Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI Read OP For Mod Warnings

greenfarm · 17-05-2021 09:46PM

Graham wrote: »

flu has nothing at all to do with covid restrictions

It will when it disappeared for a year and we have little immunity around and no idea which strain will circulate for the vaccines.

Add Covid 4th wave in winter and our crap hospitals and disaster awaits

Silentcorner · 17-05-2021 09:57PM

greenfarm wrote: »

Yep

I am dreading it too, return of the flu and the 4th wave will make a miserable winter

Will try and enjoy the covid free Summer as much as I can.

I was dreading it, I am relaxing a bit more as the weeks go on, the vaccines are working....too many people aren't paying attention to the incessant fear mongering.

There is a tsunami of undiagnosed cancers and heart disease coming our way, and unlike Covid which is "deadly" to a certain elderly demographic more often than not with compromised immune systems, these diseases do not discriminate by age.

You would imagine, after 18 months (by the time the next surge arises) our Health Authorities would have learned that they need to get very stringent with protecting those compromised immune systems, which they have failed so badly to do so far despite everything we know about this virus.

If the Health Authorities go into yet another winter without making any preparations then I don't see the public or politicians having the stomach to lock us down again....

If we are locked down again then clearly there is more to this than a virus.

greenfarm · 17-05-2021 10:04PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

I was dreading it, I am relaxing a bit more as the weeks go on, the vaccines are working

If we are locked down again then clearly there is more to this than a virus.

My greatest worry is that by vaccinating all the adults and creating a wall Covid cant penetrate, we are leaving the kids wide open to more contagious virulent strains like the Indian one

If a strain appears that causes sickness in children, people are gonna lose their **** and we will be back in lockdown again until they are vaccinated.

Its all fun and games when old people get sick, but if little kids start filling up Crumlin, people gonna lose it

We better hurry up annd vaccinate kids before winter, **** us old people.

LillyIsland · 17-05-2021 10:06PM

Even though he's in the US, what he's saying is so true and relevent to us too, a really good video...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnfF7xIL-jQ

charlie14 · 17-05-2021 10:12PM

normanoffside wrote: »

Coming out of lockdown and dropping all mask mandates months ago doesn't see to have affected Texas

https://twitter.com/GregAbbott_TX/status/1394090593672994822

Somebody said on here some time ago that FLorida and Texas were doing so much better than California. Your post reminded me of that and I did a quick check.

Texas Population 29M Covid deaths 51,173. 1,765 deaths per million.
California Population 40M Covid deaths 62,687. 1,567 deaths per million.

Proportionally that is 5,742 more deaths for Texas.

castletownman · 17-05-2021 10:16PM

Finally saw my GF's nephew this evening for the first time since he was born at Christmas.

He was full of smiles and giggles, oblivious to the world's worries. There may have been a tear or two shed at our end.

It was marvellous.

**** Covid, the end is in sight.

Graham · 17-05-2021 10:20PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

I was dreading it, I am relaxing a bit more as the weeks go on, the vaccines are working....too many people aren't paying attention to the incessant fear mongering.

Are you suggesting we should or shouldn't be paying attention to the incessant fear mongering? It's not too clear.

Are you referring to this thread or more general incessant fear mongering?

Silentcorner · 17-05-2021 10:27PM

Graham wrote: »

Are you suggesting we should or shouldn't be paying attention to the incessant fear mongering? It's not too clear.

Are you referring to this thread or more general incessant fear mongering?

You know well what I mean, despite the incessant fear mongering on media every day, too many people are no longer paying attention....that was evident back in February to anyone living in a populated area!!

They'll have some job trying to keep the fear going until October!!

Graham · 17-05-2021 10:31PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

You know well what I mean, despite the incessant fear mongering on media every day, too many people are no longer paying attention....that was evident back in February to anyone living in a populated area!!

They'll have some job trying to keep the fear going until October!!

To be honest the only fear mongering I'm seeing is on this thread with bizarre prophecies of never ending lockdowns and restrictions for flu.

charlie14 · 17-05-2021 10:36PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

I was dreading it, I am relaxing a bit more as the weeks go on, the vaccines are working....too many people aren't paying attention to the incessant fear mongering.

