parkrun, lap two

ger664 · 09-06-2021 6:19pm

Any thing other then print your barcode and turn up @ 9:30 is not going to be entertained. As an ED keeping it as simple as possible makes the core teams life easy and takes up the least amount of time to run events on a week to week basics.

Asking the sub 25 minutes runners not to show goes complete against the participation ethos of parkrun

Pawwed Rig · 09-06-2021 8:30pm

ger664 wrote: »

Asking the sub 25 minutes runners not to show goes complete against the participation ethos of parkrun

I think it was a joke tbf

hurleronditch · 09-06-2021 8:43pm

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

I think it was a joke tbf

I don’t think it was. I’d personally tell the over 30 minuters to bog off, they’re only having a jog or a walk anyways......

The theme that the system has to be kept as simple as possible and we need to be back at almost full societal opening for a return is very frustrating. Given how big a movement parkrun is surely a run tracking service like Strava or an upstart competitor could potentially have provided a solution which married the existing parkrun scanners with some form of time tracking which didnt require handing out tags and massive funnelling of people at the finish, which I imagine is part of the concern.

Either way, whenever we do get back, the first few weeks will be completely mental. There’s more people running than ever before over the last year with gyms closed, and surely a booking system of some sort may be needed if it really is mad

Murph_D · 09-06-2021 9:00pm

hurleronditch wrote: »

I don’t think it was. I’d personally tell the over 30 minuters to bog off, they’re only having a jog or a walk anyways......

The theme that the system has to be kept as simple as possible and we need to be back at almost full societal opening for a return is very frustrating. Given how big a movement parkrun is surely a run tracking service like Strava or an upstart competitor could potentially have provided a solution which married the existing parkrun scanners with some form of time tracking which didnt require handing out tags and massive funnelling of people at the finish, which I imagine is part of the concern.

Either way, whenever we do get back, the first few weeks will be completely mental. There’s more people running than ever before over the last year with gyms closed, and surely a booking system of some sort may be needed if it really is mad

Almost everything in this post demonstrates a fundamental lack of appreciation of how - and more importantly, why - parkrun works as well as it does, and has been so successful.

People don’t have to do parkrun. if you want chip timing, there will be plenty of pay-to-run races available soon enough.

hurleronditch · 09-06-2021 10:21pm

Murph_D wrote: »

Almost everything in this post demonstrates a fundamental lack of appreciation of how - and more importantly, why - parkrun works as well as it does, and has been so successful.

People don’t have to do parkrun. if you want chip timing, there will be plenty of pay-to-run races available soon enough.

I don’t want chip timing. I want to try and find ways in which parkrun can be run as early as possible and have as low risk of covid transmission as possible.

I know exactly why parkrun is a success, I have completed many and volunteered at both adult and junior parkrun. You might think I have a fundamental lack of appreciation for why parkrun is what it is, that couldn’t be further from the truth, what I am suggesting is that the seeming lack of willingness to explore any other solutions which would possibly provide such an amazing free service to the masses, other than “we will only return when we can do things exactly the way we used to” isn’t the only way of thinking about things will remaining true to the ethos of parkrun.

My over 30 joke was clearly tongue in cheek by the way, on the basis the poster who commented on the under 25s was doing similar, which I’m not certain of.

ger664 · 09-06-2021 11:45pm

hurleronditch wrote: »

I don’t want chip timing. I want to try and find ways in which parkrun can be run as early as possible and have as low risk of covid transmission as possible.

We are not obliged to have a timed run just a safe run. So if handing out tokens and scanning etc presents a risk to volunteers and runners we can proceed without timing the run

Barcodes scanned at the end without cross contamination for contact tracing proposes and proof of participation.

Mar Azul · 10-06-2021 9:09am

hurleronditch wrote: »

Given how big a movement parkrun is surely a run tracking service like Strava or an upstart competitor could potentially have provided a solution which married the existing parkrun scanners with some form of time tracking which didnt require handing out tags and massive funnelling of people at the finish, which I imagine is part of the concern.

