution will be unchanged; what will change is the relationship between the institution and the central government - one central government steps out, and another steps in. What about NI-based employees and retirees of a UK-wide institution - the army, say? Here the UK is likely to retain responsiblity for paying the pensions, but seek to negotiate about whether NI/IRL should pay a contribution. The answer may vary depending on the institution involved; an Irish contribution to British Army pensions would be as unthinkable now as it was in 1922, but if, say, the Northern Ireland tax districts of the UK Inland Revenue are hived off and either become a separate NI Tax Service or are absorbed in the Revenue Commissioners, shou;d pension liablities accrued by those who worked in those districts (and may still be working in them) be part of the transfer? Again, a matter for negotiation.

weemcd wrote: »

Finding out how much a TD earns versus what an MLA earns would be a good start...

The salaries, allowances and committee payments are much nicer down here but the party funding rules are vastly stricter and would cut off much of their funding.

Seth Brundle wrote: »

This should come as no surprise but nonetheless it is always nice to hear the truth finally come out...

https://twitter.com/Femi_Sorry/status/1403273485288448001

Wow, that should be going out around Northern Ireland in every local newspaper, radio and tv station to show what they are actually thought of by the Brexiteers.

What is the DUP's problem with the ILA? They already agreed to it before.

They are just so pathetic and insecure.

I'm guessing the general content of the Act hasn't changed too much since this:
https://www.thejournal.ie/irish-language-act-explainer-3851417-Feb2018/

It's not like they're going to force kids in unionist schools to learn Irish. Everyday life will continue unchanged. They are incredibly intransigent and short-sighted.

Any why are they turning on Poots already? Because he deigned to agree to nominate Paul Givan as First Minister, and they're not happy about power sharing continuing unless the ILA is dropped?

Do they even know why they're against stuff anymore? It just seems to be NONONONONONONONONO. It's on the headlines every bloody day, can they not take a day off whingeing.

*Edit* Even Paul Givan signed the email objecting to appointing him as First Minister! You cannot make this stuff up! :pac:

Shelga wrote: »

*Edit* Even Paul Givan signed the email objecting to appointing him as First Minister! You cannot make this stuff up! :pac:

I think that was Paul Girvan. Confusingly there's both a Paul Givan and a Paul Girvan!

Poots may be given the boot by his party today. There's a meeting imminent at their party HQ and Sammy Wilson has said he doesn't know if Poots will lose a motion of confidence. Meanwhile in Westminster, even Rees-Mogg has had enough of them...

https://twitter.com/Planet_Belfast/status/1405507227042160646

Shelga wrote: »

What is the DUP's problem with the ILA? They already agreed to it before.

They are just so pathetic and insecure.

I'm guessing the general content of the Act hasn't changed too much since this:
https://www.thejournal.ie/irish-language-act-explainer-3851417-Feb2018/

It's not like they're going to force kids in unionist schools to learn Irish. Everyday life will continue unchanged. They are incredibly intransigent and short-sighted.

They don't believe that the Nationalist Community should have equal rights, they still think its the 1970s get what they want. Triumphalism has been spoke about in other threads but you'll see this in spades over the next few weeks when they march where there are not wanted, burning tricolours, etc.
The protocol is talked about a lot but I don't see any Nationlists having a go, lots of them Business people. Something for the PUL Community to have a whinge

I saw a wise observation on twitter, to the effect that the DUP are proving beyond doubt that if you can be bought, you can be sold.

Love seeing the DUP in turmoil

Couldn't happen a nicer political party....

Foster must be sitting in an arm chair overlooking a fire place with a wine in hand and nice smirk on her face

What goes around comes around

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Foster is as responsible as Poots for this mess.

I'm referring to the back stabbing they did on Foster and particularly Poots who barely talked to her after he put the knife in

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Belfast News Editor's Ben Lowry had a bit of a meltdown on The View. Saying SF had used blackmail and held Stormont to ransom. Had to be pointed out to him by host Mark Carruthers that the deal for an Irish language act had already been agreed, and there wouldn't have been an issue if it had been implemented as promised.

I wonder whether the same things will be said of the DUP if they threaten to collapse Stormont in order to scrap the Brexit prootocol, as has been suggested by some in the party. I somehow doubt it.

Lowry like the DUP has been found out. Belligerent Unionists all.

https://twitter.com/denisstaunton/status/1405851605354831872

Hope this is the case. Hard to have trust in their commitments based on experience.

The DUP's friends reckon they should pull down Stormont. Considering the party are currently fuming over Westminster taking matters into their own hands, not sure a strategy of letting Westminster take matters into their own hands for the forseeable future is the best idea...

https://twitter.com/rodneyedwards/status/1405925778639015941

Also love the fact that it's the Irish government that are at fault for problems, and not the Tories or DUP who suppsedly held all the cards the last 5 odd years.

Interesting article from BBC NI's Economics and Business Editor, John Campbell, about how all-island trade is rising since Brexit:

for the whole January to April period NI exports to Ireland were up by 60% to more than €1bn (£859m).

The figures from Ireland's Central Statistics Office (CSO) also showed the value of Irish exports to NI increasing.

In January to April they were up 40% to €977m (£841m).

Since the NI Protocol began operating in January, it has become more difficult for businesses in either part of Ireland to import goods from Great Britain.

Northern Ireland has remained in the EU's single market for goods, which means that products arriving from Great Britain are subject to new checks and controls.

Goods arriving from Great Britain into the Republic of Ireland face similar processes.

However, goods trade across the Irish border remains as it was before Brexit, with no new checks and controls.

That may have prompted some businesses to source more products on the island of Ireland rather than from GB.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-57484741

Brexit continues to be a spectacular own goal for the DUP. The blame for the change in circumstances rests with those that supported it and dismissed warnings against it.