Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

13-04-2021 11:16AM

joseywhales wrote: »

So do you propose mhq for ten years then? Do you imagine the country would financially survive ten years of almost no movement of people?

See, the thing to remember is that these people don't want internment for people who get to travel abroad to study out of concern for public health. It's out of jealousy.

13-04-2021 11:23AM

KanyeSouthEast wrote: »

Maybe or maybe not but they also may have been at a house party in Woodies in Costa coffee who knows!

Wait, there's a house party in a woodies which is entirely housed inside a Costa coffee?

Red Silurian · 13-04-2021 11:54AM

joseywhales wrote: »

So do you propose mhq for ten years then? Do you imagine the country would financially survive ten years of almost no movement of people?

What I suggested was that it would take 10 years for us all to be vaccinated at the current rate, hopefully I'm being pessimistic with that timescale. There are many ways in which MHQ can end, full vaccination is one of them, others such as a global drop in cases or as countries get the virus under control we could open to them one by one

Most likely it will end in a few months time when the Taoiseach will stand before the nation and tell us his half-arsed attempt isn't working

joseywhales · 13-04-2021 12:03PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

What I suggested was that it would take 10 years for us all to be vaccinated at the current rate, hopefully I'm being pessimistic with that timescale. There are many ways in which MHQ can end, full vaccination is one of them, others such as a global drop in cases or as countries get the virus under control we could open to them one by one

Most likely it will end in a few months time when the Taoiseach will stand before the nation and tell us his half-arsed attempt isn't working

The problem is that "countries get virus under control" is a subjective measure, the government need objective targets otherwise they are actually taking undemocratic power, whereby internment of passengers is based on the whims of the minister. All he has to do is state clearly what the objective criteria will be to end mhq for a country.

josip · 13-04-2021 12:09PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

Not at all, this is a new system and it is only right that it gets challenged in the courts, it's what our courts are there for. If it turns out that there is a flaw in the system isn't it better we find out as early as possible

But the govt are not allowing it to get challenged in courts.
They've now also backed down on this case and she is free to leave today with a negative test.
They know that it's bad law.

munchkin_utd · 13-04-2021 12:14PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

What I suggested was that it would take 10 years for us all to be vaccinated at the current rate

yep, but now there'll be about 1 million doses delivered in the next month whereas there was 1 million doses to now in total since before christmas , and therell be more again next month, plus some of the supply will be J+J vaccines which are only 1 shot so once people get that then they arent dipping into future deliveries to get their second shot. The deliveries to Ireland and the EU are about to balloon way beyond what we saw in the past months.

not wanting to get a little off topic, but its necessary. The media in Ireland is VERY anglo-saxon media centric. This means the quarantine in NZ and AUS is massive news, this means the progress in the UK is massive news, as is whats happening in the USA. The UK media also REALLY focused on the AZ vaccine as that's the one they are relying on to get the job done, but for EU countries thats not so relevant.

But, in news almost completely missed out on by the irish media, a new additional plant for the Pfizer/ Biontech vaccine went online in Marburg Germany in the past weeks which has the capacity of a billion doses a year and will supply about 250 million doses to the Eu already before the end of the summer, and thats on top of whats already there in Germany Belgium and Netherlands which are now fully operational (finally!)

That Marburg plant alone can supply all the Pfizer vaccine and later tweaked anti-variant booster jabs to the EU so all taken together its not looking that bad

OF course, you dont get this from NPHET because either they are clueless or dont want to give people hope (or both combined)

Red Silurian · 13-04-2021 12:21PM

joseywhales wrote: »

The problem is that "countries get virus under control" is a subjective measure, the government need objective targets otherwise they are actually taking undemocratic power, whereby internment of passengers is based on the whims of the minister. All he has to do is state clearly what the objective criteria will be to end mhq for a country.

Data is definitely the way to go

While they're at it they could give us figures such as what hospital and case numbers need to be to relax specific lockdown measures within the country as well.

I saw a news report on the telly last weekend about a city in California called "Monterey" they were moving from an orange to red level of restrictions because the incidence rate and the hospital attendance numbers were all above a particular figure and the vaccination numbers were below a particular figure...

