Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI Read OP For Mod Warnings

PTH2009 · 10-06-2021 01:44PM

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0610/1227244-coronavirus-global/

Might be an indication of where we could be going

PhoneMain · 10-06-2021 01:51PM

AdamD wrote: »

What Tony and many on here don't seem to grasp is that the person in Circle K is going to the party anyway, the antigen test isn't going to increase their likelihood of going, but it giving them a positive result will reduce their likelihood of going.

Will it really? I have had plenty of patients who are walking around the place with new onset cough who wont allow themselves to be referred for testing.

Klonker · 10-06-2021 01:54PM

Graham wrote: »

While I can't speak for others, I don't find a starting date particularly difficult to interpret.

YMMV

Obviously we'll know more once an announcement is made.

Yes we will know more when an announcement is made even though we've already had an announcement that it'll be starting in the 19th July. I don't think it would have been too hard to outline the rules on this at that point.

A lot of the countries are already implementing the green cert as its supposed to be by the EU guidance (no tests for fully vaccinated, antigen test or antibody tests in last 6 months accepted). I would think with only 5 and a half weeks away we'd know if our rules will be the same as everyone else's or if we'll need to make people jump through a few extra hoops just for the sake of it. But I guess we disagree, you think this is reasonable for some reason that I find hard to understand.

normanoffside · 10-06-2021 01:57PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0610/1227244-coronavirus-global/

Might be an indication of where we could be going

From that article:

‘Relatively spared from the pandemic, Denmark currently has just 122 Covid patients in hospital, the lowest number since October.‘

We have a similar population and a lot fewer in hospital.
Hopefully that makes a few people think.

PTH2009 · 10-06-2021 02:07PM

normanoffside wrote: »

From that article:

‘Relatively spared from the pandemic, Denmark currently has just 122 Covid patients in hospital, the lowest number since October.‘

We have a similar population and a lot fewer in hospital.
Hopefully that makes a few people think.

A certain word starting with 'V' will put a stop to that optimistic thinking

It is great and it's shows the vaccine is working

Tchaikovsky · 10-06-2021 02:08PM

If only we could do more things like the Danes..

alentejo · 10-06-2021 02:22PM

I suspect the Delta variant will take over in Ireland as the dominate strain of Covid towards the end of June.
I also suspect that there will be a spike of cases in early July which will lead to a delay in indoor dining!

I cant see why the Irish Government didn't try and delay the emergence of the Delta Strain thru UK travel restrictions imposed in May.

seamus · 10-06-2021 02:23PM

The Danes are using a coronavirus passport.

You need to have proof of vaccination, recent PCR test or recent infection to access things like hairdressers, gyms, cinemas & museums. If you can't prove it, you can't get in.

It's not a free-for-all reopening.

Timmy O Toole · 10-06-2021 02:41PM

We had lower levels of the virus and hospitalisations last June with no vaccine, so why is the vaccine getting all the credit this summer ?

gozunda · 10-06-2021 02:42PM

normanoffside wrote: »

Very few people are following all the rules at this stage and yet the cases are dropping (Vaccination combined with Summer).

The Fact that NPHET don't grasp this fact is astonishing.

Anybody even buying an Antigen test is clearly conscientious, encouraging them to be a little more safe should be a good thing.
The people who have been going to the parties all along will continue to do so and won't be investing in antigen tests anyway.

I would suggest it's more correct to say a lot of people are still following the rules most of the time. Some are not. But that's no surprise tbh.

And yes cases numbers are dropping and I believe vaccination has a huge part to play but so do existing restrictions.

Last summer we had no vaccinations and very low cases. So now we have vaccinations, sumner, restrictions all of which are helping to keep down the rate of infection.

The Fact that anyone thinks that NPHET don't grasp these facts would indeed be astonishing.

But yeah parties are still not a particularly good idea. At least one recent party in the Midwest led to rash of new cases.

