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National Broadband Ireland : implementation and progress

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  • Registered Users Posts: 455 ✭✭TheSegal


    NBAiii wrote: »
    Are you sure it is not one NBI distribution point and one eir DP? I haven't come across two DPs on one pole from the same company and I don't see why it would be required.

    It must be the case, but I don't recall an Eir DP on that pole in the past unless they did something recently in that area.

    Seeing a lot of progress around my area this week. New pipes laid, fiber already pulled through them, and today they are splicing it in the van. Looks like someone lit a fire under the contractors with the amount that has been done just this past week alone around Carnmore/Turloughmore/Oranmore (Galway).


  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭Mor-Riomhaire


    Outside Roscommon town, KN crew out here with a Van, and digger. Scheduled for AUG-OCT 2021 connection. Pre-order put in with local provider already. Not sure what's happening to be honest. Lots of looking into the manhole cover going on.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭heavydawson


    I came across this today while looking for NBI related information. There's a clear callout that from initial survey to availability, the expectation is 18 months:

    http://ailg.ie/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/20210326_DECC-AILG-PresentationFinal.pdf

    There's some other interesting info in there about the state of the rollout as it was on March 26th this year
    Apologies if this was posted before!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,099 ✭✭✭Redriddick


    Outside Roscommon town, KN crew out here with a Van, and digger. Scheduled for AUG-OCT 2021 connection. Pre-order put in with local provider already. Not sure what's happening to be honest. Lots of looking into the manhole cover going on.

    Athlone side??


  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭Mor-Riomhaire


    Redriddick wrote: »
    Athlone side??

    Lanesboro side. They were out there for about 3.5 hours. Had a white spool on back of van being fed into man hole cover. Digger was busy in action as well.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭Mor-Riomhaire


    They have moved on further down the road now. Strange, because it looks just like the initial build work they did back in February, could it be possibly blowing fibre now?


  • Registered Users Posts: 494 ✭✭EarWig


    There's a clear callout that from initial survey to availability, the expectation is 18 months:
    With 250,000 surveyed, there is zero chance they will be connected in 18 months.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,521 ✭✭✭joe123


    EarWig wrote: »
    With 250,000 surveyed, there is zero chance they will be connected in 18 months.

    222,905 - Premises Surveyed


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,697 ✭✭✭MoodeRator


    They have moved on further down the road now. Strange, because it looks just like the initial build work they did back in February, could it be possibly blowing fibre now?

    All roads leaving Roscommon Town have the same install dates of Aug-Oct. The white cable is the actual fibre being blown now, the same is happenning on our side of town also :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,639 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    We were surveyed in January 2020. Down as July-August. So maybe 18 months is right.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 455 ✭✭TheSegal


    They have moved on further down the road now. Strange, because it looks just like the initial build work they did back in February, could it be possibly blowing fibre now?

    Exact same thing that happened on my road. Said that they are back to pass all of the fiber through the ducting they laid months back, along with some new ducting put in and a few new poles aswell. They didn't do it all during the Winter with the initial works as some planning was still being done


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,042 ✭✭✭kaizersoze


    Outside Roscommon town, KN crew out here with a Van, and digger. Scheduled for AUG-OCT 2021 connection. Pre-order put in with local provider already. Not sure what's happening to be honest. Lots of looking into the manhole cover going on.
    KN? Haven't seen them doing anything for NBI, atleast not around here. Could be Eir work?
    MoodeRator wrote: »
    All roads leaving Roscommon Town have the same install dates of Aug-Oct. The white cable is the actual fibre being blown now, the same is happenning on our side of town also :)

    White 'cable' is just the sub-duct. The fiber is black.


  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭Mor-Riomhaire


    kaizersoze wrote: »
    KN? Haven't seen them doing anything for NBI, at least not around here. Could be Eir work?

    White 'cable' is just the sub-duct. The fiber is black.

    The crew were wearing jackets that stated KN, working on behalf of NBI. They ran the white cable all the way down to the existing installation of the Eir FTTH. The digger was busy alright. Took them most of the day.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    TimHorton wrote: »
    NBI are incompetent, Putting up welcome advertising billboards and bus shelter posters in the wrong county (30 miles from border)

    Why are they wasting money on giant billboard ads ANYWHERE? Been one in this part of Limerick County for weeks and the best guess for the area is 2nd half 2022 or in fact never. Fibre is about 100m away.
    But Eircom and all the resellers are selling the VDSL as Fibre (because the Exchange 1km away is fibre! Duh!) and the VDSL is only about 20% to 25% faster than the ADSL2+ was.
    IMO we are 12+ years behind and the previous NBS Ryan signed off simply paid for some of Three's Mobile masts. Not a single broadband connection.
    Comreg is in the pocket of Mobile and Eircom are a foreign company that has moved to the Channel Is for tax reasons.