Valhallapt · 13-04-2021 12:30PM

munchkin_utd wrote: »

yep, but now there'll be about 1 million doses delivered in the next month whereas there was 1 million doses to now in total since before christmas , and therell be more again next month, plus some of the supply will be J+J vaccines which are only 1 shot so once people get that then they arent dipping into future deliveries to get their second shot. The deliveries to Ireland and the EU are about to balloon way beyond what we saw in the past months.

not wanting to get a little off topic, but its necessary. The media in Ireland is VERY anglo-saxon media centric. This means the quarantine in NZ and AUS is massive news, this means the progress in the UK is massive news, as is whats happening in the USA. The UK media also REALLY focused on the AZ vaccine as that's the one they are relying on to get the job done, but for EU countries thats not so relevant.

But, in news almost completely missed out on by the irish media, a new additional plant for the Pfizer/ Biontech vaccine went online in Marburg Germany in the past weeks which has the capacity of a billion doses a year and will supply about 250 million doses to the Eu already before the end of the summer, and thats on top of whats already there in Germany Belgium and Netherlands which are now fully operational (finally!)

That Marburg plant alone can supply all the Pfizer vaccine and later tweaked anti-variant booster jabs to the EU so all taken together its not looking that bad

OF course, you dont get this from NPHET because either they are clueless or dont want to give people hope (or both combined)

Not dragging it off topic at all, a very well informed post, thanks!

Red Silurian · 13-04-2021 12:48PM

munchkin_utd wrote: »

yep, but now there'll be about 1 million doses delivered in the next month whereas there was 1 million doses to now in total since before christmas , and therell be more again next month, plus some of the supply will be J+J vaccines which are only 1 shot so once people get that then they arent dipping into future deliveries to get their second shot. The deliveries to Ireland and the EU are about to balloon way beyond what we saw in the past months.

not wanting to get a little off topic, but its necessary. The media in Ireland is VERY anglo-saxon media centric. This means the quarantine in NZ and AUS is massive news, this means the progress in the UK is massive news, as is whats happening in the USA. The UK media also REALLY focused on the AZ vaccine as that's the one they are relying on to get the job done, but for EU countries thats not so relevant.

But, in news almost completely missed out on by the irish media, a new additional plant for the Pfizer/ Biontech vaccine went online in Marburg Germany in the past weeks which has the capacity of a billion doses a year and will supply about 250 million doses to the Eu already before the end of the summer, and thats on top of whats already there in Germany Belgium and Netherlands which are now fully operational (finally!)

That Marburg plant alone can supply all the Pfizer vaccine and later tweaked anti-variant booster jabs to the EU so all taken together its not looking that bad

OF course, you dont get this from NPHET because either they are clueless or dont want to give people hope (or both combined)

I've been thinking since the initial stop on our usage of the AZ vaccine that it smelled of politics. If Biontech have a plant moving in Marburg that only strengthens my belief!

kirving · 13-04-2021 12:50PM

On one hand, all we hear is numbers (2km, 5km 20km, daily cases, X number of people from Y number of households, Z number of people allowed into a shop, Q number of people arriving into the country last week....)

But when it comes to using apply similar criteria (ie: data) to justify government decisions - nothing. It really isn't a lot to ask IMO, but if the government were to use data to make those same decisions, it would be completely impossible to talk their way out of ever more ridiculous contradictions.

In my job, I don't get away with woolly language like "concern", "worrisome trends" and "hopeful".

Personally, MHQ is not my preferred option for host of reasons.

But if that's the plan, then justify it, stick to it, and legally enforce it under any and all circumstances for absolutely everybody, pilots and truck drivers included.

Changing definitions and goalposts every single day totally undermines the goal of MHQ and justifiable puts the public opinion against it.

normanoffside · 13-04-2021 12:51PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

I would expect the Universities to have made an exemption to the Erasmus requirement during the pandemic

How could they get an adequate degree in French if they haven't even been to France to practise and polish up their language skills?

What you propose is disadvantaging our future workforce and those students future careers from minimal gain. The impact on the students is disproportionate to any perceived risks of flying.

Throwaway89 · 13-04-2021 12:54PM

faceman wrote: »

Never mind the hard done by Erasmus students. Seems elite sportspeople have it so much worse the government has dropped their requirement to quarantine full stop. Poor things.

Wrong - please get your facts right before posting.

Roberto Lopez (Shamrock Rovers) had to spend 2wks in quarantine following international duty with cape verde. Missing 2x games for Rovers. Two appeals were lodged, and both declined.

Before you jump LoI is not an elite sport.....etc...etc...it's worth noting that when sports returned after xmas the LoI was specified as elite and GAA wasn't.

Where'd you see elite sports people don't have to quarantine?

Red Silurian · 13-04-2021 12:56PM

normanoffside wrote: »

How could they get an adequate degree in French if they haven't even been to France to practise and polish up their language skills?