I think this is a great idea, I know my local parkrun is down as a segment. Surely a software update could be made to correlate results.
Although I'm not too sure strava play well with others.

robinph · 10-06-2021 9:33am

Mar Azul wrote: »

I think this is a great idea, I know my local parkrun is down as a segment. Surely a software update could be made to correlate results.
Although I'm not too sure strava play well with others.

There was a couple of years when Strava and parkrun were linking peoples profiles together and you had a link to Strava from parkrun results pages.

Can't remember why that was dropped.

hurleronditch · 10-06-2021 10:30am

ger664 wrote: »

We are not obliged to have a timed run just a safe run. So if handing out tokens and scanning etc presents a risk to volunteers and runners we can proceed without timing the run

Barcodes scanned at the end without cross contamination for contact tracing proposes and proof of participation.

No, we’re not obliged to have a timed run, but I think it’s a benefit most people like. I assume running tracking apps would only love a link up like this, which would guarantee sign ups and users, to the point I expect they would offer the service for free.

Turn up at the run site, check in on your Strava which is paired with your parkrun ID, one volunteer organiser presses “go” on the central timer, and Strava checks everyone off as they cross the line automatically. Why we use barcodes at all in this day and age does slightly baffle me.

robinph · 10-06-2021 11:05am

The Strava app or GPS watches are nowhere near accurate enough for that kind of automation to happen. OK, so does it really matter if its accurate for a parkrun, maybe not, but the barcode scanning system is pretty simple and accurate without needing much effort. Don't see that there would be much to gain by adding the complication of a system like Strava.

hurleronditch · 10-06-2021 12:16pm

robinph wrote: »

The Strava app or GPS watches are nowhere near accurate enough for that kind of automation to happen. OK, so does it really matter if its accurate for a parkrun, maybe not, but the barcode scanning system is pretty simple and accurate without needing much effort. Don't see that there would be much to gain by adding the complication of a system like Strava.

You’re saying Strava isn’t accurate enough to simply verify that the user has reached the finishing area in an approximate time, having travelled something in the region of 5k? Really.

It doesn’t need to be accurate to the inch, for the purposes of a parkrun it needs to have geo-located itself and been logged in at the start, have the clock started centrally by the admin user, and then verify that the person is within close proximity of then finsh line/admin “phone” having run something close to 5k (so as not to get confused on a multi lap course). If the person runs 4.9k or 5.05k, or it times 26.55 or 27.01 doesn’t matter for a parkrun, that’s as accurate as it currently is and it doesn’t involve handling barcodes

Pawwed Rig · 10-06-2021 12:37pm

Would you need to carry your phone with you then while running? That's me out then :pac:

robinph · 10-06-2021 1:39pm

Just over a parkrun distance you could have a 100m or so difference more or less than the 5km each week you run the same course which could make significant difference to the timings in the results.

Mostly the problem would be that it doesn't actually gain us anything useful, and just makes taking part in parkrun more complicated for a large number of people. How do you deal with junior events or kids taking part in 5km parkrun's, does having a GPS watch for each kid then become a requirement?

hurleronditch · 10-06-2021 1:57pm

robinph wrote: »

Just over a parkrun distance you could have a 100m or so difference more or less than the 5km each week you run the same course which could make significant difference to the timings in the results.

Mostly the problem would be that it doesn't actually gain us anything useful, and just makes taking part in parkrun more complicated for a large number of people. How do you deal with junior events or kids taking part in 5km parkrun's, does having a GPS watch for each kid then become a requirement?

But it’s “only” a parkrun, not a race for prizes. So if it stops yours or mine time 100m short, it’s not the end of the world. Alternatively you have an honesty system on the app, and you hit a stop button when you’ve crossed the line, and the app verifies you are in the right place (roughly).

I agree the kids point is fair, but for adults almost everyone has a functioning smartphone these days.

