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Update on my CZ 457 LRP

  • 15-05-2021 5:33pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭


    Hi lads, I got to Harbour House today for more ammo testing. Fecking costing me a small fortune in ammo so far. All the 'Target' ammo didn't shoot at all great IMO grouping 25mm/35mm with flyers. I've still to try Eley ammo, when I can find some.

    But a better day shooting my CZ 457 LRP today. Just a little wind this morning and shot the best groups so far at 50m. Using SK Standard Plus, in the yellow box. I'll say the groups are a tad smaller than I've writen down, small red circle is 1/2". First group, top right, is with a cold clean barrel. Then shot right to left , then down.

    A beauty or what. Elements Helix 6-24x50mm SFP, with the MRad reticle
    553149.jpg

    Best group with Lapua Center X, 12mm. 10 shot group @50m.
    553150.jpg

    Todays groups using SK Standard Plus at 50m, all under MOA. I measured the 13mm again at 12mm so bang on MOA.
    553151.jpg

    FB_IMG_1615035434890.jpg

    20210504_191449.jpg

    FB_IMG_1621094550427.jpg


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭alanmc


    clivej wrote: »
    A beauty or what.

    I love the bottle opener style butt stock. Great for hooking your offhand into.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,698 ✭✭✭Feisar


    How many shots in that Center X group?

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    Feisar wrote: »
    How many shots in that Center X group?

    10 shot group @50m


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,357 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    That's awesome shooting Clive, congratulations.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,698 ✭✭✭Feisar


    clivej wrote: »
    10 shot group @50m

    As above, that's fine shooting and a testament to your concentration!

    First they came for the socialists...



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    That's awesome shooting Clive, congratulations.
    Feisar wrote: »
    As above, that's fine shooting and a testament to your concentration!

    But lads if you'd seen the groups from the 'Target' ammo it's the river the rifle would have been thrown in. I've spent about 150 to 200 euro on target ammo and it's all shot such disappointing groups. I still have a lot in my ammo box. And again today still not getting good enough groups from the target ammo.

    3 shots touching then they move over a bit for another 3 shot touching group. I can't put an answer to it, but I'm thinking it's my bad shooting, not getting a consistence rifle hold. Still it's early days yet and I'm still learning. ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 424 ✭✭Cerveza


    I’m sure it’s not your inability to shoot. You have impressive shots by any means. You going to the range tomorrow?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,174 ✭✭✭Richard308


    I’ve always owned a cz/Brno of some form. I absolutely love them. The build quality and precision is not appreciated enough. That rifle in the battleship grey stock is class. And the shooting matches it.
    Rifles can be fussy with ammo. That looks like it works fine on the cheaper stuff. Don’t complain, can get more bang for your buck. Excuse the pun lads. Well wear, I’m sure tons of fun and bulls to come.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,789 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    clivej wrote: »
    But lads if you'd seen the groups from the 'Target' ammo it's the river the rifle would have been thrown in. I've spent about 150 to 200 euro on target ammo and it's all shot such disappointing groups. I still have a lot in my ammo box. And again today still not getting good enough groups from the target ammo.

    3 shots touching then they move over a bit for another 3 shot touching group. I can't put an answer to it, but I'm thinking it's my bad shooting, not getting a consistence rifle hold. Still it's early days yet and I'm still learning. ;)

    You'll be unbeatable with that rifle Clive, that is unless Mary borrows it off you. :D:D:D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 382 ✭✭no_4


    nice shootuing , i often find std or subsonics for ~6e a box,m shoot as well as a lapua center x or midas at 15e a box (ps im not a prs shooter)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 22 Excavo


    clivej wrote: »
    But lads if you'd seen the groups from the 'Target' ammo it's the river the rifle would have been thrown in. I've spent about 150 to 200 euro on target ammo and it's all shot such disappointing groups. I still have a lot in my ammo box. And again today still not getting good enough groups from the target ammo.

