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Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

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Comments

  • #4472
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Timmy O Toole wrote: »
    Hospitalisations is your evidence.

    None then


  • #4473
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    Tony has today said that antigen tests should not be used as a 'green light' for "risky activities" per the Irish Times.

    I'm still waiting to hear the impact of the previous risky activities, which were so risky he was 'absolutely shocked', as opposed to having only previously been 'shocked' or 'worried'.

    He should be asked to explain why there appears to be no spike as a result of what happened that weekend, otherwise he is not going to sound like an authority on what is a risky activity.
    Ficheall wrote: »
    Like when your mum tells you not to play in traffic, and you decide she obviously doesn't know what she's talking about because you didn't get hit.

    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    Excellent! But hold on - isn't my point that nobody appears to have got hit? :rolleyes:
    seamus wrote: »
    Actually, your point is a common disingenuous misrepresentation of what that tweet actually said. Everyone is saying, "whERe is THe spiKE" even though Tony never said there would be.

    His actual words were, "Enormous crowds- like a major open air party. This is what we do not need when we have made so much progress."

    There was no prediction of a big spike. I'm not going to say he wasn't overstating it a bit, but his rationale is sound; it is/was too early for large uncontrolled public gatherings. One incident of a few hundred people on a street may not cause a measurable spike. But the same scenes repeated across the country on a nightly basis, could and likely would lead to new spikes.

    But keep on claiming that one example of running in front of a car without being hit proves that it's safe for everyone to run in front of cars.

    I think you are in a minority that think Tony wasn't suggesting there would be consequences to these outdoor gatherings. There really haven't been. And you know as well as I do, had there been any spike in the days following this outdoor gatherings, we'd never have heard the end of it from Holohan, with a "I told you so" add-on. No spike and not a word from Tony.

    You quoted him, but left out the best bit "Absolutely shocked at scenes...
    Now, normally, when you're absolutely shocked, it's because you fear consequences of the thing you are referring to. That's the implication of what he said to most people.

    I won't even bother arguing your point (and Ficheall's) about my "claiming that one example of running in front of a car without being hit proves it's safe for everyone to run in front of cars".

    Actually, I will. It's a ridiculous comparison, there were thousands of people out doing that partying. And if there is no particular spike noticed as a result, well it seems that perhaps Tony should have taken a valium and calmed the f down. :)


  • #4474
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Which is not relevant to the discussion which is around the impact of gatherings on case numbers. The contention being they have no impact with the counter argument being that given we are supposedly completely repressed compared to all of Europe why have we higher cases than much of Europe

    Do we have much higher severe cases (hospitalisations) than much of Europe? After these gatherings?


  • #4475
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    None then

    57 people in hospital when you’re averaging 300 cases a day would show that nearly all cases are mild.


  • #4476
    normanoffside
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,234 ✭✭✭✭normanoffside


    Timmy O Toole wrote: »
    So basically NEPHETs stance is that it's better to catch zero cases than some cases. Tony said that countries using Antigen tests for travel were countries that don't have PCR testing capacity. That's a flat out lie ?

    Yes it's a flat our lie.
    Look at Denmark (same population as us)

    They are doing half a million tests a day 80k PCR and 420K antigen.
    Event though 85% of their tests are Antigen they still have 4+ times the number of PCR test/day as us.

    https://twitter.com/WoodfordinDK/status/1404776936279359492

    And yes they use Antigen for travel.


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  • #4477
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    normanoffside wrote: »
    Yes it's a flat our lie.
    Look at Denmark (same population as us)

    They are doing half a million tests a day 80k PCR and 420K antigen.
    Event though 85% of their tests are Antigen they still have 4+ times the number of PCR test/day as us.

    https://twitter.com/WoodfordinDK/status/1404776936279359492

    And yes they use Antigen for travel.


    Fake news Tony!


  • #4478
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 2,892 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    Fake news Tony!

    I want my €89 back. Were my eyes watering more from the stick rammed up my nose or the cost of the test.


  • #4479
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 6,775 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The number of COVID-19 patients in hospital at 8am this morning stood at 57, the lowest since September 13 last year.

    The number in ICU is down to 19, down 4 in 24 hours; the lowest since September 29 last year.

    Excellent!


  • #4480
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    57 people in hospital when you’re averaging 300 cases a day would show that nearly all cases are mild.

    So not asymptomatic then


  • #4481
    FishOnABike
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,928 ✭✭✭FishOnABike


    declanflynn wrote: »
    My silly sister in law booked flights to Scotland for mid August, Do ye think she can go there and come back without some form of isolation on her return

    It's anyone's guess what will be required in two months time but at the moment, according to https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0615/1228167-covid19-ireland/

    "People arriving in Ireland from Britain who are not fully vaccinated will have to self-isolate for ten days in changes that come into force with immediate effect.