Look I know it’s unlikely to happen, but it’s clear the barcode and token system with queuing in funnels is not in any way efficient, nor attractive from a Covid perspective, and I know the Strava solution is unlikely to ever happen, I would just like a bit more lateral thinking than we’ll only reopen when we could do things the way we always have.

robinph · 10-06-2021 2:56pm

hurleronditch wrote: »

I agree the kids point is fair, but for adults almost everyone has a functioning smartphone these days.

Most of our circles of friends will have smart phones and Garmins and be familiar with how Strava works and know its not a race or accurately measured etc. But we are not the primary target for parkruns mission.

It's the people who are not active that they want to reach, and keeping things as simple as possible and with as few barriers to entry is very important in that. The needing a printed out barcode is a barrier at the moment which people keep pointing out, but I'd expect that to change within a year of things getting back to normal and they figure out a simple app to deal with barcodes on phones, although you still have a problem with kids and phones then.

Running apps seem very simple and obvious to us, but they are not, and they don't run on many older phones of which there are far more than just the latest Apple or Samsung that rich people in the West might have.

robinph · 10-06-2021 4:32pm

All NI parkruns have approval from landowners now:

https://twitter.com/wehttam57/status/1403010733646942208?s=19

Pherekydes · 10-06-2021 4:38pm

Time to restart the island?

ger664 · 10-06-2021 5:53pm

hurleronditch wrote: »

No, we’re not obliged to have a timed run, but I think it’s a benefit most people like. I assume running tracking apps would only love a link up like this, which would guarantee sign ups and users, to the point I expect they would offer the service for free.

Turn up at the run site, check in on your Strava which is paired with your parkrun ID, one volunteer organiser presses “go” on the central timer, and Strava checks everyone off as they cross the line automatically. Why we use barcodes at all in this day and age does slightly baffle me.

Not everyone can afford a GPS watch or has the luxury of access to a computer. Doing this would prevent them from participating in parkrun

The Black Oil · 10-06-2021 6:21pm

Pherekydes wrote: »

Time to restart the island?

Cue Lost flashbacks.

Genghis · 10-06-2021 7:24pm

robinph wrote: »

All NI parkruns have approval from landowners now:

https://twitter.com/wehttam57/status/1403010733646942208?s=19

Excellent news. I wonder when consultation begins on this side of the border. I guess when it's clearer that mass partication events like Parkrun may go ahead.

hurleronditch · 10-06-2021 7:57pm

ger664 wrote: »

Not everyone can afford a GPS watch or has the luxury of access to a computer. Doing this would prevent them from participating in parkrun

If you don’t have access to a computer how would you sign up currently? Does it not require an online signup?

Obviously anyone can turn up at half 9 and run with the group, but if you want your time tracked you need computer access, Strava or no Strava under the current setup

Dudda · 11-06-2021 11:05am

hurleronditch wrote: »

If you don’t have access to a computer how would you sign up currently? Does it not require an online signup?

Obviously anyone can turn up at half 9 and run with the group, but if you want your time tracked you need computer access, Strava or no Strava under the current setup

I set it up for my Dad and printed and laminated a few barcodes for him. He walks with a friend. Now he has since got a smartphone but didn't 2 years ago. Covid has forced him to slowly learn how to use WhatsApp. He can read emails but then has to ring them to answer questions as he doesn't know how to reply. He's not looking at the online results to see if he got a PB and probably doesn't know what PB stands for. For the last year he calls around to my house (5 minutes away) every 2 months where I login to a Zoom meeting for a local community group he's involved in.
He loves his walk but if he had to use any type of app for Parkrun he's be lost.

average_runner · 11-06-2021 11:09am

hurleronditch wrote: »

If you don’t have access to a computer how would you sign up currently? Does it not require an online signup?

Obviously anyone can turn up at half 9 and run with the group, but if you want your time tracked you need computer access, Strava or no Strava under the current setup

Can do this all on your mobile. There will be generations that will struggle so probably not the best solution.