What you propose is disadvantaging our future workforce and those students future careers from minimal gain. The impact on the students is disproportionate to any perceived risks of flying.

Makes sense if they are out socialising with french people, going in to lectures and dining in the restaurants but there's only so much they can learn from the bi-weekly trip to the supermarket

a_squirrelman · 13-04-2021 12:57PM

Throwaway89 wrote: »

Wrong - please get your facts right before posting.

Roberto Lopez (Shamrock Rovers) had to spend 2wks in quarantine following international duty with cape verde. Missing 2x games for Rovers. Two appeals were lodged, and both declined.

Before you jump LoI is not an elite sport.....etc...etc...it's worth noting that when sports returned after xmas the LoI was specified as elite and GAA wasn't.

Where'd you see elite sports people don't have to quarantine?

Well I'm guessing it's related to the possible exemption for the rugby players.

NSAman · 13-04-2021 12:58PM

josip wrote: »

And another one.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2021/0412/1209528-hotel-quarantine-court/

All of the challenges are now starting to take up a lot of valuable court time.

“He noted however, that some hotels do not consider the day a person arrives to be Day 1 and there may be a dispute about whether or not today is Day 10.”

“He acknowledged the urgency of the case and adjourned it until tomorrow morning.”

I had to laugh at these comments...

normanoffside · 13-04-2021 01:00PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

Makes sense if they are out socialising with french people, going in to lectures and dining in the restaurants but there's only so much they can learn from the bi-weekly trip to the supermarket

Yeah but France hasn't been locked down like Ireland for the whole year.
Even if it was how would anyone have know that last September?

Red Silurian · 13-04-2021 01:01PM

Throwaway89 wrote: »

Wrong - please get your facts right before posting.

Roberto Lopez (Shamrock Rovers) had to spend 2wks in quarantine following international duty with cape verde. Missing 2x games for Rovers. Two appeals were lodged, and both declined.

Before you jump LoI is not an elite sport.....etc...etc...it's worth noting that when sports returned after xmas the LoI was specified as elite and GAA wasn't.

Where'd you see elite sports people don't have to quarantine?

Rynhardt Elstadt who plays for Toulouse had to miss the Munster/Toulouse game 2 weeks ago as he had been to his home country (South Africa) the week before

Corholio · 13-04-2021 01:01PM

Throwaway89 wrote: »

Wrong - please get your facts right before posting.

Roberto Lopez (Shamrock Rovers) had to spend 2wks in quarantine following international duty with cape verde. Missing 2x games for Rovers. Two appeals were lodged, and both declined.

Before you jump LoI is not an elite sport.....etc...etc...it's worth noting that when sports returned after xmas the LoI was specified as elite and GAA wasn't.

Where'd you see elite sports people don't have to quarantine?

I think you misunderstood his post.

IRFU are much more able to put pressure on government to make special dispensation and to give magic variant cover than any team in LOI. The excuse will be that it's a fluid situation and decisions change, which we all know is nonsense if the rugby one happened first.

faceman · 13-04-2021 01:08PM

Throwaway89 wrote: »

Wrong - please get your facts right before posting.

Roberto Lopez (Shamrock Rovers) had to spend 2wks in quarantine following international duty with cape verde. Missing 2x games for Rovers. Two appeals were lodged, and both declined.

Before you jump LoI is not an elite sport.....etc...etc...it's worth noting that when sports returned after xmas the LoI was specified as elite and GAA wasn't.

Where'd you see elite sports people don't have to quarantine?

Try and keep up

https://www.rte.ie/sport/other-sport/2021/0412/1209290-elite-athletes-may-receive-quarantine-exemption/

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/france-expected-to-receive-elite-athlete-s-exemption-to-travel-to-dublin-1.4535133?mode=amp

Red Silurian · 13-04-2021 02:04PM

faceman wrote: »

Try and keep up

https://www.rte.ie/sport/other-sport/2021/0412/1209290-elite-athletes-may-receive-quarantine-exemption/

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/france-expected-to-receive-elite-athlete-s-exemption-to-travel-to-dublin-1.4535133?mode=amp

"Nearing agreement" and "being in place" are 2 very different things

Corholio · 13-04-2021 02:11PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

"Nearing agreement" and "being in place" are 2 very different things

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1381952426895405056?s=19

mmclo · 13-04-2021 02:40PM

Corholio wrote: »

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1381952426895405056?s=19

But people can't leave MHQ for a funeral even if vaccinated, wonder did they forget the AG again on this

Throwaway89 · 13-04-2021 02:40PM

faceman wrote: »

Try and keep up

https://www.rte.ie/sport/other-sport/2021/0412/1209290-elite-athletes-may-receive-quarantine-exemption/

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/france-expected-to-receive-elite-athlete-s-exemption-to-travel-to-dublin-1.4535133?mode=amp

Apologies - I didn't realise the goalposts moved again.

faceman · 13-04-2021 02:46PM

Throwaway89 wrote: »

Apologies - I didn't realise the goalposts moved again.

