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Covid 19 Part XXXIV-249,437 ROI(4,906 deaths) 120,195 NI (2,145 deaths)(01/05)Read OP

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  • #5792
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Faugheen wrote: »
    You mean the message of doom and gloom like the one below from Ronan Glynn?

    https://twitter.com/eoghanymurphy/status/1381660746048806919?s=21

    Oh wait...
    Who said anything about gloom? That really is in your head. Their message is of caution and is at times very alarmist. It is also sharply critical, vaguely supportive and very occasionally like the one you could find, positive. It's complex world but you do need to be consistent in your messaging, something they have been very poor at, at times. Donnelly, for all his many flaws, has been better as have many of the political establishment.


  • #5793
    prunudo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,220 ✭✭✭prunudo


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Cherry-picked a statement and used it to misrepresent what was being said.

    No response to the question I actually asked, which shows you are truly out of your depth when the facts are spelt out for you.

    Tbh, I've no time to respond to your posts. They constantly defend nphet and commonly misrepresent what posts being critical of nphet are saying.
    I will agree with one thing though, the government are hiding behind them and the media are taking their ques from nphet so ther many things at blame. But ultimately its nphet policy that means we are still essentially in level 5 lockdown with many businesses closed and many people unable to see family or friends.


  • #5794
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 513 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Jim_Hodge wrote: »
    At least take precautions.

    It will also be more aesthetically pleasing for the rest of us if people in general hump their friends in their back gardens, rather than on park benches.


  • #5795
    WoollyRedHat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,462 ✭✭✭✭WoollyRedHat


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Kingston Mills tonight saying not a risk as such as both will give immunity , but outside of regulations alright and would be difficult to work out immunity being given .
    Might be better !
    But then effectively ditching AZ which will result on pressure on other supplies.
    There has been discussion about just one dose of Pfizer for example witha later booster , for example , as one dose gives such good immunity .


    Did he outline reasons why he thought it should be ok. The problem was there's no data on this I thought.


  • #5796
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    prunudo wrote: »
    Tbh, I've no time to respond to your posts. They constantly defend nphet and commonly misrepresent what posts being critical of nphet are saying.
    I will agree with one thing though, the government are hiding behind them and the media are taking their ques from nphet so ther many things at blame. But ultimately its nphet policy that means we are still essentially in level 5 lockdown with many businesses closed and many people unable to see family or friends.

    And the posts constantly criticising NPHET misrepresent what their role is and include whacky Gemma-level conspiracy theories.

    It’s NPHET policy but it doesn’t have to be. That’s the point. People make the point that NPHET make the decisions when simple fact is the government want to absolve all responsibility for its handling and just point the finger at the ‘public health advice’, which they also CHOSE to ignore for nearly a year!

    No surprise you don’t want to respond. Another person who runs away when presented with the facts. You’ll be back again later running the same tried and tested lines which have been debunked on numerous occasions now.


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  • #5797
    surveybeacon
    Site Banned Posts: 5 ✭surveybeacon


    terrible picture...


  • #5798
    prunudo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,220 ✭✭✭prunudo


    Faugheen wrote: »
    And the posts constantly criticising NPHET misrepresent what their role is and include whacky Gemma-level conspiracy theories.

    It’s NPHET policy but it doesn’t have to be. That’s the point. People make the point that NPHET make the decisions when simple fact is the government want to absolve all responsibility for its handling and just point the finger at the ‘public health advice’, which they also CHOSE to ignore for nearly a year!

    No surprise you don’t want to respond. Another person who runs away when presented with the facts. You’ll be back again later running the same tried and tested lines which have been debunked on numerous occasions now.

    So because I'm critical of the pace of opening I'm a whacky Gemma-level conspiracy theorist.
    Good bye.


  • #5799
    daydorunrun
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 784 ✭✭✭daydorunrun


    Faugheen wrote: »
    Do you agree that opening too fast has a highly likely chance to lead to an increase in close contacts, which have been remaining steady for a few weeks now?

    The people likely to mix in larger numbers are those who haven’t had a vaccine. That’s a fact.

    Ronan Glynn said all of this last Thursday, yet people who don’t actually watch the briefings have no idea of any context as to why these statements are being made.

    If NPHET weren’t overly conservative then it wouldn’t be doing it’s job. The government is supposed to balance out its recommendations with the potential impact on the economy and society.

    There is a committee of all the top civil servants that is supposed to analyse all of this, as well as a Cabinet Sub-Committee made up of the Taoiseach, Tanaiste and the ministers for health, finance, public expenditure and transport.

    Who exactly is doing their jobs here, and who isn’t?

    The people who aren’t doing their jobs are the ones who are getting the vitriol compared to what’s thrown at those who are doing their jobs.