    3 shots touching then they move over a bit for another 3 shot touching group. I can't put an answer to it, but I'm thinking it's my bad shooting, not getting a consistence rifle hold. Still it's early days yet and I'm still learning. ;)

    The LRP is a very nice rifle indeed. Gonna get me one soon.
    My pal and I have tested a lot of different brands - he the 457 and me the 452 Classic.
    I am assuming you have already done SK match which I find shoots great V value. Eley club was the best of Eley that I tested and the cheapest.

    Fiocchi std velocity if you haven't already shoots very well for even less money. RWS special match also but more expensive.
    You can see some 10 shot groups @50yds below - the results you might find useful.


    23uJgRb.jpg

    K9ztZR5.jpg

    9nzUsNA.jpg

    LlA3Mhv.jpg

    KLQDYyK.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 471 ✭✭badaj0z


    If you are really interested in what kind of groups can be obtained by all kinds of .22 rifle, then this thread is a mine of information.

    https://ukvarminting.com/topic/51133-22-lr-average-group-from-your-gun/#comments


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,698 ✭✭✭Feisar


    badaj0z wrote: »
    If you are really interested in what kind of groups can be obtained by all kinds of .22 rifle, then this thread is a mine of information.

    https://ukvarminting.com/topic/51133-22-lr-average-group-from-your-gun/#comments

    Similar but probably not as useful:

    https://www.accurateshooter.com/guns-of-week/22lr-rimfire-ammo-comparison-test/

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,357 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    It's all about hitting the target really.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 424 ✭✭Cerveza


    It’s the marriage of a quality scope that can be the winner in achieving accuracy.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,357 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    Cerveza wrote: »
    It’s the marriage of a quality scope that can be the winner in achieving accuracy.

    No doubt.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 471 ✭✭badaj0z


    It is all about which variable has the biggest effect on accuracy. In descending order of importance.

    The Shooter
    The Gun
    The ammo
    The conditions

    We all tend to look at the middle two as an excuse to spend money and enjoy ourselves. The first one takes time and effort. The last one needs experience.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,357 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    badaj0z wrote: »
    It is all about which variable has the biggest effect on accuracy. In descending order of importance.

    The Shooter
    The Gun
    The ammo
    The conditions

    We all tend to look at the middle two as an excuse to spend money and enjoy ourselves. The first one takes time and effort. The last one needs experience.

    I've been told about lads that use 3 grand scopes and update their .22's by as much money, but as long as it's open to everyone to have a go I don't see the advantage the rich lads have over everyone else.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 424 ✭✭Cerveza


    You can’t compare a three hundred euro scope to a three thousand euro one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,357 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    Cerveza wrote: »
    You can’t compare a three hundred euro scope to a three thousand euro one.

    Would the scope make that much of a difference over 25 metres?

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 585 ✭✭✭JP22


    Everything matters and then again sometimes nothing matters. :eek:

    Consistent accurate rimfire (.22LR) shooting is an arcane science, few master it and most of us (me) struggle. It’s fun, challenging, frustrating, a pain in you know what :mad: and even addictive.

    What we did last week and what ammo we shot last week shoots crap this week, sometimes I think we try too hard and put more pressure on ourselves. Some of my best groups were when just shooting for fun and not giving a damn.

    As previous members have stated, it’s all about the package (Rifle, Scope, Ammo, User), add to this Rest, Setup, Conditions, Distance, Mind-Set, is it Fun or Comps, Stress, etc……….

    Normally you get what you pay for as they say, the best equipment should equal the best results but we all know this is a bucket load. Some folk like the best, newest money can buy, dosen't mean you'll shoot accurately though.

    This is a group from a 63 year old Brno M5 with a cheap 1980's Tasco scope, the problem is doing it consistantly. Can I do it again, roll on next weekend.....madness.... but we'll still try.....

    552025.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 882 ✭✭✭Wadi14


    Would the scope make that much of a difference over 25 metres?

    Something like a bushnell banner is fine at 25, it does what it says on the tin.

    If your talking of something for Gallery shooting, if it has clear glass, a simple reticle and parallaxes down to 10m it will be fine


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    Got a new SEB rear shooting bag all filled up and ready. I'll see if this will now help me shoot a little better. ;);)
    It has a 20mm flat bottom that will match the CZ457 LRP lower picatinny attachment rail on the stock.