There is a tsunami of undiagnosed cancers and heart disease coming our way, and unlike Covid which is "deadly" to a certain elderly demographic more often than not with compromised immune systems, these diseases do not discriminate by age.

You would imagine, after 18 months (by the time the next surge arises) our Health Authorities would have learned that they need to get very stringent with protecting those compromised immune systems, which they have failed so badly to do so far despite everything we know about this virus.

If the Health Authorities go into yet another winter without making any preparations then I don't see the public or politicians having the stomach to lock us down again....

If we are locked down again then clearly there is more to this than a virus.

As you say, vaccines are working, so what difference would another surge make ?

As to the highlighted, what would this entail ?

Silentcorner · 17-05-2021 10:36PM

Graham wrote: »

To be honest the only fear mongering I'm seeing is on this thread with bizarre prophecies of never ending lockdowns and restrictions for flu.

That is completely disingenuous.

We have been in different levels of lock downs for 14 months now and we still don't know when it will end completely....having been told we need to take this drastic action for two weeks to flatten the curve.

Our media has abandoned any sense of balance, in fact they had fanned fear for every one of those 14 months...daily briefings, ad campaigns, they use fear as a tool.

Silentcorner · 17-05-2021 10:37PM

charlie14 wrote: »

As you say, vaccines are working, so what difference would another surge make ?

As to the highlighted, what would this entail ?

I will not be responding to a poster who has consistently misrepresented me over and over again.

You are dishonest.

ceadaoin. · 17-05-2021 10:39PM

greenfarm wrote: »

My greatest worry is that by vaccinating all the adults and creating a wall Covid cant penetrate, we are leaving the kids wide open to more contagious virulent strains like the Indian one

If a strain appears that causes sickness in children, people are gonna lose their **** and we will be back in lockdown again until they are vaccinated.

Its all fun and games when old people get sick, but if little kids start filling up Crumlin, people gonna lose it

We better hurry up annd vaccinate kids before winter, **** us old people.

So what is the authorization situation for vaccines in the EU? Here in the US ,obviously they are under an emergency use authorization which isn't the same as approved. I can't see them going down this route for kids under 12, as the fact that they aren't as affected by covid doesnt justify it. It wouldn't be ethical to expose them to an unapproved vaccine just to protect adults tbh. I'd imagine at the rate the virus is collapsing, there won't be any need. Sure one of Bidens advisors was on tv saying he would continue masking kids for another 2-3 weeks and that's it. I think they are signaling no vaccine for them. What is the process in ireland/Europe?

Graham · 17-05-2021 10:44PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

That is completely disingenuous.

We have been in different levels of lock downs for 14 months now and we still don't know when it will end completely....having been told we need to take this drastic action for two weeks to flatten the curve.

Our media has abandoned any sense of balance, in fact they had fanned fear for every one of those 14 months...daily briefings, ad campaigns, they use fear as a tool.

Stop watching the daily briefings.

Stop looking backwards.

People are being vaccinated in good numbers.

Restrictions are being relaxed.

charlie14 · 17-05-2021 10:44PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

I will not be responding to a poster who has consistently misrepresented me over and over again.

You are dishonest.

I did not misrepresent you.

I just pointed out the absolute load of nonsense you were pushing here on naturally acquired herd immunity which seems to have left you out of sorts.

Penfailed · 17-05-2021 11:03PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

We have been in different levels of lock downs for 14 months now

No we haven't. We've had different levels of restrictions for 14 months now, including spells of lockdown.

gozunda · 17-05-2021 11:07PM

normanoffside wrote: »

Coming out of lockdown and dropping all mask mandates months ago doesn't see to have affected Texas

https://twitter.com/GregAbbott_TX/status/1394090593672994822

So no vaccines in Texas then? Interesting ...

Last I heard Texas has over 30% vaccinated with 2 doses and over 40% vaccinated with one dose - with infection rates decreasing as vaccination rates rose over the last couple of months...

But maybe it's that vaccination has got absolutely nothing to do with current rates of infection at all ...
..

