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2021 Irish Property Market chat - *mod warnings post 1*

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Comments

  • #10082
    cnocbui
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,094 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Reins wrote: »
    First thing I'd be doing is taking the sale off that agent.
    4.5 mil property and agent can't be arsed to check the quality of some of the photo's :rolleyes:

    I'll bet the photos are fine - they look like they are displaying the thumbnail instead of the full res photo.

    But yes, they should check. Possible a third party was tasked with a job and messed up.


  • #10083
    hometruths
    Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,680 ✭✭✭hometruths


    awec wrote: »
    Yes.

    Me too.

    Their methodology is clear:

    GeoDirectory exclude "transitional" vacancies from their count.
    They consider properties that are "For sale" or "for rent" as transitional vacancies.
    Hence GeoDirectory do not count properties that are "for sale" or "for rent" as vacancies.

    Yet every time I state this, quoting GeoDirectory's methodology, Marius accuses me of posting misinformation.

    Yet weirdly he has thanked your posts saying Geo exclude transitional vacancies and that transitional vacancies include for sale and for rent!

    Gets quite irritating after a while, because it derails a more serious discussion about the huge problem of vacancies.


  • #10084
    Bass Reeves
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,329 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    cnocbui wrote: »
    I have a 128 year old cut stone 'house' in the distant reaches of Connemara. I had someone recently interested who took his architect to view it, who estimated €500,000 to renovate.

    I have no doubt that was for something that would end up gracing the front cover of an architecture magazine and would be put up for an award. I think my gut and caution was right. Even at a relatively paltry €300,000, I wouldn't be up for such a financial risk. Rental prospects would be dire, due to remoteness.

    It all depends on what you are going doing with it. I knew I would not be selling it but renting it so it was a case of working with what you had. It must be a huge house to incur such cost is it a listed building. I pass this huge old house on an farm now and again. The farm owners have abandoned it and have build a bunglow to live in. I love to have a crack at renovating it.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • #10085
    Marius34
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,173 ✭✭✭Marius34


    schmittel wrote: »
    Me too.

    Their methodology is clear:

    GeoDirectory exclude "transitional" vacancies from their count.
    They consider properties that are "For sale" or "for rent" as transitional vacancies.
    Hence GeoDirectory do not count properties that are "for sale" or "for rent" as vacancies.

    Yet every time I state this, quoting GeoDirectory's methodology, Marius accuses me of posting misinformation.

    Yet weirdly he has thanked your posts saying Geo exclude transitional vacancies and that transitional vacancies include for sale and for rent!

    Gets quite irritating after a while, because it derails a more serious discussion about the huge problem of vacancies.

    I thanked, because that's the same thing what I told you about the Census already. All the answers relates to Census. While you speak nonsense about GeoDirectory. Nor they speak about properties for sale in their methodology, nor about owners in hospital, etc.


  • #10086
    hometruths
    Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,680 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Marius34 wrote: »
    I thanked, because that's the same thing what I told you about the Census already. All the answers relates to Census. While you speak nonsense about GeoDirectory. Nor they speak about properties for sale in their methodology, nor about owners in hospital, etc.

    GeoDirectory do not count properties for sale or for rent as vacancies.

    What part of that statement is nonsense?


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  • #10087
    Marius34
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,173 ✭✭✭Marius34


    schmittel wrote: »
    GeoDirectory do not count properties for sale or for rent as vacancies.

    What part of that statement is nonsense?

    Highlighted one, I told like 10 times already. Nowhere they say that they don't count it, nowhere they say that they collect such information about properties. It's all about Census, and estimates why there could be difference.
    And I totally agree with what awec has responded to you.


  • #10088
    Graham
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 17,643 Mod ✭✭✭✭Graham


    Mod Note

    as per previous mod note, take the (yet another) geodirectory debate to a separate thread.

    Do not reply to this post.


  • #10089
    hometruths
    Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,680 ✭✭✭hometruths


    <SNIP>


  • #10090
    PropQueries
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭PropQueries


    Dr. Rory Hearne has a fairly long opinion piece in The Journal this evening. He seems very sceptical of any solutions the Government may bring in following the recent Maynooth estate fund issue.

    Link to article in The Journal here: https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/housing-investment-5433241-May2021/


  • #10091
    woejus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,510 ✭✭✭woejus


    Reins wrote: »
    First thing I'd be doing is taking the sale off that agent.
    4.5 mil property and agent can't be arsed to check the quality of some of the photo's :rolleyes:

    Grand gaff but some drawbacks - right on the beach (which is nice in Bridgehampton I suppose, but attracts scobes here), right beside the trainline.

    It does have ONE helipad though, one fewer than the winning house of 2021 out in Howth.

    Can imagine it is savage to be looking out during a storm!


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  • #10092
    Hubertj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,000 ✭✭✭Hubertj


    schmittel wrote: »
    And would you agree that the transient vacancies include vacancies that are for sale and for rent?

