Maritime News Thread

Widdensushi · 30-03-2021 12:57pm

Tabnabs wrote: »

Of course there is also the video of the fishing boat coming into contact with the LÉ GEORGE BERNARD SHAW (P64) as they try to manoeuvre to pass the tow line across. But we don't talk about that...

Some ships are for towing and others for patrolling.

Well it is from their own cctv, also the video of them towing, first impressions is that the line is too short

Storm 10 · 30-03-2021 1:09pm

Widdensushi wrote: »

Well it is from their own cctv, also the video of them towing, first impressions is that the line is too short

How do you know they were not paying out the tow rope in the video either way they can't win. Armchair critics !!!!

Widdensushi · 30-03-2021 1:09pm

Dohvolle wrote: »

You mean to say that the expert on facebook saying the tow was too long was incorrect?
Where is this supposed video?

Anytime I was towing we try to keep the line in the water, if it comes out it is too severe on both boats and the line, we would slow down or give out more line, the video from gb Shaw cctv and photos of the damage to her are widely being shared, I don't think it is my place to put them on a public forum

Storm 10 · 30-03-2021 1:14pm

Widdensushi wrote: »

Anytime I was towing we try to keep the line in the water, if it comes out it is too severe on both boats and the line, we would slow down or give out more line, the video from gb Shaw cctv and photos of the damage to her are widely being shared, I don't think it is my place to put them on a public forum

Saw one video of her getting hit with huge waves heading to the Trawler

Widdensushi · 30-03-2021 1:22pm

Dohvolle wrote: »

So there is no video?

Why would I make it up, especially detailing that it is a video of the cctv in the boat, with moving cameras following it, Tabnabs referred to it first, I was going to refer to it yesterday but decided against as some get very defensive, I not trying to be critical, it was not an ideal situation and I am sure lessons were learned.

Storm 10 · 30-03-2021 1:28pm

Saw a video on the BBC series "Saving Lives at Sea where Lifeboat had managed to get a tow attached to a Trawler when a large wave smashed the Trawler into the Lifeboat it can't be an easy thing to do in bad we weather given all the movement of both vessels.

blue5000 · 30-03-2021 1:29pm

Storm 10 wrote: »

How do you know they were not paying out the tow rope in the video either way they can't win. Armchair critics !!!!

Not even qualified to be an armchair critic here, but would that trawler be salvageable?? Who owns it on the seabed?

100% land lubber here, but I was on the last ferry to cross the Irish sea during the hurricane of 1987.

Tabnabs · 30-03-2021 2:10pm

Ah you have to know the right people to get a copy of the CCTV video on WhatsApp. It's real and pretty shocking it was taken and then so widely disseminated.

Widdensushi · 30-03-2021 2:17pm

Dohvolle wrote: »

Does anyone have the video or is it another story like the refugee getting on the bus leaving the buggy outside because the social will get her a new one?
Everyone knows someone who saw it, yet nobody actually saw it themselves?

If I put it up you would probably say I photoshopped it, I won't be either way, I reiterate that i am not trying to be critical, but the tugs are best people for that job, if ocean Bank had not been damaged they would have brought her in, if gb Shaw had not been nearby and good enough to assist could another tug have been arranged? Hard to know, but the way the thread was going saying that the vessels who are towing week in, week out and have learnt from their mistakes the hard way already could not have completed the tow is wide of the mark.

Ghost Train · 31-03-2021 12:42am

video that was posted on twitter, with the boat taking on water probably like trying to tow a rock
https://twitter.com/naval_service/status/1376139360635084801?s=20

Widdensushi · 31-03-2021 1:24am

Ghost Train wrote: »

video that was posted on twitter, with the boat taking on water probably like trying to tow a rock
https://twitter.com/naval_service/status/1376139360635084801?s=20

She doesn't look much off usual on that, with an over 2000gt vessel towing a smaller vessel with a very short line like that it might not be inclined to let her bow bounce up. In the early stages of being towed by a fishing vessel taking on water was not a problem. There was no issue with propulsion other than there was a problem with the switchboard. It is frustrating to think that a fishing Vessel with all her engines running but having a switchboard issue sank, easy to talk after but there should have been an electrical solution

Storm 10 · 31-03-2021 10:22am

They had no communications either with the Navy or Lifeboat Rescue 115 and Rescue 117 gave them pumps and Radios she was taking in water at the stern before they got to her due to no power to pump out water.

