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Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

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Comments

  • #3722
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,938 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    seamus wrote: »
    It's an assumption. Holohan has quite rightly pointed out throughout this, that socialising with alcohol is a gigantic risk factor because people drop their guard and ignore the guidelines after 3 or 4 pints.

    Since some people cannot comprehend how young people are supposed to have fun without alcohol, they've interpreted this to think that Holohan hates alcohol and young people.

    Your interpretation here is hilariously ironic considering Tony Holohan is so frequently on record as being anti-alcohol, with quotes easily found online demonstrating this. Consider:
    As the CMO the health of the Irish population is my first priority. However, no-one can deny the huge economic challenge we are experiencing now. In the current economic climate the health service will be forced to make difficult choices. In this context we can no longer afford the negative consequence of alcohol use.
    That is from 2010, the opening address at a conference for alcohol action Ireland. There is a lot similar in the speech, including:
    We must now say that we will no longer accept this burden that alcohol is placing on our families, our society, our health and our lives. And we must act now.

    In 2012 Holohan launched a government steering group which included such recommendations as:
    a complete ban of all alcohol related advertising and that some wanted a 9pm watershed, a ban of alcohol advertising in cinemas and a prohibition of outdoor alcohol advertising.
    Holohan is also the person who proposed the ban on alcohol sponsorship at sporting events.
    A total ban on all sponsorship of sporting events by alcohol brands by 2016 is just one of a number of proposals that will be brought to Cabinet in the coming months.
    The proposal was revealed today by Dr Tony Holohan, Chief Medical Officer at the Department of Health
    Regarding which he said:
    "Irish adults drink in a more dangerous way than any other country," said Dr Holohan, chairman of the National Substance Misuse Strategy Steering Group. "In effect, 1.5 million Irish drinkers drink in a harmful pattern and this needs to be addressed."
    And of course there was the "Global Alcohol Policy Convention" annual conference in Dublin Castle, March 2020, organised in partnership with the Department of Health. Tony refused to cancel that while at the same time he was cancelling rugby matches due to a certain virus.

    To again quote Tony himself:
    As somebody who was involved in the work on the Public Health Alcohol Bill for nine years
    Perhaps you're right, I don't actually know how anybody could think Tony Holohan has an issue with alcohol.


  • #3723
    Avon8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 567 ✭✭✭Avon8


    normanoffside wrote: »
    On the phone so I can’t link.
    Minimum Unit Alcohol pricing is pretty much his idea and he has been trying to get it through for over 10 years now.
    He has also hosted various anti-alcohol events including an international one in March 2020 in Dublin (which he insisted go ahead in full despite the beginnings of the pandemic).

    They cancelled the outdoor 6 nations game on a Saturday and yet he decided to hold the indoor anti-alcohol event of 1,000 people + on the Monday -Wednesday afterwards. Now much was unknown about the virus and indoor v outdoor back then but you'd have imagined our CMO would've had the good sense to cancel an unnecessary event flying hundreds of people in from dozens of countries.

    However he was a guest speaker and it's a cause he's very passionate about


  • #3724
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,190 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    Your interpretation here is hilariously ironic considering Tony Holohan is so frequently on record as being anti-alcohol, with quotes easily found online demonstrating this.
    Putting measures in place to reduce the impact of alcohol on public health doesn't make one "anti-alcohol". I agree with most of these measures, does that mean I hate alcohol?


  • #3725
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,938 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    seamus wrote: »
    Putting measures in place to reduce the impact of alcohol on public health doesn't make one "anti-alcohol". I agree with most of these measures, does that mean I hate alcohol?

    If you spend over a decade campaigning and implementing measures designed to stop people drinking then I will reserve the right to consider you to have an issue with alcohol.

    Not much interested in disingenuous wordplay to be honest. Mr Holohans words both during and long before the pandemic make it very clear where he stands.


  • #3726
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    Ireland's chief medical officer being anti one of the biggest causes of health issues in the country. Stop the presses, breaking news.


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  • #3727
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,938 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    Ireland's chief medical officer being anti one of the biggest causes of health issues in the country. Stop the presses, breaking news.

    "Holohan is anti-alcohol"
    "Says who?"
    "...Shows the supporting evidence..."
    "Why are you pointing out the obvious?"