  • Registered Users Posts: 33,790 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    NBI out pulling fibre in Arklow town today few KN network vans obo NBI.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Jofspring wrote: »
    NBI checker at this stage just seems like a complete waste of time.
    Two years ago it was saying end of year or start of next. Now it's saying 2nd half of next year, maybe Jul-Dec 2022.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,737 ✭✭✭Hococop


    On pre order 6-7 weeks now, should we be ok at this stage or is there a chance of a delay?, looking at all the pre orders and see eir is trying to get ready so might hold out for them, I'm out the limerick side


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭heavydawson



    The state’s multibillion-euro National Broadband Plan has connected fewer than 650 homes and businesses to high-speed internet in its first 18 months, raising fresh concerns over its ability to service to 1.1 million people by 2027.

    National Broadband Ireland (NBI), the company awarded the €2.7 billion contract to deliver the rural scheme, last week confirmed that it had made the service available to just over 4,000 premises to date, out of a target of 115,000 by the end of 2021.

    The Business Post has learned that of the 4,378 homes and businesses passed so far, just 632 have been connected. This suggests an early take-up rate of about 14 per cent by those with access to broadband through the National Broadband Plan.

    A spokesman for NBI said that as a wholesaler it was responsible for designing, building and operating the network but not for selling to end users.

    “[We] cannot predict the level of demand that would ultimately lead to connections on the network,” a spokesman said.

    A spokesman for the Department of Communications said almost 19,000 premises across Cavan; Carrigaline, Co Cork; Limerick and Galway could order or pre-order broadband through the National Broadband Plan which is intended to provide high-speed broadband to 544,000 premises and 1.1 million people, largely in rural areas.

    “NBI expects to pass 7,000-10,000 premises per month by the end of the year, at which stage connections will significantly ramp up across all counties. Connections to the network are demand-driven by households and businesses,” he said.

    The news that 0.11 per cent of premises covered by the National Broadband Plan have been connected is likely to heap further pressure on the government and NBI over the pace of progress as people struggle with poor broadband connections across much of the country.

    NBI’s 1,000 contractors were allowed to continue work during the Covid-19 restrictions this year but the government has said the pandemic caused a delay in recruiting and training workers. The company slashed its full-year target to between 50,000 and 60,000 premises passed on the back of the significant delays.

    Last week it turned to GE Digital, a subsidiary of the US multinational conglomerate, to help “model, manage, and streamline” the rollout.

    The small number of homes connected to the network, coupled with delays in passing premises, is also set to raise further questions about the feasibility of cutting the rollout timeline from seven years to five, as the government and NBI are seeking to do.

    Both parties are locked in discussions in a bid to expedite the connection of premises currently scheduled for link-up in years six and seven.

    Eamon Ryan, the communications minister, and Ossian Smyth, the department’s junior minister, have both said a “new contract” is being worked on but both their department and NBI have confirmed that the intention is to alter the existing contract signed in 2019 rather than to agree a new one.

    “Any acceleration to the build programme will require modifications to the main contract signed in 2019. While the main build partners will not change, NBI are exploring all options available in the market to help expedite the build.

    “Exploring the potential to accelerate the network rollout is being undertaken in parallel with the measures required to mitigate delays arising as a result of Covid-19. It is premature at this stage to speculate what the outcome of these discussions may be,” a department spokesman said.

    Neither NBI nor the Department of Communications expects an acceleration of the plan to result in an additional subsidy above the €2.7 billion cost of the plan being paid by the state.
    https://www.businesspost.ie/infrastructure/national-broadband-rollout-connects-just-632-premises-to-date-3afc6d69
    This suggests an early take-up rate of about 14 per cent by those with access to broadband through the National Broadband Plan.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,521 ✭✭✭joe123


    14% uptake seems low.

    Wonder is that impacted by them rolling out in areas that already have speeds of 90Mb like some reports suggested.

    Did they announce what they expcted uptake to be? I know my estate here of 100+ houses, uptake would be almost 100%, everyone is going mad over the **** broadband :pac:


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭celtic_oz


    National Broadband Plan has connected fewer than 650 homes and businesses to high-speed internet in its first 18 months

    My God, what a joke


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,639 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    If I didn't follow this thread and do my own research I'd have known nothing, absolutely nothing, about the rollout. What other sort of uptake did they expect with little to no marketing?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭heavydawson


    joe123 wrote: »
    14% uptake seems low.