No apology necessary. Sadly goalpost moving has been a long running tactic by the government.

munchkin_utd · 13-04-2021 03:04PM

heres a nice article on the type of people coming back in advance of the new countries being added to the quarantine list: students starting a course in Ireland, someone returning from looking after relatives abroad and what seems to be one of the 100s of thousands of non irish born working in Ireland (and unlike swathes of smart arsed irish who take leisure trips to Dubai or other sunny climes, work and pay tax) returning from a family visit to Romania.

Their reasons for travelling now is that waiting would have cost too much and they couldnt afford it.
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/its-costly-we-cant-afford-it-peoplearrivingintoireland-today-to-avoid-new-mandatory-hotel-quarantine-rules-40308670.html

josip · 13-04-2021 03:19PM

Corholio wrote: »

I think you misunderstood his post.

IRFU are much more able to put pressure on government to make special dispensation and to give magic variant cover than any team in LOI. The excuse will be that it's a fluid situation and decisions change, which we all know is nonsense if the rugby one happened first.

Correct.
Hugo MacNeill for example would have access to TDs that the LoI/FAI could only dream about.

Feria40 · 13-04-2021 03:37PM

munchkin_utd wrote: »

heres a nice article on the type of people coming back in advance of the new countries being added to the quarantine list: students starting a course in Ireland, someone returning from looking after relatives abroad and what seems to be one of the 100s of thousands of non irish born working in Ireland (and unlike swathes of smart arsed irish who take leisure trips to Dubai or other sunny climes, work and pay tax) returning from a family visit to Romania.

Their reasons for travelling now is that waiting would have cost too much and they couldnt afford it.
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/its-costly-we-cant-afford-it-peoplearrivingintoireland-today-to-avoid-new-mandatory-hotel-quarantine-rules-40308670.html

This is the thing that really gets me. I can't recall if it's one in every four or one in every five people living in Ireland are not born here.

I am married to an EU national and there appears to be some on boards.ie that think it's perfectly fine into the medium term for us and our children not to see family abroad.

Red Silurian · 13-04-2021 03:42PM

munchkin_utd wrote: »

heres a nice article on the type of people coming back in advance of the new countries being added to the quarantine list: students starting a course in Ireland, someone returning from looking after relatives abroad and what seems to be one of the 100s of thousands of non irish born working in Ireland (and unlike swathes of smart arsed irish who take leisure trips to Dubai or other sunny climes, work and pay tax) returning from a family visit to Romania.

Their reasons for travelling now is that waiting would have cost too much and they couldnt afford it.
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/its-costly-we-cant-afford-it-peoplearrivingintoireland-today-to-avoid-new-mandatory-hotel-quarantine-rules-40308670.html

So tourists are't coming in? Sounds to me like MHQ is doing exactly what it was intended to do

Feria40 wrote: »

This is the thing that really gets me. I can't recall if it's one in every four or one in every five people living in Ireland are not born here.

I am married to an EU national and there appears to be some on boards.ie that think it's perfectly fine into the medium term for us and our children not to see family abroad.

It's for a few months, don't be so dramatic! Plus flights are still going so there's very little stopping you and if you quarantine on your return then you won't be bringing variants back so win-win

timmyntc · 13-04-2021 03:44PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

So tourists are't coming in? Sounds to me like MHQ is doing exactly what it was intended to do

Tourists were never coming in.
The country is shut - there is no reason for tourists to even consider coming here.

As said before, 1/5th of our population is foreign. So these people travelling to visit family would be the vast majority of all travel to/from this country over the last year.

Feria40 · 13-04-2021 03:46PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

So tourists are't coming in? Sounds to me like MHQ is doing exactly what it was intended to do

It's for a few months, don't be so dramatic! Plus flights are still going so there's very little stopping you and if you quarantine on your return then you won't be bringing variants back so win-win

.What tourists are coming in? Everything here has been closed! There is no more than a dribble of people coming in or out of the country that might be tourists

What changes in a few months? How am I being dramatic?

Can we have some fcuking control on the airports from high risk countries please?

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