  • #3728
    crossman47
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,597 ✭✭✭crossman47


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    If you spend over a decade campaigning and implementing measures designed to stop people drinking then I will reserve the right to consider you to have an issue with alcohol.

    Not much interested in disingenuous wordplay to be honest. Mr Holohans words both during and long before the pandemic make it very clear where he stands.

    I doubt if he has an issue with alcohol as such. it is the excessive use of alcohol to which Ireland is so prone that he would like to stop. His chances, I'm afraid, are slim to none.


  • #3729
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    crossman47 wrote: »
    I doubt if he has an issue with alcohol as such. it is the excessive use of alcohol to which Ireland is so prone that he would like to stop. His chances, I'm afraid, are slim to none.

    His view on excessive and most other peoples are likely quite different.


  • #3730
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    "Holohan is anti-alcohol"
    "Says who?"
    "...Shows the supporting evidence..."
    "Why are you pointing out the obvious?"

    Are you having a conversation with yourself? What you quoted is my only post on the matter.


  • #3731
    Mark1916
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 524 ✭✭✭Mark1916


    https://twitter.com/eoghanymurphy/status/1402261415969406988?s=21

    Big milestone for the north


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  • #3732
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,938 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    Are you having a conversation with yourself? What you quoted is my only post on the matter.

    "Holohan is anti-alcohol"
    "Says who?"
    "...Shows the supporting evidence..."
    "Why are you pointing out the obvious?"
    "Here is a summary of the actual conversation you jumped into"
    "Are you talking to yourself?"




    Should I have added in names to make it easier for you to follow?


  • #3733
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,069 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    "Holohan is anti-alcohol"
    "Says who?"
    "...Shows the supporting evidence..."
    "Why are you pointing out the obvious?"

    The inference of the comments is that he wants no one drinking ever and that he wants to shut down the pubs for good. Which I don't think is fair. We regularly see comments that NPHET and Tony won't be happy until there are no more pubs open ever.

    Ireland has a very unhealty relationship with alcohol, and it should be addressed. the CMO is exactly the person that should be working to address this.

    FFS, we live in a country where politicians argue that Farmers should be allowed to drink and drive because having a pint is the only possible way they could socialise.

    Those measures on Alcohol, by the way (advertising ban, sponsorship ban etc) are the same that have already been placed against tobacco.


  • #3734
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,069 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    His view on excessive and most other peoples are likely quite different.

    I don't think that is the mic-drop comment you think it is.


  • #3735
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    "Holohan is anti-alcohol"
    "Says who?"
    "...Shows the supporting evidence..."
    "Why are you pointing out the obvious?"
    "Here is a summary of the actual conversation you jumped into"
    "Are you talking to yourself?"




    Should I have added in names to make it easier for you to follow?

    Its different people making different points. You are trying to make it look like a poster is tripping up with their own argument or something. Strange behaviour really. Is it to make it look like you have out debated someone and caused them to trip up?


  • #3736
    Bubbaclaus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    Mitch Connor wrote: »
    The inference of the comments is that he wants no one drinking ever and that he wants to shut down the pubs for good. Which I don't think is fair. We regularly see comments that NPHET and Tony won't be happy until there are no more pubs open ever.

    Its a bizarre trail of thought really isn't it. Holohan has quite often referenced being looking forward to having a pint himself during periods where we were coming out of lockdowns.

    Some people have fallen down a rabbit hole and think he wants to ban alcohol or something else they probably read on a Facebook group they shouldn't have joined, when the reality is the Chief Medical Officer simply is trying to push for rules that will create a healthier relationship with alcohol.


  • #3737
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,938 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Mitch Connor wrote: »
    The inference of the comments is that he wants no one drinking ever and that he wants to shut down the pubs for good.

    In fairness, the real inference is that he is using Covid as an opportunity to push an anti-alcohol agenda, with all that implies.


  • #3738
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,977 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    271 cases..... not good enough.


  • #3739
    Vicxas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,613 ✭✭✭✭Vicxas


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    271 cases..... not good enough.

    Disgraceful altogether


  • #3740
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Avon8 wrote: »
    They cancelled the outdoor 6 nations game on a Saturday and yet he decided to hold the indoor anti-alcohol event of 1,000 people + on the Monday -Wednesday afterwards. Now much was unknown about the virus and indoor v outdoor back then but you'd have imagined our CMO would've had the good sense to cancel an unnecessary event flying hundreds of people in from dozens of countries.