    Wonder is that impacted by them rolling out in areas that already have speeds of 90Mb like some reports suggested.

    Did they announce what they expcted uptake to be? I know my estate here of 100+ houses, uptake would be almost 100%, everyone is going mad over the **** broadband :pac:

    You have to factor in the make-up of the population in the countryside. How many of those houses passed are people that:
    1. Never had a need for internet (and still dont)
    2. Already have sufficient bandwidth for their current needs
    3. Are currently tied to an existing contract
    4. Are simply afraid of change

    The members of boards are _generally_ tech savvy in the first place, and it will seem obvious to any of us that NBI is a no-brainer if our premises was passed. However, that doesn't hold for many people.

    I think it'll be a combination of:
    1. Early adopters singing its praises (hopefully) by word of mouth in their local communities
    2. The bigger non-ISP-exclusive resellers up-selling their packages come renewal time to bundle fibre (think Vodafone/Sky/Three ,etc.). Basically triple (or quadruple, whatever)-play packages that now include NBI. In other words you'll connect to NBI as part of a bigger package.

    Remember it's not up to NBI to sell their infrastructure to the end user. It's up to the likes of Sky, Vodafone, etc to do the selling of their services!
    NBI have been active on local newspapers/radios, and this makes sense, as they're trying to raise awareness of the project in areas where end users will see work happening.

    I've seen nothing from any of the ISPs in my letterbox about forthcoming NBI go-lives in my areas (and it's due Aug-Oct). I'd hope to start seeing something around July/August about pre-orders, but they may simply wait until the network is live.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭dam099


    You have to factor in the make-up of the population in the countryside. How many of those houses passed are people that:
    1. Never had a need for internet (and still dont)
    2. Already have sufficient bandwidth for their current needs
    3. Are currently tied to an existing contract
    4. Are simply afraid of change

    The members of boards are _generally_ tech savvy in the first place, and it will seem obvious to any of us that NBI is a no-brainer if our premises was passed. However, that doesn't hold for many people.

    I think it'll be a combination of:
    1. Early adopters singing its praises (hopefully) by word of mouth in their local communities
    2. The bigger non-ISP-exclusive resellers up-selling their packages come renewal time to bundle fibre (think Vodafone/Sky/Three ,etc.). Basically triple (or quadruple, whatever)-play packages that now include NBI. In other words you'll connect to NBI as part of a bigger package.

    Remember it's not up to NBI to sell their infrastructure to the end user. It's up to the likes of Sky, Vodafone, etc to do the selling of their services!
    NBI have been active on local newspapers/radios, and this makes sense, as they're trying to raise awareness of the project in areas where end users will see work happening.

    I've seen nothing from any of the ISPs in my letterbox about forthcoming NBI go-lives in my areas (and it's due Aug-Oct). I'd hope to start seeing something around July/August about pre-orders, but they may simply wait until the network is live.

    Plus sounds like there is active disinformation from some WISPs. Anecdotal I know but one poster earlier in this thread was saying a salesman claimed Wireless was superior as speeds were constrained when using wires.

    There are lots of people out there who have little knowledge about the different technologies being used to deliver broadband/midband and their relative strengths and weaknesses who would buy that bullsh$t or just have no inkling of how much superior FTTH probably is versus their current service.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,521 ✭✭✭joe123


    You have to factor in the make-up of the population in the countryside. How many of those houses passed are people that:
    1. Never had a need for internet (and still dont)
    2. Already have sufficient bandwidth for their current needs
    3. Are currently tied to an existing contract
    4. Are simply afraid of change

    The members of boards are _generally_ tech savvy in the first place, and it will seem obvious to any of us that NBI is a no-brainer if our premises was passed. However, that doesn't hold for many people.

    I think it'll be a combination of:
    1. Early adopters singing its praises (hopefully) by word of mouth in their local communities
    2. The bigger non-ISP-exclusive resellers up-selling their packages come renewal time to bundle fibre (think Vodafone/Sky/Three ,etc.). Basically triple (or quadruple, whatever)-play packages that now include NBI. In other words you'll connect to NBI as part of a bigger package.

    Remember it's not up to NBI to sell their infrastructure to the end user. It's up to the likes of Sky, Vodafone, etc to do the selling of their services!
    NBI have been active on local newspapers/radios, and this makes sense, as they're trying to raise awareness of the project in areas where end users will see work happening.