    I think I also agree with what you are saying.


  • #10093
    Amadan Dubh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,604 ✭✭✭Amadan Dubh


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Dr. Rory Hearne has a fairly long opinion piece in The Journal this evening. He seems very sceptical of any solutions the Government may bring in following the recent Maynooth estate fund issue.

    Link to article in The Journal here: https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/housing-investment-5433241-May2021/

    Important too are the comments and the most liked comments below. Unanimous in support of the article.


  • #10094
    RichardAnd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭RichardAnd


    Amadan Dubh wrote: »
    Important too are the comments and the most liked comments below. Unanimous in support of the article.

    The comments are even calling Varadkar "Varadkar" and not "Leo". That's something new from the Journal.ie.

    For myself, I wrote to all five local TDs on this issue. Sean Haughey had this to say:

    The Government has stated that it is opposed to this practice where there is no evidence of real additional supply and the Minister for Housing, Local Government and Heritage and the Minister for Finance are currently considering additional measures to tackle this. The Cabinet has already agreed on increasing the Part V provision from 10% to 20% to include affordable purchase which will ensure that every development has an affordable section. This in itself will prevent so called cuckoo funds from snapping up entire developments.

    In other words, nothing will be done.


  • #10095
    Hubertj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,000 ✭✭✭Hubertj


    <MoD SNIP>

    You’ve lost me now but when looking at MyHome.ie and 12,642 for sale - would that also include multiple units in a new development? Or would 1 entry be for an entire development? Or are new builds separate? There is a new build tab in MyHome that has 332 properties.... is that 332 properties total or 332 developments so could be a multiple of 332?


  • #10096
    Hubertj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,000 ✭✭✭Hubertj


    woejus wrote: »
    Grand gaff but some drawbacks - right on the beach (which is nice in Bridgehampton I suppose, but attracts scobes here), right beside the trainline.

    It does have ONE helipad though, one fewer than the winning house of 2021 out in Howth.

    Can imagine it is savage to be looking out during a storm!

    Perhaps security posted on the turret with some form of legal anti scobe repellant such as a water cannon?


  • #10097
    Reins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 111 ✭✭Reins


    https://twitter.com/crazyhouseprice/status/1391785573417988101

    More on the housing crisis.


  • #10098
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    PropQueries wrote: »
    Dr. Rory Hearne has a fairly long opinion piece in The Journal this evening. He seems very sceptical of any solutions the Government may bring in following the recent Maynooth estate fund issue.

    Link to article in The Journal here: https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/housing-investment-5433241-May2021/

    that fella will never be happy until private property is completely outlawed

    far left bluffer of the highest order


  • #10099
    RichardAnd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭RichardAnd


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    that fella will never be happy until private property is completely outlawed

    far left bluffer of the highest order


    He writes for Darwin's Waiting Room (aka, the Journal), of course he's a mad lefty.

    However, this is a good example of how a broken clock can be right sometimes.


  • #10100
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    RichardAnd wrote: »
    He writes for Darwin's Waiting Room (aka, the Journal), of course he's a mad lefty.

    However, this is a good example of how a broken clock can be right sometimes.

    any " economic manifesto" you get from PBP is written by him , he ran for them in the 2007 general election

    that he has such a profile is a testament to the politics of the media in this country , marxist idiot


  • #10101
    Amadan Dubh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,604 ✭✭✭Amadan Dubh


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    any " economic manifesto" you get from PBP is written by him , he ran for them in the 2007 general election

    that he has such a profile is a testament to the politics of the media in this country , marxist idiot

    His property market views are far from Marxist and an idiot he seems not, what is idiotic about his article?


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  • #10102
    Beigepaint
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 171 ✭✭Beigepaint


    Reins wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/crazyhouseprice/status/1391785573417988101

    More on the housing crisis.

    I was watching Claire Byrne and it twigged a conversation I had last week with an older guy - he’s mid 50s - at work. He has a windfall coming and he said he will give most of it to his daughter for a deposit.

    Yerman from the crazy house prices insta page asked the contributor - an FG TD, I think - why are all of these measures aimed at FTBs, and not single people, people rightsizing, second time buyers etc?

    He gave some waffly answer but it occurred to me that all of their new measures are targeting the children of their 55 to RIP age bracket demographic.

    Second time buyers and downsizers are neither their demographic nor the children of their demographic (as they are likely to be older, consumed by the housing crisis and/or their parents are likely already RIP) - so flip them. Flip them to heck.

    If the fella from my work gives his daughter a few quid and she uses the cash gift, the help to buy and the shared equity scheme she’ll be alright jack. What does that mean? Reciprocity in the form of votes.


  • #10103
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,501 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Of course its all about votes. The crisis only effects a very small number of people in comparison to the total population, its a part of why it is so hard to solve.