    They will have to receive a negative PCR test on day five and day ten before they can exit the period of quarantine.

    Those who are vaccinated will still have to quarantine at a stated address for five days, but can resume normal activity after that period if they get a clear PCR test.

    By mid July "unable to say if there will be any change to the new quarantine rules for people coming here from the UK by that date because of uncertainty over the Delta variant." according to https://m.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/fully-vaccinated-can-go-on-holiday-abroad-from-july-19-without-pcr-test-says-holohan-40547346.html

    By mid August she might still require 10 days isolation on her return or things might have changed by then.


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  • #4482
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    So not asymptomatic then

    It was around 30% in April and now with 3,250,000 vaccines handed out that number can only go one direction

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40262330.html

    Consider also now the multiple walk in test centres that are specifically there to catch asymptomatic cases and the number of swabs they churn through a day.

    Can only assume the asymptomatic number is quite high.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/high-level-of-asymptomatic-covid-cases-in-dublin-hot-spot-a-worry-1.4522485

    This is also further supported by the number of cases versus numbers in hospital.


  • #4483
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    normanoffside wrote: »
    Yes it's a flat our lie.
    Look at Denmark (same population as us)

    They are doing half a million tests a day 80k PCR and 420K antigen.
    Event though 85% of their tests are Antigen they still have 4+ times the number of PCR test/day as us.

    https://twitter.com/WoodfordinDK/status/1404776936279359492

    And yes they use Antigen for travel.

    By any chance does anyone know the type of test Denmark require to shorten the quarantine period that is required even when arrivals present negative antigen test?


  • #4484
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    It was around 30% in April and now with 3,250,000 vaccines handed out that number can only go one direction

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40262330.html

    Consider also now the multiple walk in test centres that are specifically there to catch asymptomatic cases and the number of swabs they churn through a day.

    Can only assume the asymptomatic number is quite high.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/high-level-of-asymptomatic-covid-cases-in-dublin-hot-spot-a-worry-1.4522485

    How would that be when we don’t test vaccinated people with no symptoms?

    This stuff is easy to confirm


  • #4485
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    How would that be when we don’t test vaccinated people with no symptoms?

    This stuff is easy to confirm

    I believe the points about walk in test centres and hospital numbers versus case numbers cover the point around asymptomatic being a high portion of the cases these days.


  • #4486
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    I believe the points about walk in test centres and hospital numbers versus case numbers cover the point around asymptomatic being a high portion of the cases these days.

    Walk ins are predominantly pre symptomatic and symptomatic who for whatever reason don’t want to call their gp. Hospitalisations rates are low because those most likely to be hospitalised have been vaccinated


  • #4487
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Walk ins are predominantly pre symptomatic and symptomatic who for whatever reason don’t want to call their gp. Hospitalisations rates are low because those most likely to be hospitalised have been vaccinated

    How would you classify the 300 or so cases a day that dont need hospital treatment?


  • #4488
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    How would you classify the 300 or so cases a day that dont need hospital treatment?

    Younger on average

    In early feb the hospitalisation rate was about 5%, now it’s about 2.5%.


  • #4489
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Younger on average

    In early feb the hospitalisation rate was about 5%, now it’s about 2.5%.

    And with younger persons, a possible larger portion of cases being asymptotic?


  • #4490
    Dempo1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,138 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    Arghus wrote: »
    Great stuff there from Michael McNamara.

    Spent thirty seconds on mute and then asked a question that had already been asked and answered.

    What a dude.

    Awful Clown with an even more awful hair Quiff, I watch most of this debacle live, it was just bizzare, almost like a pantomime. Politicians utterly clueless on the topic of antigen testing, NPHET 100% on the same page, just a peculiar spectle.

    No doubt there's going to be some choice posts across boards celebrating (NOT) Tony Holohan picking up his freedom of Dublin award earlier :)

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • #4491
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    And with younger persons, a possible larger portion of cases being asymptotic?

    Possible. But also likely that most of those are never tested


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  • #4492
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Possible. But also likely that most of those are never tested

    Fair enough. We'll leave it there so.


  • #4493
    Polar101
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,064 ✭✭✭Polar101


    What's the fascination with antigen testing all about? To me they seem to be something that might have been somewhat useful a few months ago, but less so now.