    553501.jpg

    553502.jpg


    FB_IMG_1621408346637.jpg

    FB_IMG_1621408427300.jpg


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 424 ✭✭Cerveza


    Would the scope make that much of a difference over 25 metres?

    It certainly does if you want to produce consistent results. If you decide to run a cheap set up and have a day out in the range shoot a few bullets, have a coffee and share a few butts with others that’s fine too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,174 ✭✭✭Richard308


    Well logic would dictate, if you’ve a better trigger, barrel, ammunition and glass you will do better.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,357 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    Cerveza wrote: »
    It certainly does if you want to produce consistent results. If you decide to run a cheap set up and have a day out in the range shoot a few bullets, have a coffee and share a few butts with others that’s fine too.

    I wouldn't be a butt sharer myself, I'm a happily married man.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 471 ✭✭badaj0z


    Richard308 wrote: »
    Well logic would dictate, if you’ve a better trigger, barrel, ammunition and glass you will do better.

    This is true if your skills are better than your equipment. If your skills are what limit your results then changing your kit will have little effect. The single largest variable in the equation is the shooter.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 382 ✭✭no_4


    i agree with all.; there are a huge number of variables that can affect your shooting ,
    shooter (age, eyesight, concentration ability, sleep, stimulants)
    gun (barrel, chamber, scope, scope rings, scope base and fixings, torque settings on action screws and scope mounts; care of rifle and cleaning, age, etc
    ammo (price vs quality and consistency
    weather, wind atmospheric pressure

    ive shot 15-20mm groups from a ruger takedown 10/22 @ 50yards with cheaper cci std, aguila and eley subsonic 40gr one week, and next week , same gun, same batch of ammo and same scope settings , and shoot pure dogsh!t groups!

    but hey thats what makes it interesting and yes very addictive!

    for sure , all 22lr shooters would shoot a whole lot less if the ammo was on par price wise with 223/243 quality for example!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,174 ✭✭✭Richard308


    badaj0z wrote: »
    This is true if your skills are better than your equipment. If your skills are what limit your results then changing your kit will have little effect. The single largest variable in the equation is the shooter.

    If a rifle shoots 1 inch groups and another 1/2 inch groups it has to affect performance. In the same shooters hands


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 471 ✭✭badaj0z


    Richard308 wrote: »
    If a rifle shoots 1 inch groups and another 1/2 inch groups it has to affect performance. In the same shooters hands

    Only if the shooter is good enough to perform at the limit of the rifles ability. A poor shooter may only be able to get 2 inch groups out of either rifle. My argument is that a shooter using a specific gun, ammo, rests etc., is a system which acts together to produce a result. In this case accuracy. The accuracy which results is limited to the worst performing component, which is usually the person.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 585 ✭✭✭JP22


    clivej wrote: »
    Got a new SEB rear shooting bag all filled up and ready. I'll see if this will now help me shoot a little better. ;);)
    It has a 20mm flat bottom that will match the CZ457 LRP lower picatinny attachment rail on the stock.

    Nice one Clive, Seb makes great quality bags.

    May it wear well.:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 424 ✭✭Cerveza


    badaj0z wrote: »
    Only if the shooter is good enough to perform at the limit of the rifles ability. A poor shooter may only be able to get 2 inch groups out of either rifle. My argument is that a shooter using a specific gun, ammo, rests etc., is a system which acts together to produce a result. In this case accuracy. The accuracy which results is limited to the worst performing component, which is usually the person.

    I tried playing golf years ago, was hopeless at it. I gave it every chance to learn it and had a few Nick Faldo’s that tried to teach me but the talent just wasn’t there. I would imagine any shooter who hasn’t the talent should call it a day also.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 882 ✭✭✭Wadi14


    Cerveza wrote: »
    I tried playing golf years ago, was hopeless at it. I gave it every chance to learn it and had a few Nick Faldo’s that tried to teach me but the talent just wasn’t there. I would imagine any shooter who hasn’t the talent should call it a day also.

