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https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055940817/signature-rules

I fixed Irish car registration plate formatting. Discuss.

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124

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    #92
    feargantae
    Registered Users Posts: 536 ✭✭✭feargantae


    jeoun wrote: »
    Below is my idea:

    A12 G21 - 12th car registered in Galway in January 2021

    D33 CW21 - 33rd car registered in Carlow in April 2021

    J1234 D21 - 1234th car registered in Dublin in October 2021

    so each month is assigned a letter A through to L (or maybe to M in order to skip I )

    People would be more likely to remember the first letter and numbers say for example after witnessing a crime. At least the first letter and numbers would only apply to 26 cars and possibly less. Even after for example 10 years after implementing this system, the first sequence would still only apply to approx 260 cars rather than the thousands of cars that the first sequence (i.e. year and county) of our current system applies to.

    I see where you're coming from and kudos for the effort but i feel like the letters for months unnecessarily complicates things. Witnessing a crime isn't too often an occurance to warrant changing the whole system imo. We should just drop the current split year thing and go back to the 2013 system!

    Also, Carlow is just Ceatharlach, no need for a definite article ("an"). Semantics but the Gaeilgeoir in me has to say :pac:


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    #93
    jeoun
    Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭jeoun


    mickdw wrote: »
    Using your own example J1234 D21
    Someone remembering J12 is useless. That only narrows it down to 100 cars - everything from J1201 to J1299 in that first part sequence. Thats a possible 100 cars in every county and ever year if they only remembered J12. If that sequence went to a 5th digit, its only narrowing to 1000 cars per county per year.

    Chances are that only Dublin or possibly Cork will ever end up with four numbers in the first sequence. I know my idea is not perfect but I would hope that for most cars the letter would be followed by 3 numbers maximum. Small counties like Leitrim, Longford, Carlow etc would rarely register 1000 cars each month.


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    #94
    jeoun
    Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭jeoun


    feargantae wrote: »
    I see where you're coming from and kudos for the effort but i feel like the letters for months unnecessarily complicates things. Witnessing a crime isn't too often an occurance to warrant changing the whole system imo. We should just drop the current split year thing and go back to the 2013 system!

    Also, Carlow is just Ceatharlach, no need for a definite article ("an"). Semantics but the Gaeilgeoir in me has to say :pac:

    I screenshot my plates from a website where you can order plates. I never even noticed the “an”. I would be particular about those things too


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    #95
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    TaurenDruid wrote: »
    I remember second-hand car ads from before '87, and people having to buy an actual guide to the age of cars so they could tell how old one was. Ok, things are different now and there'd be an app and/or website... which'd mean relying on a company commissioned by the Department of Transport or something, so it'd take 5 years and €30 million...

    Why do you think it wouldn't work exactly same as everywhere else outside Ireland and UK where number plates don't display year of first registration?

    It's just common to include information about year of first reg in the ad. Everyone does that as it's obvious that buyers want to know this info.
    It's in the logbook anyway, so it's not like that people would be buying cars without knowing how old they are.


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    #96
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,264 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    jeoun wrote: »
    Chances are that only Dublin or possibly Cork will ever end up with four numbers in the first sequence. I know my idea is not perfect but I would hope that for most cars the letter would be followed by 3 numbers maximum. Small counties like Leitrim, Longford, Carlow etc would rarely register 1000 cars each month.

    Yes with 3 digits it starts to make sense.
    If someone was to remember J123 and its a red golf- that would likely narrow things down more than some saying it was a 152 D red golf.


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    #97
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,769 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    TaurenDruid wrote: »
    If you think that's "ridiculously complicated", maybe you shouldn't be driving. Literally all it is, is adding a letter for the month.

    Why the "you shouldn't be driving" personal attack?
    If you feel that there are virtues to the system well explain them in a cohesive fashion.


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    #98
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    mickdw wrote: »
    Because we are dreaming if we think simi would ever agree to removing the year from plate.
    It's not up to SIMI, they're only car salesmen!
    The government should be running with these types of rules and not be swayed by car sales lobbyists.
    If they're serious about their "Green" credentials, they'll welcome any options that reduce unnecessary & needless consumption, getting a vehicle with a "new season" plate on is one of these.
    I would be happy with a pseudo random serial number sequence.