    I've seen nothing from any of the ISPs in my letterbox about forthcoming NBI go-lives in my areas (and it's due Aug-Oct). I'd hope to start seeing something around July/August about pre-orders, but they may simply wait until the network is live.

    Yeah totally agree. We are the 1% here on boards.

    I wonder how pushed ISP retailers will be to push this though. Im paying Vodafone the same now for crap VDSL as I would be for Fibre 500Mb package.

    I've also seen a big big increase in Imagine advertising around the area over the last while. So can only assume these will be the houses ISP's will target mainly but those folks will be likely stuck on long term contracts for the most part.

    Im sure NBI have factored expected uptake in. Would love to know what the numbers they were thinking in the early stages.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭dam099


    joe123 wrote: »
    I wonder how pushed ISP retailers will be to push this though. Im paying Vodafone the same now for crap VDSL as I would be for Fibre 500Mb package.

    Vodafone have been quite aggressive about trying to move customers to FTTH to the extent of sending letters implying they may not be able to continue service to customers who don't move.

    I would think as long as the wholesale cost to them isn't significantly higher they would push it as FTTH potentially creates less support calls than barely hanging on copper lines.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,042 ✭✭✭kaizersoze


    This is a 30 plan, Everybody isn't going to jump on it straight away. Take up will build as time advances. In 5 to 10 years it will be very difficult to access any service without internet access. For some that time is now.

    IIRC eir FTTH take up was shockingly poor initally and possibly still is.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭heavydawson


    Customer-Generation-graph-updated-5June-1.jpg?resize=768%2C486&ssl=1

    Probably a good thing to keep in mind when people talk about uptake.

    And a quote from http://ireland2050.ie/past/electricity/ :
    The 1920s also saw a major leap forward in the electricity landscape in Ireland, with the construction of the Shannon Hydroelectric scheme at Ardnacrusha, Co Limerick. This was a massive undertaking for the newly established Irish Free State. Built at a cost of £5.2 million (about one-fifth of the state’s total budget) and employing 5,200 construction workers at its peak, Ardnacrusha was the largest hydroelectric scheme in the world, until it was overtaken by the Hoover dam scheme in the 1930s. It had enough capacity to meet almost all of Ireland’s electricity needs for the early years of the Free State. The transmission lines that were established to bring power from Ardnacrusha to the major urban centres became the foundation for the national grid.

    In the 1930s, demand for electricity doubled as more and more households were connected to the grid. More power stations were built and there was further investment into the transmission network. The importance of having alternative energy sources became evident when incidences of drought and blizzard damage resulted in brief cases of reduced output.

    Negotiations to build a turf-fired power station at Portarlington began despite reservations of increasing costs and uncertainties regarding the quality of turf. During the Second World War, coal quality deteriorated and difficulties in obtaining coal resulted in the rationing of electricity. Towards the end of 1943/44, fuel deliveries were confined to slurry which was almost unusable.

    The cessation of war and the resulting upsurge in demand on the existing generation and transmission system led to the creation of the Rural Electrification Scheme, with the aim of delivering electricity to almost half a million rural homes. By 1949, about 284,000 electricity consumers were connected. At this time domestic consumption, although growing, was under 300 million units of electricity, less than the available capacity at Ardnacrusha.

    TLDR; Even 20 years after Ardnacrusha was built, domestic consumption still wasn't using all of its output.


  • Registered Users Posts: 455 ✭✭TheSegal


    dam099 wrote: »
    Plus sounds like there is active disinformation from some WISPs. Anecdotal I know but one poster earlier in this thread was saying a salesman claimed Wireless was superior as speeds were constrained when using wires.

    Correct, that was from me. I've made sure over the last few months to let all family, friends, and neighbours know about fiber being available in the next few months. Hence some of my frustration about the delay as people signed up with ISPs with max speeds of ~10MB but with contracts that can be upgraded to fiber in what should have been the next month or two back in March, rather than Imagine with speeds up to 150MB when the sun and stars align but also with no possibility of upgrading to fiber until a 2 year contract is expired.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭heavydawson


    Interestingly enough, NBI.ie seems to have updated their homepage numbers today:
    wAGgFRT.png
    vs previously:
    QJbFnh4.png

    Where is the 19k premises available to order coming from if they've confirmed to the SBP only a week and a half ago that ~4000 homes were passed?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 494 ✭✭EarWig


    And they can't spell received....


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