Covid-19 likely to be man made

Deleted User wrote: »

That vanity fair article points to a cover up..

I just read it. It's a solid piece of investigative reporting and the sources are likely credible as we know that the Trump administration leaked like a sieve. There was clearly huge concern about US funded gain of function research in Wuhan becoming public, but it would have been far better to get out ahead of the story rather than trying to bury it. It's a mess now and will only be resolved via an open investigation, as a broad spectrum of people just don't believe they are being told the truth.

geospatial wrote: »

There is no damage to the scientific community? Scientists have been receiving death threats, would you regard that as damaging? Gain of function research is very much in the spotlight, with groups of scientists taking very strong positions on both sides. What's your opinion of gain of function research that most certainly could have led to a virus like SARS-2, and most certainly could have leaked from a lab as there have been numerous leaks of dangerous pathogens from labs.

Can you summarize the scientific evidence that the SARS-CoV 2 virus is zootonic in nature and rules out it being the result of signal passaging experiments or genetic engineering experiments in a lab. The evidence is that the virus is a chimera and has unique features not seen in other bat coronaviruses, it could have come from a natural source via recombination or been created in a lab. A virus as the result of lab serial passaging would look no different genomically to a zootonic virus and it is doubtful if one genetically engineered would look different.

As I said my personal belief is the evidence favors a natural source, but both should be investigated.

Just to come back on this, death threats should absolutely not be tolerated.

I have no doubt that gain of function research is happening and will continue to happen. The evidence that SARS-COV2 emerged from GOF research is non existent, not even weak. The only reason it's still in play as a theory is that it fits narratives rather than being evidential based. The technology review article you posted seems to hinge on one area, that being the ACE2 receptor that has occurred naturally before in other recent virus, shows no evidence of tampering in it's genome (being probably the most studied receptor in human history) and itself has mutated since the virus emerged.

The WHO investigation eliminated lab leak due to lack of evidence (if you take the WHO scientists at face value, but if you don't you are only likely to get answers by travelling to Wuhan and performing the investigation yourself) and because of lack of evidence didn't investigate it further.

A year on it's questionable if the USA investigation into a virus originating in China will turn up anything new, the most likely outcome is a reinforcing of the results from the WHO investigation with much the same evidence, possibly a bit of extra detail from the WIV. If that was the outcome, would you accept it?

King Mob wrote: »

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00865-8
There you go.

an article in the 'nature'. what's that for a magazine? jut written down from a magazine?


also this, the head from the WHO, says this in your nice little article:


--after the report’s publication, the WHO director-general, Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, who was not directly involved with the investigation, posted a statement saying that he looks forward to future studies of the coronavirus’s animal origins — but that he wasn’t content with the examination of a potential laboratory leak. “I do not believe that this assessment was extensive enough,” he wrote. “This requires further investigation, potentially with additional missions involving specialist experts, which I am ready to deploy.”--


hahaha, ridiculous.....with this article you've actually just proven that all is in the open, and that they NOT exclude the lab leak theory and want to investigate it further...
god, this 4-5 posters here, just a complete waste of time to discuss with.

Mic 1972 wrote: »

Mate, stop engaging with him, we've all went through the same with him before. He asks the same questions over and over accusing you of dodging the questions. Eventually you'll be the one getting a warning from the mods

Ignoring posters who challenge your views and now encouraging others to ignore posters.

tara73 wrote: »

show us the link, the prove to it! prove us that they seriously investigated the possibility of a lab leak.
also who is they? give us a link who investigated the possibility of the lab leak as you claim.

The lab-leak theory was investigated by the joint WHO investigation - they found it to be "extremely unlikely"

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55996728
https://www.nbcnews.com/science/science-news/report-finds-coronavirus-probably-emerged-bats-extremely-unlikely-resu-rcna536

Dohnjoe wrote: »

The lab-leak theory was investigated by the joint WHO investigation - they found it to be "extremely unlikely"

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55996728
https://www.nbcnews.com/science/science-news/report-finds-coronavirus-probably-emerged-bats-extremely-unlikely-resu-rcna536

In fairness the Who have next to now credibility at this state in regard to Covid.

They know who writes the cheques.

Dohnjoe wrote: »

It was a joint WHO-China investigation, every article on this points out the fact. Everyone is aware of the conflict of interest, hence the US is having another investigation (which could have it's own conflicts of interest)

This is why international investigations are often conducted by independent third parties - but with a country as closed and controlled as China that is unlikely

So basically all the ‘evidence” you posted is crap! Even by your own admission above?

geospatial wrote: »

I should have listened.

Not just that. In one post he said he think he know that you believe in something and then tried to expand on that. Couple posts later he may be claiming it was you who actually said that.
If you ask him something he will say dunno or proclaim that you should answer his questions first. Oh yes, and if you want to answer then dunno is not acceptable. Simple yes or no and if you try to say something more here we go again - you are dodging questions.
Constantly muddying waters with statements that you are dodging or refuse to answer questions is good tactic. You are not the first one who been there - done that.

I still haven't seen any credible evidence that the virus was "manufactured". Someone submitted a paper, but it left that out in it's final conclusion. So we're still at zero with topic of the thread.

quickbeam wrote: »

Mod: too right you will! Knock off the personal attacks. Engage in debate or ignore, but quit the sniping.

Understood. Ignore is working fine for me.

Mic 1972 wrote: »

it's kind of disturbing that an issue of this magnitude is still being discussed in the conspiracy theory section.
There is a major mainstream discussion taking place at the moment in places that would have normally censored the issue right away.

Well, seeing how things evolve and how "facts" change at a whim depending on situation or "need" we should be quite happy we can discuss some topics.
Simple mentioning of certain topics few months ago would result in scores of insults, personal attacks and ultimately a thread ban.