Parkrun also use the wrist bands with the barcodes on it, if everyone buys them, then no contact be needed

robinph · 11-06-2021 1:26pm

Yay:

https://twitter.com/parkrunUK/status/1403321152278310912

Van.Bosch · 12-06-2021 12:45am

robinph wrote: »

Yay:

https://twitter.com/parkrunUK/status/1403321152278310912

Great news - genuinely thinking of heading north for one. Might give it a few weeks to normalise.

Is that something that is looked down on?

Genghis · 12-06-2021 2:50pm

Latest episode of Free Weekly Timed podcast is all about Parkrun restarting in England (with a small mention of N. Ireland).

Features Nick Person, Global CEO of Parkrun and goes into some detail about the challenge of trying to work with hundreds of land owners, many local councils, etc and how close he feels it came to the end of Parkrun. Also good insight into why they didn't pursue 'changing the model' to enable any old re-start, why it had to be as close as possible to normal - or nothing.

Would love after England resumes to hear about the efforts made in other countries, like ROI.

Link or search in your podcast app

Pawwed Rig · 12-06-2021 2:57pm

Are parkrun Ireland saying anything?

diceyreilly · 12-06-2021 3:27pm

Van.Bosch wrote: »

Great news - genuinely thinking of heading north for one. Might give it a few weeks to normalise.

Is that something that is looked down on?

Do it if you want to. Who cares if some people look down on it. There’s always going to be a few. I couldn’t care less what strangers think and certainly wouldn’t alter my movements because of them.
However. I most definitely wouldn’t travel 80k for a 25 min run.

The Black Oil · 12-06-2021 5:12pm

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Are parkrun Ireland saying anything?

Saw this on Malahide's FB, posted June 6th.

Hi all,

Everything is looking so much more positive. As of yet we don’t have a date to return but the following countries are expected to restart over the coming weeks they are as follows:

12 June- Poland
19 June- Denmark
20 June- Scotland (junior)
26 June- England & Northern Ireland (tbc)
3 July - France & Scotland (tbc)

We are sooo looking forward to be posting about our return hopefully in the near future and are looking forward to having you all back at Malahide parkrun.

opus · 14-06-2021 8:37pm

See it's July now for England.

Following the announcement this evening from the Prime Minister, confirming a delay to Step 4 of the Roadmap until Monday 19 July 2021, it is now our intention that 5k events in England will restart on Saturday 24 July.

Genghis · 14-06-2021 8:52pm

opus wrote: »

See it's July now for England.

Yep, seen that. No mention of NI.

https://blog.parkrun.com/uk/2021/06/14/statement-in-response-to-roadmap-announcement/

Sunny Dayz · 15-06-2021 12:51pm

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Are parkrun Ireland saying anything?

There seems to be radio silence from parkrun Ireland. I've bumped into a few fellow parkrunners the past month since small group training etc started and all have wondered when parkrun will be starting back, how much they will look forward to it and are hopeful for a return soon.

aquinn · 16-06-2021 3:38pm

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

There seems to be radio silence from parkrun Ireland. I've bumped into a few fellow parkrunners the past month since small group training etc started and all have wondered when parkrun will be starting back, how much they will look forward to it and are hopeful for a return soon.

https://twitter.com/wehttam57/status/1405146064110379010

Challenging why it isn't back anyway.

Sunny Dayz · 17-06-2021 9:51am

That’s something at least aquinn.

Broke my heart yesterday - my teenager has been a bit difficult to motivate for running lately, even since his training started back (I think being one of the oldest in the juvenile club has something to do with it) but he said he’ll pick up the running again when parkrun starts back. Must try and get back into the habit of doing a (not)parkrun at parkrun time, especially now he’s on his holidays from school. But it’s really something if even he’s saying he misses parkrun events and wants them back.

The Davestator · 17-06-2021 7:18pm

Does anyone know if Marlay Park and St. Anne's routes are market with permanent signage like Malahide?

py · 17-06-2021 7:30pm

The Davestator wrote: »

Does anyone know if Marlay Park and St. Anne's routes are market with permanent signage like Malahide?