  • #10104
    combat14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,432 ✭✭✭combat14


    government now funding the vulture funds instead of local builders - what next !?

    https://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/governmentfund-for-small-builders-now-helpingfinance-cuckoo-schemes-40411383.html


  • #10105
    Amadan Dubh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,604 ✭✭✭Amadan Dubh


    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/stagnant-wages-and-expensive-housing-leave-young-people-in-ireland-worse-off-than-parents-1.4560760?mode=amp
    Stagnant wages and expensive housing leave young people in Ireland worse off than parents

    ESRI study suggests millennials first generation with lower living standards than before

    A combination of stagnant wages and higher housing costs have left young workers in Ireland financially worse off than their parents, according to a study by the Economic and Social Research Institute (ESRI).

    The research found that earnings have flat-lined for young people entering the Irish labour market and that workers in their 20s are – in real terms – earning less than they did in the 1990s and 2000s.

    It noted that there were 112,000 fewer 15-34 year olds in paid work in the final quarter of 2020 than a year earlier, compared to 93,000 fewer workers aged 35 and older.

    Proportionally, employment was 14 per cent below its pre-pandemic level for those age 15-34, compared to just 6 per cent below for those in the age 35-plus category.

    The study found there has been “widespread stagnation in earnings growth” since the 2008 financial crisis, with average earnings for those born in the 1980s no higher from age 25 to 35 than for those born in the 1970s.

    In addition to poor prospects in the labour market, the report said a growing share of young adults are facing high housing costs, primarily because most are forced to rent and a greater share end up paying more than 30 per cent of their disposable income on housing.

    “Policies that act to tackle the root causes of high rents will also disproportionately benefit younger adults who risk otherwise being left behind,” he said.

    Again, another authoritative source written about in the media on the desperate state of the housing market, particularly for those in their 20s and 30s (currently the population under the age of 45 is 1.7 times higher than that over the age of 45 meaning that the majority of the population couple be said to be negatively affected by the housing market). This voting demographic of course (ie the one unhappy with the housing situation) will continue to grow.

    It is quite depressing to note that the impact of the crash in 2008 has resulted in a whole generation being worse off financially than their parents. But until we see the end result of what is required in any policy to be specifically stated in any calls to fix the broken housing crisis - rents and house prices must be forced to drop substantially - no meaningful progress will be made. This has to be the stated end goal - force rents and prices to drop. Work back from there.


  • #10106
    combat14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,432 ✭✭✭combat14


    Amadan Dubh wrote: »
    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/stagnant-wages-and-expensive-housing-leave-young-people-in-ireland-worse-off-than-parents-1.4560760?mode=amp



    Again, another authoritative source written about in the media on the desperate state of the housing market, particularly for those in their 20s and 30s (currently the population under the age of 45 is 1.7 times higher than that over the age of 45 meaning that the majority of the population couple be said to be negatively affected by the housing market). This voting demographic of course (ie the one unhappy with the housing situation) will continue to grow.

    It is quite depressing to note that the impact of the crash in 2008 has resulted in a whole generation being worse off financially than their parents. But until we see the end result of what is required in any policy to be specifically stated in any calls to fix the broken housing crisis - rents and house prices must be forced to drop substantially - no meaningful progress will be made. This has to be the stated end goal - force rents and prices to drop. Work back from there.

    either build a mass of low cost houses - driving down rents and prices here - and generally the cost of living making the country ultimately more competitive in the long run

    or else a massive transfer of wealth from the older generation will be required e.g. significant property taxes on multiple home owners or other wealth and meaningful tax measures

    this will happen anyway as the afflicted voting demographic grows in size


  • #10107
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Amadan Dubh wrote: »
    His property market views are far from Marxist and an idiot he seems not, what is idiotic about his article?

    He ran for PBP in the general election of 2007 , how could he not be Marxist?


  • #10108
    Amadan Dubh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,604 ✭✭✭Amadan Dubh


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    He ran for PBP in the general election of 2007 , how could he not be Marxist?

    I was a card carrying member of the communist party of Ireland back in 06 before becoming a card carrying member of FG in 08. What would that make me?


  • #10109
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,090 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Amadan Dubh wrote: »
    I was a card carrying member of the communist party of Ireland back in 06 before becoming a card carrying member of FG in 08. What would that make me?

    Confused.


  • #10110
    Amadan Dubh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,604 ✭✭✭Amadan Dubh


    awec wrote: »
    Confused.

    Between 06-08 perhaps curious, confused, flexible. But it's still applicable to today's description of political beliefs?


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  • #10111
    MacronvFrugals
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,045 ✭✭✭MacronvFrugals


    Amadan Dubh wrote: »
    His property market views are far from Marxist and an idiot he seems not, what is idiotic about his article?

    His views on the property market are Marxist only when viewed through an overton window that places centrism as selling the country to vulture funds and the ESRI saying things like "“Each successive generation are less likely than the last to own their own home at the same age"


    From what i gather one of Hearne's worries is will his kids be able to afford housing in the future and judging by today's ESRI report he has every right to be worried!


This discussion has been closed.
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