Silentcorner · 17-05-2021 11:08PM

charlie14 wrote: »

I did not misrepresent you.

I just pointed out the absolute load of nonsense you were pushing here on naturally acquired herd immunity which seems to have left you out of sorts.

Yes you did, over and over again.

But let's not derail the thread.

What you do is ring the experts in Harvard and Stanford and tell them it's an "absolute load of nonsense"!

Then, tell all the Americans who are flocking to Florida because they followed the exact same policy (forced protection and natural immunity) since September last, and the Floridians themselves who have being enjoying as close to a normal life as possible unlike us over here...

Tell them that it is just plain science that you have to lock down every single person for a virus that is only deadly to a very narrow particular demographic....

That way we can just stay out of each others way.

Graham · 17-05-2021 11:23PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

Then, tell all the Americans who are flocking to Florida because they followed the exact same policy (forced protection and natural immunity) since September last, and the Floridians themselves who have being enjoying as close to a normal life as possible unlike us over here...

Makes no odds to us.

We're not attempting the natural herd immunity route.

gozunda · 17-05-2021 11:34PM

Graham wrote: »

Makes no odds to us.

We're not attempting the natural herd immunity route.

Neither is Florida apparently - with 35% of Florida's population havibg been fully vaccinated and 45% of the population having received at least one dose to date

What is with this extremely odd obsession with certain US states? Especially considering in the US - the overall data for the number of infections and deaths whilst not the worst globally is nothing to write home about...

Maybe we should be touting Cork as being the example here to follow - I hear they're doing great compared to Dublin ...

charlie14 · 17-05-2021 11:56PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

Yes you did, over and over again.

But let's not derail the thread.

What you do is ring the experts in Harvard and Stanford and tell them it's an "absolute load of nonsense"!

Then, tell all the Americans who are flocking to Florida because they followed the exact same policy (forced protection and natural immunity) since September last, and the Floridians themselves who have being enjoying as close to a normal life as possible unlike us over here...

Tell them that it is just plain science that you have to lock down every single person for a virus that is only deadly to a very narrow particular demographic....

That way we can just stay out of each others way.

John Ionannidis is Professor of Medicine, Health Research and Policy at Stanford University School Medicine and according to him with his natural herd immunity theory, at the lower end of his scale we would have reached it with 80,000 infections. 50,000 at the higher end. We passed those infections levels a long time ago and guess what. No natural herd immunity.
A load of nonsense.

Florida has not been without it`s lockdowns or restrictions and if you want to compare Ireland to Florida, (with it`s sunny climate), Ireland has 100.34 Covid deaths per 100K. Florida has 67% more Covid deaths at 168 per 100K.

You will not answer what I ask because I`m supposedly disengenuous, yet it doesn`t stop you asking me questions.
Go figure :rolleyes:

charlie14 · 18-05-2021 12:00AM

Graham wrote: »

Makes no odds to us.

We're not attempting the natural herd immunity route.

Nobody is.

Florida and Texas like everywhere else are relying on vaccines to reach herd immunity.

18-05-2021 01:27AM

The moon is apparently doing OK when it comes to Covid. Which is probably about as close as comparing us to Florida or Texas. Maybe stick to how the UK is doing.

Hugs.

peterc1991 · 18-05-2021 05:28AM

Graham wrote: »

To be honest the only fear mongering I'm seeing is on this thread with bizarre prophecies of never ending lockdowns and restrictions for flu.

Exactly. the fear mongering is actually from the people claiming to be against it. Complaining about every little thing and when things are good saying that it inevable we be ****ed again.

These people complaining every day oh they saying only a few weeks... and now we coming out of it and its like they hoping it happens again so they have something to give out about.

Pathetic go out and enjoy yourselfs lads. The virus is nearly dead.

Silentcorner · 18-05-2021 08:07AM

charlie14 wrote: »

Nobody is.

Florida and Texas like everywhere else are relying on vaccines to reach herd immunity.

Florida dropped restrictions last September.

Three months before the first vaccine was approved.

They have fared about average. Same as Sweden has in Europe.

The reason Florida is important is because it demonstrates that lock downs don't have much of an effect on outcomes.