    In the UK, there is a thriving business in the trade of NI plates as many would prefer their vehicles were not dated by the number it carries. Someone in NI must be minting it by constantly selling plates.


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    #99
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,769 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    jeoun wrote: »
    Below is my idea:

    A12 G21 - 12th car registered in Galway in January 2021

    D33 CW21 - 33rd car registered in Carlow in April 2021

    J1234 D21 - 1234th car registered in Dublin in October 2021

    so each month is assigned a letter A through to L (or maybe to M in order to skip I )

    People would be more likely to remember the first letter and numbers say for example after witnessing a crime. At least the first letter and numbers would only apply to 26 cars and possibly less. Even after for example 10 years after implementing this system, the first sequence would still only apply to approx 260 cars rather than the thousands of cars that the first sequence (i.e. year and county) of our current system applies to.

    Actually on reflection it could be quite a nice system, I should have studied more before being so dismissive. My car for instance would be B-720-WX-19, I just halved the present number because it was registered in February 2019, it would work well with classics too say an August registered 69 Cortina would be H-1-WX-69, the more I write it the more I like it.


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    #100
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    it works to give the motor industry a sales bump in the middle of the year.
    ...

    Does it work...


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    #101
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,769 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    beauf wrote: »
    Does it work...

    I don't think it does, according to a salesperson I know the July nudge isn't there at all.


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    #102
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,383 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    CoBo55 wrote: »
    I don't think it does, according to a salesperson I know the July nudge isn't there at all.

    In 2018 and 2019, July sales were approx 75% of January sales.
    It definitely makes a difference.

    It’s not fair on the people working in the industry to do such a high proportion of their business in one chunk of the year. There is no cons that I can see to having the existing system there.


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    #103
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,769 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    In 2018 and 2019, July sales were approx 75% of January sales.
    It definitely makes a difference.

    It’s not fair on the people working in the industry to do such a high proportion of their business in one chunk of the year. There is no cons that I can see to having the existing system there.

    Genuinely there's no evidence of those figures here in Wexford, July to December is tiny compared to January to July, I'm just going on the car reg numbers.


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    #104
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 23,816 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Lets face it, the entire plate system is antiquated now. All any car needs is a QR code or similar readable link to take an enforcement person back to a VIN number and address in 2 seconds flat. In fact it doesn't even need that much to identify a car by being proximate to it.

    The next development in registration plates will be their disappearance from the World.


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    #105
    Sparkey84
    Registered Users Posts: 292 ✭✭Sparkey84


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    Lets face it, the entire plate system is antiquated now. All any car needs is a QR code or similar readable link to take an enforcement person back to a VIN number and address in 2 seconds flat. In fact it doesn't even need that much to identify a car by being proximate to it.

    The next development in registration plates will be their disappearance from the World.

    qr code only makes it identifiable to a computer not the naked eye.


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    #106
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    colm_mcm wrote: »
    In 2018 and 2019, July sales were approx 75% of January sales.
    It definitely makes a difference.

    It’s not fair on the people working in the industry to do such a high proportion of their business in one chunk of the year. There is no cons that I can see to having the existing system there.

    True enough.

    It would be more readable with another dash.

    21-1-D-924 or even 21-D-1-924
    21-2-D-924 or even 21-D-2-924

    Little enough in the difference and some will find what ever you do confusing.

    21-1D-924
    21-2D-924


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    #107
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,769 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    Lets face it, the entire plate system is antiquated now. All any car needs is a QR code or similar readable link to take an enforcement person back to a VIN number and address in 2 seconds flat. In fact it doesn't even need that much to identify a car by being proximate to it.

    The next development in registration plates will be their disappearance from the World.

    QR codes are antiques in themselves...


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    #108
    GeneHunt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭GeneHunt


    CoBo55 wrote: »
    I don't think it does, according to a salesperson I know the July nudge isn't there at all.


    If you look at the SIMI stats (https://stats.beepbeep.ie/) there is about 20k of a jump in July compared to the months before and after.


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    #109
    GeneHunt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭GeneHunt


    CoBo55 wrote: »
    Genuinely there's no evidence of those figures here in Wexford, July to December is tiny compared to January to July, I'm just going on the car reg numbers.