Marlay is not.

Duzzie · 17-06-2021 7:57pm

Apologies if this goes against the forum policies but it is parkrun related. Regular parkrunners may have come across Stuart Van Der Bliake. He is a parkrun ambassador, runs the Heritage Junior parkrun in Wexford with his wife Nemone and is a frequent parkrun tourist. Stuart went missing in Rosslare on Monday night and hasn't been seen since. Needless to say, his wife and family are extremely concerned about him and want him to come back home. If anyone has seen Stuart please contact Wexford Garda Station. Please also share on social media to try to get Stuart home.
https://www.garda.ie/en/about-us/our-departments/office-of-corporate-communications/press-releases/2021/june/missing-person-appeal-stuart-van-der-bliake-59-years-county-wexford.html

https://www.facebook.com/208039342609720/posts/4226347974112150

Murph_D · 17-06-2021 7:58pm

The Davestator wrote: »

Does anyone know if Marlay Park and St. Anne's routes are market with permanent signage like Malahide?

Not St. Anne's either.

Butterbeans · 17-06-2021 9:17pm

The Davestator wrote: »

Does anyone know if Marlay Park and St. Anne's routes are market with permanent signage like Malahide?

I know not what you asked, but if you're looking for other options, the route in Waterstown Park in Palmerstown has km markers.

Dub13 · 20-06-2021 5:29pm

I wonder if St. Anne's will get the original course back with the market now at the finish area.

Pawwed Rig · 20-06-2021 5:53pm

Dub13 wrote: »

I wonder if St. Anne's will get the original course back with the market now at the finish area.

I was only asking that last week. That is not the only issue either. There is now a coffee shack and related queues at the golf course and with the parents not allowed in the all weather anymore the path up that way is completely blocked from 9:50. Also there is now U7 GAA up on the pitches at the top corner (and related parents, toddlers, bicycles). The park has moved on in the absence of parkrun and will take a fair bit of compromise to get it back in the same spot.
It make have to move elsewhere in the park.

opus · 22-06-2021 7:16am

Handy chart here.

https://twitter.com/parkrunIE/status/1407012960535519244

average_runner · 22-06-2021 9:37am

opus wrote: »

Handy chart here.

https://twitter.com/parkrunIE/status/1407012960535519244

Good chart. I think Ireland will be Sept if lucky.

Genghis · 26-06-2021 12:02pm

Very enjoyable Parkrun in Derry this morning. About 100 participating, the usual positive, friendly and safe atmosphere, hopefully these can resume in ROI soon. Only difference worth noting was the course was 300m longer to use a bigger start space.

Skid X · 27-06-2021 7:10pm

BBC NI news report on the Stormont parkrun yesterday

Good to see it

https://twitter.com/bbcnewsline/status/1408805022670987266

Mar Azul · 02-07-2021 6:34pm

https://youtu.be/mypHqRgBoBI

Marlay Parkrun course preview from 3'44.
Might be helpful to those who've never done it before. Hope you enjoy.

Gael23 · 02-07-2021 7:53pm

Any sign of a restart date?

Mar Azul · 02-07-2021 8:36pm

Gael23 wrote: »

Any sign of a restart date?

Nothing as yet. I'm a little concerned that parkrun may not return to Marlay.
The park has become very busy as a result of covid, which on one hand is great but will dlr (Council) want to disrupt the new eco system. A lot will depend on what relationship dlr and parkrun have I guess.

robinph · 02-07-2021 9:01pm

Matt Shields was on the FWT podcast this week. Said that the 500 limit was good, but they are still in discussions about what that means for parkrun. Didn't make any firm guess as to when it would restart when Vassos was pushing him, gently, for a date.

Pawwed Rig · 03-07-2021 8:58am

What is the 500 limit about and how could it possibly be enforced?

parkrun, lap two

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