    It’s not an either or situation- the government and NEPHET ****ed up at Christmas by going from hard lockdown to a 3 week holiday from a pandemic in the name of a meaningful Christmas.

    There’s tonnes of stuff that could and should be open now - outdoor sports for kids, click and collect etc. Instead we still need to book an appointment for kids shoes!!

    Opening too quick! Building pent up demand is only going to cause problems down the line anyway. People are walking around with pretty sharp haircuts! They are pushing business underground.

    Meanwhile headline in the indo is summer in danger because of AZ vaccine issues. People have and are giving up. They are losing the dressing room.

    “You tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is, never try.” Homer.



  • #5800
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    prunudo wrote: »
    So because I'm critical of the pace of opening I'm a whacky Gemma-level conspiracy theorist.
    Good bye.

    Have you said that NPHET are power-hungry? Attention seekers? Want to control the country? Want to keep us locked down and never reopen? Are making all the decisions?

    There are numerous other statements I could make, but if you have made none of the above statements then obviously it doesn’t apply to you.

    Did I say you specifically made any of those posts? No, I never. So don’t be so precious.


  • #5801
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,028 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Gael23 wrote: »
    If there’s no considerable give in May there’s going to be problems

    The Irish people haven't got the balls to cause problems, just as Micheal Martin hasn't the balls to actually make a decision on anything.


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  • #5802
    .42.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 303 ✭✭.42.


    NPHET should simply be advising the Government. Nothing More.

    Communication to the Irish Public should have been from a Government Minister only.


  • #5803
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    .42. wrote: »
    NPHET should simply be advising the Government. Nothing More.

    Communication to the Irish Public should have been from a Government Minister only.

    And that’s all they do.

    Anyone who believes otherwise can blame the government who aren’t willing to take responsibility for the bad things caused by their own negligence.


  • #5804
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 10,049 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    .42. wrote: »
    NPHET should simply be advising the Government. Nothing More.

    Communication to the Irish Public should have been from a Government Minister only.

    Why a Mechanical Engineer with management consultancy background and not actual public health officials with the expertise to accurately communicate public health detail?


  • #5805
    .42.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 303 ✭✭.42.


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Why a Mechanical Engineer with management consultancy background and not actual public health officials with the expertise to accurately communicate public health detail?

    Empathy - NPHET have been lacking it from day 1.


  • #5806
    techdiver
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,550 ✭✭✭techdiver


    Faugheen wrote: »
    And that’s all they do.

    Anyone who believes otherwise can blame the government who aren’t willing to take responsibility for the bad things caused by their own negligence.

    With respect, that is not "just" what they do. If they were exclusively in an advisory capacity (like many other civil servants), they wouldn't be constantly front and centre on tv and posting policy positions on social media.

    If we want the government fully accountable for decisions then NPHET need to button up, pass on all information to the government and let them make the decisions.

    Like it or not we have de facto handed over all public policy decisions to NPHET. They know this as well as we do. They are only doing their job, I agree. But their job has a laser focused narrow remit.


  • #5807
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    Seems like things are kicking off in Canada with the country surpassing the US in daily Covid cases per capita, and their vaccination rollout is in serious difficulty with front line healthcare workers only getting one vaccine dose for now. Canadian hospitals are filling up and their vaccine deliveries are unstable. The US did give them 1 1/2 million doses of Astrazeneca. I'd say Justin Trudeau will be in trouble for his handling of the country's response.


  • #5808
    Faugheen
    Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    techdiver wrote: »
    If we want the government fully accountable for decisions then NPHET need to button up, pass on all information to the government and let them make the decisions.

    Like it or not we have de facto handed over all public policy decisions to NPHET. They know this as well as we do. They are only doing their job, I agree. But their job has a laser focused narrow remit.

    They do that, and the Cabinet asks them to state why they are making these recommendations. Is that not passing over all information?

    And I agree their job has a narrow limit. Anyone who suggests otherwise is deluded, but why did the government set up an advisory group containing the top civil servants to analyse the economic and social impact if it’s not being used properly?

    The fact the the government is blindly following NPHET is their own fault, because they actually make the decisions.


  • #5809
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,121 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Faugheen wrote: »
    And that’s all they do.

    Anyone who believes otherwise can blame the government who aren’t willing to take responsibility for the bad things caused by their own negligence.

    No, they have been given an unsupervised public platform. Its not NPHETS fault.....it should never have been set up like this by the government. Whether NPHET are only advisors or not, the perception is that they run the show. Compare to the UK when press conferences are joint, with Chris Whitty & team and government ministers sharing a platform. The minister of the day handles the questions, defers to the scientist on scientific matters, but answers matters of politics and reopening themselves.