    Golf is a very hard game to master I gave it up too when I couldn't get lower than 10 lol.

    but on a serious note, it doesn't matter if you have talent for anything if you enjoy what your doing, then why stop. Its meant to be fun.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 424 ✭✭Cerveza


    Wadi14 wrote: »
    Golf is a very hard game to master I gave it up too when I couldn't get lower than 10 lol.

    but on a serious note, it doesn't matter if you have talent for anything if you enjoy what your doing, then why stop. Its meant to be fun.

    It will be difficult to enjoy shooting if you are no good at it. I certainly wouldn’t enjoy playing golf if I was horsing sods of grass at the tee off instead of the ball and the times I would hit the ball and they landing into the water or rough.
    I believe the same analogy for shooting would have been the same for me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 535 ✭✭✭solarwinds


    Cerveza wrote: »
    It will be difficult to enjoy shooting if you are no good at it. I certainly wouldn’t enjoy playing golf if I was horsing sods of grass at the tee off instead of the ball and the times I would hit the ball and they landing into the water or rough.
    I believe the same analogy for shooting would have been the same for me.

    I would not be the best shot in the world but it gives me great pleasure and I love it so who cares I enjoy what I do.
    So what you are saying is regardless of whether you enjoy something or not is irrelevant, unless you are good at it you should not be allowed to participate.
    Right I will post all my rifles, shotgun and pistol in the for sale section, bulk buy discount (only current Olympians need apply).


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  • Registered Users Posts: 535 ✭✭✭solarwinds


    Nice looking set up Clive, can I ask did you buy the bag direct and if so did you buy it filled, how was shipping ?.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    solarwinds wrote: »
    Nice looking set up Clive, can I ask did you buy the bag direct and if so did you buy it filled, how was shipping ?.

    Yes bought unfilled from Italy, 10 Euro DHL postage.
    Filled it with the white fine Play sand, put it in the oven to dry it off.


    https://armeriaregina.it/gb/cuscini-posteriori/5338-seb-rest-regular-rear-bag.html


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 585 ✭✭✭JP22


    Clive.

    Forgot to ask (before I book-mark the site - https://armeriaregina.it/gb/cuscini-...-rear-bag.html).

    Any issues buying from them, any issues with delivery/customs, etc?

    Keep safe.


    JP


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    JP22 wrote: »
    Clive.

    Forgot to ask (before I book-mark the site - https://armeriaregina.it/gb/cuscini-...-rear-bag.html).

    Any issues buying from them, any issues with delivery/customs, etc?

    Keep safe.


    JP

    No problem at all, and only 10 Euro 3 day delivery with DHL, that took 10 days to arrive. :mad:


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    I collected my CZ 457 LRP last night. The trigger was on the heaviest setting so I sorted that first with some help from YouTube. Next I added the scope and a spacer in the stock followed by a few other tweaks.

    Up early to the range this am, at 50 m it’s a tack driver. I finished up with 10 shots all touching. At 100 m things opened up a bit as expected. However considering there was a little wind, my scope is only 20 power and the bipod and rear bag were not exceptional I am very happy for day one. I was using SK match (red). Photos to follow.

    Point of impact climbed by 5” with a mod rather than the muzzle brake at 100 m. Slightly tighter group with the mod but maybe this was because the wind dropped.


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  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,602 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    51243266139_753c329b9a.jpg

    On the range this am.

    51243266159_51d74617ec.jpg

    What I thought was my best 10 round group at 50m. Although I'm looking at this now and wondering if it was less than 10 rounds, perhaps it was one magazine i.e. 5 rounds. Either way I'm happy. I had no coins on me so I used a bullet for scale.

    51243554385_727168f3d2.jpg

    My best 10 round group at 100 m. A pity I had one flyer!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 173 ✭✭GooseB


    Nice shooting and the best of luck with the new rifle:D

    That 100m group is nice, particularly the 7 shot cluster that make the one big hole.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    A nice morning getting some competition pistol practice in. Then a good couple of benchrest targets shot in the afternoon. I was getting tired with the last 10 round group, bottom right.