  • #4494
    CruelSummer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,343 ✭✭✭CruelSummer


    NPHET’s contributions today only clarified what is already widely known. They are wrong on antigen testing. They are pretending we will miss ‘asymptomatic cases’ when in actual fact antigen tests are used to measure if a person is infectious at that point in time.
    The worst and frankly most outrageous contribution came from a NPHET member demonstrating how to fake an at home antigen test kit.
    No one in the aviation or other industries suggested using home kits. Their assertion that it would take 80 nurses to run antigen tests for a gig of 8,000 highlights the fact they know this but still went along with cuckoo internet science to back up their argument.
    If I was in working in the decimated travel sector, entertainment or other affected industries this evening, I would be rightly outraged. They didn’t even read the commissioned report on antigen testing according to Dr Glynn. Jobs, our connectivity, everything is in jeopardy from this.
    The Government are worse for hiding behind Dr Holohan & NPHET - instead of looking at international evidence & best practices + actually governing. NPHET are who they are, an ultra conservative group of doctors, some with a God complex. They are not evil boogey men but they showed their utter disregard for the Irish population & their intelligence with the contributions today & need to be overruled on this.


  • #4495
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,413 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    That seems unbelievably optimistic for Ireland

    Not a chance actually, after seeing that childish setup called a trial event last week

    I’ll eat my hat if EP goes ahead

    What sort of hat is it , Fintan ?
    A Fedora ?
    Or a Beanie ? :pac:


  • #4496
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,413 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    AdamD wrote: »
    I agree with your general point but those scenes have been happening in Dublin city for weeks (nigh on months at this point, it was jammers in early April), and continued in the weekends after his comment, to no discernable affect on numbers. Whilst it would be better if the gatherings were far more spread than a few streets, it does bring into question whether outdoors is at all risky.

    The 'outrage' at times has often been weeks behind the scenes on the ground. Was the same with takeaway pints earlier in the pandemic. You've got one group of society shocked and appalled when its brought to their attention, and another group wondering how its taken them so long to notice.

    While I don't disagree with your analysis, just wanted to point out that our case numbers have stayed pretty stable at around 350 ish for a good while now despite vaccination, and these cases are mainly in the 19 to 24 year olds .
    So while we may not see a spike per se we are not going to see those numbers dropping until they either stop socialising or get vaccinated , which we can surmise neither may happen .
    Would not affect hospitalisations or ICU cases much I hear you say and agree again .
    Not going to help us if a variant of concern gets into the melting pot though .


  • #4497
    PTH2009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,785 ✭✭✭✭PTH2009


    CruelSummer wrote: »
    NPHET’s contributions today only clarified what is already widely known. They are wrong on antigen testing. They are pretending we will miss ‘asymptomatic cases’ when in actual fact antigen tests are used to measure if a person is infectious at that point in time.
    The worst and frankly most outrageous contribution came from a NPHET member demonstrating how to fake an at home antigen test kit.
    No one in the aviation or other industries suggested using home kits. Their assertion that it would take 80 nurses to run antigen tests for a gig of 8,000 highlights the fact they know this but still went along with cuckoo internet science to back up their argument.
    If I was in working in the decimated travel sector, entertainment or other affected industries this evening, I would be rightly outraged. They didn’t even read the commissioned report on antigen testing according to Dr Glynn. Jobs, our connectivity, everything is in jeopardy from this.
    The Government are worse for hiding behind Dr Holohan & NPHET - instead of looking at international evidence & best practices + actually governing. NPHET are who they are, an ultra conservative group of doctors, some with a God complex. They are not evil boogey men but they showed their utter disregard for the Irish population & their intelligence with the contributions today & need to be overruled on this.

    Very true and the EU won't step in either

    Truly were in a farcical state with nobody in the Government willing to stand up to NPHET and Dr Tony. There rejecting advice that has be proven successfully all over Europe


  • #4498
    Ficheall
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,042 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    Timmy O Toole wrote: »
    .. with the chair of NPHET making millions every week off PCR testing
    What's this?


  • #4499
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ficheall wrote: »
    What's this?

    A lie


  • #4500
    thejuggler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 922 ✭✭✭thejuggler


    We will ever see a daily county by county breakdown of cases again? Also how many Covid deaths have been recorded in the last month? ICU numbers down by 4 today - hopefully discharged to regular wards but sadly it’s possible that some may have lost their fight too.


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  • #4501
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,413 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Timmy O Toole wrote: »
    Sounds like Michael Martin is planning on getting pilots and air traffic controllers working in wind farms.

    Its absolutely disgusting that he can completely ignore the question on the conflict of interest with the chair of NPHET making millions every week off PCR testing.

    https://twitter.com/MlMcNamaraTD/status/1405142348309446658?s=19

    Hopefully Micheal Martin can work a mike though , unlike Michael McNamara .


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