Would Antigen tests have helped? ...

Thing is these antigen tests are readily available. Its perhaps not too surprising that those going parties at least in the example above don't seem to have used them.

Micky 32 · 10-06-2021 02:42PM

seamus wrote: »

The Danes are using a coronavirus passport.

You need to have proof of vaccination, recent PCR test or recent infection to access things like hairdressers, gyms, cinemas & museums. If you can't prove it, you can't get in.

It's not a free-for-all reopening.

“ The document, which certifies that the bearer has either tested negative for the virus or is immune, will be phased out entirely by 1 October.”

seamus · 10-06-2021 02:44PM

Micky 32 wrote: »

“ The document, which certifies that the bearer has either tested negative for the virus or is immune, will be phased out entirely by 1 October.”

By which time, we'll have had all of these facilities open for months without requiring any kind of verification.

So which would you rather?

ArthurDayne · 10-06-2021 02:44PM

alentejo wrote: »

I suspect the Delta variant will take over in Ireland as the dominate strain of Covid towards the end of June.
I also suspect that there will be a spike of cases in early July which will lead to a delay in indoor dining!

I cant see why the Irish Government didn't try and delay the emergence of the Delta Strain thru UK travel restrictions imposed in May.

Such severe action would only be necessary to avoid a severe outcome — and in any case I think we need to reconcile ourselves to the reality that unless we are pursuing Zero Covid then new strains are going to get here one way or another (and even with a Zero Covid approach they may get here anyway). People are also travelling relatively freely within the UK at present which means there would be a gaping hole in the policy in the form of the border with the North.

Unless it appears that this variant will quickly overwhelm our health service then there is no need to be pushing for stricter measures to contain it.

charlie14 · 10-06-2021 02:45PM

seamus wrote: »

The Danes are using a coronavirus passport.

You need to have proof of vaccination, recent PCR test or recent infection to access things like hairdressers, gyms, cinemas & museums. If you can't prove it, you can't get in.

It's not a free-for-all reopening.

Those restriction to remain until everyone is offered a vaccine.

If we were only like Denmark :rolleyes:

Micky 32 · 10-06-2021 02:46PM

seamus wrote: »

By which time, we'll have had all of these facilities open for months without requiring any kind of verification.

So which would you rather?

It’s not a matter of what i prefer, i was just posting to clarify that your post about the corona pass is only temporary. Totally unrelated in relation to what we are doing.

TomSweeney · 10-06-2021 02:57PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0610/1227244-coronavirus-global/

Might be an indication of where we could be going

TomSweeney · 10-06-2021 02:59PM

seamus wrote: »

The Danes are using a coronavirus passport.

You need to have proof of vaccination, recent PCR test or recent infection to access things like hairdressers, gyms, cinemas & museums. If you can't prove it, you can't get in.

It's not a free-for-all reopening.

They are removing those pass systems as they lift the restrictions

normanoffside · 10-06-2021 03:01PM

Timmy O Toole wrote: »

We had lower levels of the virus and hospitalisations last June with no vaccine, so why is the vaccine getting all the credit this summer ?

The sunshine should be given more credit

Cases are falling through Europe even where there has been little vaccinations done.

10-06-2021 03:07PM

TomSweeney wrote: »

They are removing those pass systems as they lift the restrictions

You can go into a hairdresser, museum, cinema gym etc today with no requirement for test yet Denmark is better?

10-06-2021 03:11PM

Timmy O Toole wrote: »

We had lower levels of the virus and hospitalisations last June with no vaccine, so why is the vaccine getting all the credit this summer ?

Last June, after the country had shutdown for three months and everyone was told to stay at home? You're surprised that the experts are pleased that our current figures are better, relatively speaking instead of looking at absolute numbers, than they were at the end of our most severe lockdown?

What bout the morality rate, or the R number? How do they compare in June 2021 vs June 2020? What other factors do you think might be at play now that we've had an extra year to understand the effects of the virus?