The people who supported lock downs should be able to use the carnage in Florida as an example....they can't, there wasn't carnage.

There are plenty more States that have used very light restrictions, Nevada and Utah to name a few, that haven't suffered any differently to States who locked down hard....lock downs do not dictate the outcomes, but we employed one of the longest one's anyway despite our young demographic and our sparse population spread.

And like every one else who criticized lock downs, be they a medic, an academic or a politician, the Governor was slaughtered in the National Media at the time...but any body swallowing what the media are pushing these days would want to take a look at themselves!!!

Banana Republic 1 · 18-05-2021 08:12AM

TomSweeney wrote: »

How is it a game changer ? apart from shutting it all down...

Exactly

Silentcorner · 18-05-2021 08:15AM

Graham wrote: »

Makes no odds to us.

We're not attempting the natural herd immunity route.

What's our unemployment rate 25%?

Ya, we don't look like the smartest boys in the class...nobody is copying us!!!

pjohnson · 18-05-2021 08:26AM

charlie14 wrote: »

John Ionannidis is Professor of Medicine, Health Research and Policy at Stanford University School Medicine and according to him with his natural herd immunity theory, at the lower end of his scale we would have reached it with 80,000 infections. 50,000 at the higher end. We passed those infections levels a long time ago and guess what. No natural herd immunity.
A load of nonsense.

Florida has not been without it`s lockdowns or restrictions and if you want to compare Ireland to Florida, (with it`s sunny climate), Ireland has 100.34 Covid deaths per 100K. Florida has 67% more Covid deaths at 168 per 100K.

You will not answer what I ask because I`m supposedly disengenuous, yet it doesn`t stop you asking me questions.
Go figure :rolleyes:

Ionannidis seems to have gotten his degree from Walmart Medical School.

If anyone this side of the pond produced those numbers he'd be ridiculed every hour.

He must be responsible for the confusion between vaccination and natural herd immunity.

Boggles · 18-05-2021 08:50AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

Florida dropped restrictions last September.

Three months before the first vaccine was approved.

They have fared about average. Same as Sweden has in Europe.

The reason Florida is important is because it demonstrates that lock downs don't have much of an effect on outcomes.

The people who supported lock downs should be able to use the carnage in Florida as an example....they can't, there wasn't carnage.

There are plenty more States that have used very light restrictions, Nevada and Utah to name a few, that haven't suffered any differently to States who locked down hard....lock downs do not dictate the outcomes, but we employed one of the longest one's anyway despite our young demographic and our sparse population spread.

And like every one else who criticized lock downs, be they a medic, an academic or a politician, the Governor was slaughtered in the National Media at the time...but any body swallowing what the media are pushing these days would want to take a look at themselves!!!

Hang on.

You stated a few weeks ago that no 2 countries or areas can be compared, citing the only thing the have in common is that they contain humans.

But now for some reason Florida means restrictions don't work, all though the level of hospitalizations and deaths far exceeds Ireland.

So what exactly are you comparing it with and how are you coming to your conclusion? If we can't compare places.

I think you need the square that circle.

Silentcorner · 18-05-2021 08:57AM

Boggles wrote: »

Hang on.

You stated a few weeks ago that no 2 countries or areas can be compared, citing the only thing the have in common is that they contain humans.

But now for some reason Florida means restrictions don't work, all though the level of hospitalizations and deaths far exceeds Ireland.

So what exactly are you comparing it with and how are you coming to your conclusion? If we can't compare places.

I think you need the square that circle.

OK Boggles...I'll try to make this as simple as possible.

We have two elements. One - The Virus and Two - The Lock Downs

(I think we are all in agreement with some degree of restrictions)

The Virus behaves differently everywhere, depending on climate, population density, the health of the population and probably a few more I am not aware of....which makes comparisons between countries challenging, we are going to see a different result than India for example.

The Lock Downs (or severe restrictions) don't seem to have made any difference where they have been implemented....there is no evidence that the work, despite the massive social upheaval, economic and health costs, a little odd don't you think.

In fact, I am of the belief that if this virus originated in Germany, we'd never have locked down, we'd have all done what Sweden did.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI Read OP For Mod Warnings