    However he was a guest speaker and it's a cause he's very passionate about

    Before using something as supporitng eveidence you should first ask the question does the evidence say what you think it says.

    To do this you must ask yourself why the 2020 Six Nations game against Italy cancelled. Was it
    a. all large scale sporting events were cancelled at that time
    or
    b. large portions of the crowd were coming from Italy where the epicentre of the virus in Europe was at the time


  • #3741
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    In fairness, the real inference is that he is using Covid as an opportunity to push an anti-alcohol agenda, with all that implies.

    The inference I have drawn is some people are gone full on tinfoil hat


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  • #3742
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,311 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mitch Connor wrote: »
    Ireland has a very unhealty relationship with alcohol, and it should be addressed. the CMO is exactly the person that should be working to address this.

    Wishing drinking thinking. Some people are not content unless the enjoyment of others is stifled, a schoolmarmish archetype that unfortunately is rather prevalent in Ireland. At the top, Tony Holohan the zealot who has been vociferously anti-alcohol for over a decade. Here's a novel idea, if one is not a fan of pub culture then simply steer clear. This indignant attitude of "it should be addressed" is pure projection. I'm not into smoking, that doesn't mean I have a right to meddle in the affairs of others who do. Mind your own business.


  • #3743
    dashoonage
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,140 ✭✭✭dashoonage


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    271 cases..... not good enough.

    The next two weeks are critical...


  • #3744
    Mitch Connor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,069 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Wishing drinking thinking. Some people are not content unless the enjoyment of others is stifled, a schoolmarmish archetype that unfortunately is rather prevalent in Ireland. At the top, Tony Holohan the zealot who has been vociferously anti-alcohol for over a decade. Here's a novel idea, if one is not a fan of pub culture then simply steer clear. This indignant attitude of "it should be addressed" is pure projection. I'm not into smoking, that doesn't mean I have a right to meddle in the affairs of others who do. Mind your own business.

    I dunno.

    I thinkt he Chief Medical Officer of the country should probably be involved in issues of public health.


  • #3745
    corkie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,392 ✭✭✭corkie


    https://twitter.com/roinnslainte/status/1402282219071225857


    As of midnight, Monday 7 June, we are reporting
    271*
    confirmed cases of #COVID19.

    27 in ICU. 77 in hospital.

    *Daily case numbers may change due to future data review, validation and update.

    ⓘ "At some point something inside me just clicked and I realized that I didn't have to deal with anyone's bullshit ever again."
    » “mundus sine caesaribus” «



  • #3746
    lee_baby_simms
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭lee_baby_simms


    TheDoctor wrote: »
    271 cases..... not good enough.

    We currently in a very precarious epidemiological situation.


  • #3747
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,155 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    Gas how there's no distinction being made by many posters between the CMO being anti alcohol in the sense that excessive alcohol consumption and abuse is a public health problem and being just anti-alcohol generally, which is a totally different thing. A distinction obvious to anyone, or so I would have thought.

    To use an example, you can be anti speeding or anti dangerous driving, which doesn't mean you are anti car in general.

    I wonder are there actual adults posting in here at all. Some of the arguments you read are just too stupid at times.


  • #3748
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    His view on excessive and most other peoples are likely quite different.
    Mitch Connor wrote: »
    I don't think that is the mic-drop comment you think it is.

    :confused:

    Not sure what you mean, your comment must be too clever for me, but I was simply saying that Holohan's view on what constitutes excessive alcohol consumption versus the majority of people is likely quite different. Feel free to disagree with me (but you'd be wrong ;) ).


  • #3749
    Tyrone212
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,570 ✭✭✭Tyrone212


    271. I'm guessing but that must be lowest for a long time. December?


  • #3750
    prunudo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,090 ✭✭✭prunudo


    Any rough time scale when we'll be back to true reported figures. Presumably they're still working off the swabs which is still a good indicator but are we setting ourselves for a glut of added cases?


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  • #3751
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    prunudo wrote: »
    Any rough time scale when we'll be back to true reported figures. Presumably they're still working off the swabs which is still a good indicator but are we setting ourselves for a glut of added cases?
    They seem to be consistent so probably not that much. TBH they'll be historical data anyway.


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