And I thought it was the pro-lockdown crowd who lacked nuance.

PhoneMain · 10-06-2021 03:19PM

Timmy O Toole wrote: »

We had lower levels of the virus and hospitalisations last June with no vaccine, so why is the vaccine getting all the credit this summer ?

Last June we werent coming off an explosion of numbers in terms of cases and hospitalisations.....

10-06-2021 03:21PM

normanoffside wrote: »

The sunshine should be given more credit

Cases are falling through Europe even where there has been little vaccinations done.

That's a pretty bold claim, and one which I've not yet seen any proof of. I'd be interested if you had something to back it up, otherwise I presume you'd have no objections to withdrawing that statement?

normanoffside · 10-06-2021 03:22PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

That's a pretty bold claim, and one which I've not yet seen any proof of. I'd be interested if you had something to back it up, otherwise I presume you'd have no objections to withdrawing that statement?

Which part? The sunshine or the falling numbers?

10-06-2021 03:23PM

Both, please.

Why are Brazil and India riddled with the virus, given their sunny weather patterns?

Edit: and which countries have seen falling case numbers with little vaccinations/lockdown restrictions?

Tchaikovsky · 10-06-2021 03:30PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Both, please.

Why are Brazil and India riddled with the virus, given their sunny weather patterns?

Edit: and which countries have seen falling case numbers with little vaccinations/lockdown restrictions?

They both have right-wing nutters in charge that didn't take it seriously from the off.

10-06-2021 03:33PM

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

They both have right-wing nutters in charge that didn't take it seriously from the off.

All that sunshine, though........if their leaders aren't taking things seriously and the vaccination programmes are struggling as a result, then surely they'd be perfect candidates of both a) low vax stats and b) plenty of sunshine, therefore logic would dictate that their case numbers should be falling off a cliff if Norman's claims were true, no?

normanoffside · 10-06-2021 03:36PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Both, please.

Just a few examples linked below but you can look throughout Eastern Europe for more examples.

Bosnia has 3.5% of its population vaccinated.
Cases are averaging 45 cases per day; 3.5% of it's peak on April 2nd

https://graphics.reuters.com/world-coronavirus-tracker-and-maps/countries-and-territories/bosnia-and-herzegovina/

Albania is averaging 9 new infections per day; 1% of it's peak on February 11th.
It has 14% of it's population vaccinated.

https://graphics.reuters.com/world-coronavirus-tracker-and-maps/countries-and-territories/albania/

Ukraine is averaging 1400 new infections per day 9% of it's peak on April 9th

It has 1.7% of it's population vaccinated

https://graphics.reuters.com/world-coronavirus-tracker-and-maps/countries-and-territories/ukraine/

The part about the sunshine had a smiley Face next to it

is_that_so · 10-06-2021 03:54PM

The Danes look to be dropping masks apart from public transport and the vaccine cert will be gone by Oct 1.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0610/1227244-coronavirus-global/

Foxtrol · 10-06-2021 04:02PM

Boggles wrote: »

It increases the likelihood of a false sense of security.

Which was the point NPHET made, but seems to have been construed into Tony hates antigen.

NPHET were making that same stupid 'false sense of security' argument when it came to the public using masks - that the public couldn't be trusted to wear a mask and also follow the other guidance around social distancing etc. It led to Ireland being the slowest countries to mandate them.

It is like thinking the government shouldn't mandate seatbelts because it would mean everyone would ignore all rules of the road. The general public aren't as close to as stupid as NPHET seem to believe (obviously there are some outliers on that).

10-06-2021 04:23PM

Deleted User wrote: »

That's a pretty bold claim, and one which I've not yet seen any proof of. I'd be interested if you had something to back it up, otherwise I presume you'd have no objections to withdrawing that statement?

Well most viruses do in fact drop off in summer, and covid did that last year as well.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Comments

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI Read OP For Mod Warnings