    Here's the stats for car sales in Wexford, there's a clear jump in sales in July after 2012

    Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Total
    2007 1,493 868 735 462 580 399 322 204 135 79 31 12 5,320
    2008 1,668 677 542 367 249 145 438 155 63 46 7 0 4,357
    2009 539 247 196 120 133 112 75 58 54 34 4 2 1,574
    2010 524 346 337 215 239 221 131 110 103 76 26 9 2,337
    2011 625 282 385 259 206 245 98 71 48 24 18 2 2,263
    2012 580 281 342 116 192 101 65 53 35 29 16 2 1,812
    2013 473 273 258 136 151 21 329 80 51 39 10 2 1,823
    2014 697 311 445 192 206 28 454 100 69 49 17 3 2,571
    2015 828 343 460 174 111 19 684 143 121 60 12 7 2,962
    2016 1,074 448 609 195 145 31 682 144 105 36 12 5 3,486
    2017 1,058 310 434 141 107 18 706 144 93 43 15 0 3,069
    2018 1,035 417 439 180 132 22 725 116 73 27 8 0 3,174
    2019 905 302 439 164 103 9 604 112 59 50 17 2 2,766
    2020 817 301 164 5 25 11 561 109 154 52 22 2 2,223


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    #110
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Sparkey84 wrote: »
    qr code only makes it identifiable to a computer not the naked eye.
    Machine readable plates would need a human readable one as backup, just imagine trying to tell the cops the QR code!


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    #111
    GeneHunt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭GeneHunt


    jeoun wrote: »
    Below is my idea:

    A12 G21 - 12th car registered in Galway in January 2021

    D33 CW21 - 33rd car registered in Carlow in April 2021

    J1234 D21 - 1234th car registered in Dublin in October 2021

    so each month is assigned a letter A through to L (or maybe to M in order to skip I )

    People would be more likely to remember the first letter and numbers say for example after witnessing a crime. At least the first letter and numbers would only apply to 26 cars and possibly less. Even after for example 10 years after implementing this system, the first sequence would still only apply to approx 260 cars rather than the thousands of cars that the first sequence (i.e. year and county) of our current system applies to.

    I like this idea and the general layout of the reg. Having a letter for the month, keeps the figures down to probably 4 to 5 digits per county. The allotted letters for the months probably should be a fixed set of mixed letters and not the first 12 letters of the alphabet.

    Having the county and year at the end is also good, in helping to remember the reg. in the case of crimes.


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    #112
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    GeneHunt wrote: »
    Here's the stats for car sales in Wexford, there's a clear jump in sales in July after 2012

    Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Total
    2007 1,493 868 735 462 580 399 322 204 135 79 31 12 5,320
    2008 1,668 677 542 367 249 145 438 155 63 46 7 0 4,357
    2009 539 247 196 120 133 112 75 58 54 34 4 2 1,574
    2010 524 346 337 215 239 221 131 110 103 76 26 9 2,337
    2011 625 282 385 259 206 245 98 71 48 24 18 2 2,263
    2012 580 281 342 116 192 101 65 53 35 29 16 2 1,812
    2013 473 273 258 136 151 21 329 80 51 39 10 2 1,823
    2014 697 311 445 192 206 28 454 100 69 49 17 3 2,571
    2015 828 343 460 174 111 19 684 143 121 60 12 7 2,962
    2016 1,074 448 609 195 145 31 682 144 105 36 12 5 3,486
    2017 1,058 310 434 141 107 18 706 144 93 43 15 0 3,069
    2018 1,035 417 439 180 132 22 725 116 73 27 8 0 3,174
    2019 905 302 439 164 103 9 604 112 59 50 17 2 2,766
    2020 817 301 164 5 25 11 561 109 154 52 22 2 2,223
    Yes, but mostly because of delayed purchases from April & May and advanced purchases from July & August.
    The same situation for January, just shifting the sales to two peak months, plus a small number of extra vanity sales to assist in moving the metal.


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    #113
    jeoun
    Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭jeoun


    GeneHunt wrote: »
    I like this idea and the general layout of the reg. Having a letter for the month, keeps the figures down to probably 4 to 5 digits per county. The allotted letters for the months probably should be a fixed set of mixed letters and not the first 12 letters of the alphabet.

    Having the county and year at the end is also good, in helping to remember the reg. in the case of crimes.