    That is the way that it should have been set up. One combined presence and voice. What we have is NPHET crowding the airwaves, the press kneeling before them, and the government constantly appearing to be playing catch up


  • #5810
    timmyntc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,653 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Faugheen wrote: »
    And that’s all they do.

    Anyone who believes otherwise can blame the government who aren’t willing to take responsibility for the bad things caused by their own negligence.

    Then why last October, when the govt ignored NPHET advice - did NPHET go over the govts heads and straight to the media?

    If they are a purely advisory body then it should end there, but they clearly are not.
    NPHET attempted to strongarm the government into doing what they wanted. It was clear as day


  • #5811
    funnydoggy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,065 ✭✭✭funnydoggy


    Sunday 11th April: +5,272 Total Doses


    https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/newsfeatures/covid19-updates/vaccination-programme-dashboard-as-of-11-april-2021.pdf


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  • #5812
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,595 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    timmyntc wrote: »
    Then why last October, when the govt ignored NPHET advice - did NPHET go over the govts heads and straight to the media?

    If they are a purely advisory body then it should end there, but they clearly are not.
    NPHET attempted to strongarm the government into doing what they wanted. It was clear as day

    No one determined who leaked that.

    Holohan said it wasn't him. At any rate the reccomendations would ha e gone public when nphet letters got published a week or two later.


  • #5813
    mloc123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,445 ✭✭✭mloc123


    CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »
    No one determined who leaked that.

    Holohan said it wasn't him. At any rate the reccomendations would ha e gone public when nphet letters got published a week or two later.

    IMO... Holohan is a little too political. He doesn't seem to think that their role ends at just advising the government. Glynn on the other hand does, and said as much last week in some of the press conferences... their role is to be cautious and advise, and then government need to decide how to balance that.


  • #5814
    Igotadose
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,766 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    funnydoggy wrote: »
    Sunday 11th April: +5,272 Total Doses


    https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/newsfeatures/covid19-updates/vaccination-programme-dashboard-as-of-11-april-2021.pdf

    Why so few? Lack of vaccines?


  • #5815
    FlubberJones
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 911 ✭✭✭FlubberJones


    funnydoggy wrote: »
    Sunday 11th April: +5,272 Total Doses


    https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/newsfeatures/covid19-updates/vaccination-programme-dashboard-as-of-11-april-2021.pdf

    That is piss poor, the roll out seems to be going backwards.. again and now the Astra issues will be a scapegoat for the governments shambolic efforts


  • #5816
    Vicxas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,628 ✭✭✭✭Vicxas


    https://www.thejournal.ie/varadkar-astrazeneca-5408026-Apr2021/

    And here comes Leo, laying the groundwork for screwing us over.


  • #5817
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,173 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    FlubberJones wrote: »
    That is piss poor, the roll out seems to be going backwards.. again and now the Astra issues will be a scapegoat for the governments shambolic efforts

    So if it's a scapegoat, then what's the "real" problem, according to you?


  • #5818
    KrustyUCC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭KrustyUCC


    Igotadose wrote: »
    Why so few? Lack of vaccines?

    That's actually decent for a Sunday

    Sunday before was (+3,763)


  • #5819
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,468 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Vicxas wrote: »
    https://www.thejournal.ie/varadkar-astrazeneca-5408026-Apr2021/

    And here comes Leo, laying the groundwork for screwing us over.

    What screwing over ?

    He's right, there's going to be a delay, I don't see how there won't be. The extent of which will be known in the coming days.

    180k wont be done this week or next week & the whole rollout plan has to change now. It'll take a few days to get it all ironed out


  • #5820
    KrustyUCC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭KrustyUCC


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
    This isn't a reasonable analysis, by the end of June three quarters of people will have had a vaccine shot and circumstances will be much better, not perfect, but better.

    We'll see

    The vaccine rollout is in serious trouble after NIAC advice yesterday

    That rollout is linked to easing restrictions

    At the end of June important things like hospitality and ataycations will be up fir discussion

    The things that NPHET are afraid of and will be even more Conservative than usual in opening up and will push things out as far as possible

    Sad to think

    We'll get this long phased reopening BS of any easing of restrictions once again if we're lucky


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  • #5821
    eagle eye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,910 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    So as per usual we are backwards. I've just been told that even if you are vaccinated and take a test before and after your arrival from the US you have to do two weeks quarantine at your own expense.
    How does this make any sense?
    If vaccinated and tested you pose no threat. And anybody, vaccinated or not, who does a test before leaving and one when they arrive and passes both is not a threat either. Why would they have to do two weeks?


This discussion has been closed.
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