    555796.jpg

    555797.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    Update....... after soooooooooooooo much ammo testing and getting great groups and then not such great groups (with the same ammo) I have traded in the CZ 457 LRP. It just wasn't holding consistent small groups good enough for the Benchrest competitions. ☹️

    I would get great touching shots that would then open up to unacceptable groups for Benchrest competition shooting. 🙄

    I traded the CZ 457 LRP back into the dealer I bought it from. I now have an Anschutz 1710, bought second hand that is said to be at least 20 years old. Got the rifle on a Monday and came first in Benchrest Light Varmint and third in Heavy Varmint on the Saturday in a well supported club comp. 😁

    I have to say, the Anschutz 1710 does shoot well. 3 x 5 shot groups at 100m, using RWS R50 ammo. 2 sub MOA groups in there. 😃




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,698 ✭✭✭Feisar


    Beautiful looking rifle, pity it wasn't delivering the goods consistently enough. Fair play for pulling the pin, sometimes it can be hard to admit.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 585 ✭✭✭JP22


    Howdy Clive.

    Once you go Anschutz, you'll never go back.

    Anschutz date codes are either XX numbers = date or

    letters (A=0, B=1, C=2, D=3, E=4, F=5, G=6, H=7, I=8, K=9. J is not used)

    Enjoy.

    JP



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 28,623 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cass


    CZs are somewhat notorious for taking some "bedding in time" as you well know so do you think, @clivej the rifle might have settled down or was this the best it was ever going to produce?


    Also ammo. I've had a sneaking suspicion that ammo quality the last few years, due to demand and rapid production, has gone down somewhat. I'd say a chrono would give someinteresting readings and might explain some groupings.


    Now no doubt the improvement in the Anschutz is evident, and as a fan of both rifles I'd never criticize the CZ, but at the end of the day the 1710 is a hard bet rifle even above newer Anschutzs.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

    If you see a problem post use the report post function. Click on the three dots on the post, select "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.

    Moderators - Cass otmmyboy2 , CatMod - Shamboc , Admins - Beasty , mickeroo



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,061 ✭✭✭clivej


    Oh I did most everything I know to get the CZ 457 LRP to shoot right. 😥

    I must have put over 1k of ammo thru it, and not the just the cheap stuff. My so to ammo has always been SK Standard Plus in the yellow box. That shot well above OK.

    I cleaned between each change of ammo, just a couple of wet patches, followed by clean patches until dry. And then put at least 3 or more boxes of each ammo down the tube. I spent hundreds of Euro on ammo.

    So I tried ......

    Eley.. Match, contact, force, action, team.

    RWS... Rifle match, R50, this shot very well.

    SK.. Rifle match, Long range, standard plus,

    Lapua... Center X, this shot very well.

    BUT I never got consistency. Always a good group of 3 or 4 rounds then open up about 10mm away with another 3/4 shot group. I just said it was time to go and took it back and put another few Euro along with it and got the Anschutz 1710. I've owned about 10 CZ 22lr rifles over the years, but I'd never owned an Anschutz in all the years I've been shooting. This rifle is over 20 years old and after a quick zero it shot touching 5 shot groups at 50m and since then sub MOA groups at 100m. Using RWS R50 ammo.

    I'm down to shoot my first prone competition this weekend at 50m and 100m. 😉



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 28,623 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cass


    I had two Anschutzs and the Father one. We both had the 1710 and they were unbeliebable and one fo the few rifles I truly regret selling. The cost of them has actually gone up in the last few years as lads have realsied they're better than the new models.


    Well ware with it and how about a few pictures.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

    If you see a problem post use the report post function. Click on the three dots on the post, select "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.

    Moderators - Cass otmmyboy2 , CatMod - Shamboc , Admins - Beasty , mickeroo



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 585 ✭✭✭JP22


    As Clive says, CZ make some fine rifles, basically the LRP and MTR are the same rifle albit dressed up differently.

    Both can be super accurate out of the box however, a quick google reveals lots of folk unhappy in US with their accuracy. Some either never shoot great or over a short period of time they lost their accuracy.

    Nice shooting at last weeks comps Clive, 😁😁, did you get sorted with mags?



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