    I had also thought of the following for the month letters:

    J for January
    F for February
    M for March
    A for April
    Y for MaY
    E for JunE
    L for JuLy
    G for AuGust
    S for September
    O for October
    N for November
    D for December

    e.g.
    Y321 MO21 - 321st car in Mayo registered in May 2021
    E321 MO21 - 321st car in Mayo registered in June 2021
    D321 MO21 - 321st car in Mayo registered in December 2021
    etc etc


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    #114
    GeneHunt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭GeneHunt


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    Lets face it, the entire plate system is antiquated now. All any car needs is a QR code or similar readable link to take an enforcement person back to a VIN number and address in 2 seconds flat. In fact it doesn't even need that much to identify a car by being proximate to it.

    The next development in registration plates will be their disappearance from the World.

    If there's no readable regs on cars how would you report something like - a dangerous driver, or a vehicle acting suspiciously in the neighbourhood?


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    #115
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,769 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    GeneHunt wrote: »
    If there's no readable regs on cars how would you report something like - a dangerous driver, or a vehicle acting suspiciously in the neighbourhood?

    Exactly, it's a ridiculous suggestion(QR codes I mean).


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    #116
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,383 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    CoBo55 wrote: »
    Exactly, it's a ridiculous suggestion(QR codes I mean).

    I think that’s a recurring theme in this thread :D


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    #117
    CoBo55
    Registered Users Posts: 8,769 ✭✭✭CoBo55


    GeneHunt wrote: »
    Here's the stats for car sales in Wexford, there's a clear jump in sales in July after 2012

    Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Total
    2007 1,493 868 735 462 580 399 322 204 135 79 31 12 5,320
    2008 1,668 677 542 367 249 145 438 155 63 46 7 0 4,357
    2009 539 247 196 120 133 112 75 58 54 34 4 2 1,574
    2010 524 346 337 215 239 221 131 110 103 76 26 9 2,337
    2011 625 282 385 259 206 245 98 71 48 24 18 2 2,263
    2012 580 281 342 116 192 101 65 53 35 29 16 2 1,812
    2013 473 273 258 136 151 21 329 80 51 39 10 2 1,823
    2014 697 311 445 192 206 28 454 100 69 49 17 3 2,571
    2015 828 343 460 174 111 19 684 143 121 60 12 7 2,962
    2016 1,074 448 609 195 145 31 682 144 105 36 12 5 3,486
    2017 1,058 310 434 141 107 18 706 144 93 43 15 0 3,069
    2018 1,035 417 439 180 132 22 725 116 73 27 8 0 3,174
    2019 905 302 439 164 103 9 604 112 59 50 17 2 2,766
    2020 817 301 164 5 25 11 561 109 154 52 22 2 2,223

    Easily eliminated by the monthly letter system proposed here, I'm getting to like it more and more. Shame we'll never actually see it on a vehicle but it does have promse.


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    #118
    gary550
    Registered Users Posts: 638 ✭✭✭gary550


    The IAFD tried in vain years ago to get the age removed from the plates of funeral limousines and hearses on the argument that they did very small mileage, don't travel far and cost in the 6 figures to upgrade and that a family may think less of them if they seen a 10 year old hearse pulling up.

    I thought it was a reasonable argument at the time and still do now.


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    #119
    jeoun
    Registered Users Posts: 213 ✭✭jeoun


    gary550 wrote: »
    The IAFD tried in vain years ago to get the age removed from the plates of funeral limousines and hearses on the argument that they did very small mileage, don't travel far and cost in the 6 figures to upgrade and that a family may think less of them if they seen a 10 year old hearse pulling up.

    I thought it was a reasonable argument at the time and still do now.

    I agree. They should be allowed to use the ZV plates classic cars use or something similar - ZH maybe!


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    #120
    Isambard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Isambard


    year and county don't need to be part of the number, just put them smaller in a line of their own and have a serial number. if a Nationwide serial number series would be too cumbersome, then have a letter for each county and then the number. Handily there are 26 of each...


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    #121
    GeneHunt
    Registered Users Posts: 844 ✭✭✭GeneHunt


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Yes, but mostly because of delayed purchases from April & May and advanced purchases from July & August.
    The same situation for January, just shifting the sales to two peak months, plus a small number of extra vanity sales to assist in moving the metal.


    Absolutely, totally agree.

    We need to get away from the snobbery mentality of keeping up with the Jones and maybe having a letters for the months on the number plate would dilute the system so much that people wouldn't be fixated on it.


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