Atlantic Dawn · 31-03-2021 11:01am

Storm 10 wrote: »

They had no communications either with the Navy or Lifeboat Rescue 115 and Rescue 117 gave them pumps and Radios she was taking in water at the stern before they got to her due to no power to pump out water.

Yes that would be very disorientating not been able to know what the rescue services wanted you to do until they got the radios to them. The trawler would have had emergency handheld VHF radios in the wheelhouse, I think you have to carry 2, very possible the batteries on them died given the time boat was without power.

Widdensushi · 31-03-2021 11:02am

Storm 10 wrote: »

They had no communications either with the Navy or Lifeboat Rescue 115 and Rescue 117 gave them pumps and Radios she was taking in water at the stern before they got to her due to no power to pump out water.

Yes, I didn't mean to infer that the water was due to the collision, the water was coming in a Shute that is for the waste, guts etc of fish to go overboard, this is supposed to be sealable but was malfunctioning, she had a sealed deck which needs pumps to get the water back out, that Shute should be above the waterline, the vessel may fail a stability test if it wasn't, and if even partially functioning should keep all water except a splash from the biggest waves out, there would have been a number of wells on the deck to gather any water before a float switch would start the pumps.

02-04-2021 4:42pm

Its very interesting for non seagoing folks like myself to see these videos from the NS and Coastguard to how us all just how rough can be out there and the environment they have to work in. Its certainly a job for professionals.

02-04-2021 4:47pm

Not sure whether to pop this in military or maritime really.

A totally avoidable incident with an amphibious vehicle that ended with 9 men dead when a US marine amphibious vehicle sank off San Diego last year.

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-03-25/amphibious-vehicle-investigation

josip · 02-04-2021 4:54pm

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Not sure whether to pop this in military or maritime really.

A totally avoidable incident with an amphibious vehicle that ended with 9 men dead when a US marine amphibious vehicle sank off San Diego last year.

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-03-25/amphibious-vehicle-investigation

That doesn't inspire confidence in the state of the US armed forces.
Manic(Moran) might know more about this or have an opinion.

thomil · 02-04-2021 6:07pm

I can't speak for the rest of the US Armed Forces, but the US Navy's Board of Inspection and Survey (INSURV) regularly releases public reports into the status of the Fleet. The general trend in the 2020 report is that the material state of the US Navy is on a downward trend over the last three years. Within the standard deviation but still going down

https://media.defense.gov/2021/Mar/03/2002592279/-1/-1/0/2020-INSURV-ANNUAL-REPORT.PDF/2020-INSURV-ANNUAL-REPORT.PDF

That does chime with what I've read in several other places, and it doesn't seem to be purely related to the material state of the Navy either. Crew fatigue is a huge issue for the navy, with crews being worked much harder than they should, with lack of sleep being commonplace:

https://seapowermagazine.org/fatigue-at-sea-researching-how-lack-of-sleep-can-affect-sailors/

The above is only one example, US military newspapers and USNI proceedings seem to be full of stories about a crew fatigue crisis in the navy. I also remember that shore leave and shore assignments were often cut short to have crews available for ships currently deployed, to the point that both enlisted ranks and officers couldn't adequately keep up with their training or even assessments of their subordinates. I haven't found any sources for that though.

neris · 06-04-2021 10:42am

Yacht transporter listing off the norweigan coast

https://gcaptain.com/yacht-transport-ship-in-trouble-off-norway/

neris · 06-04-2021 4:36pm

Looks like a few boats have made an escape and taken one of the cranes with them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaIWczln8pk

josip · 06-04-2021 5:03pm

neris wrote: »

Looks like a few boats have made an escape and taken one of the cranes with them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaIWczln8pk

The green AQS is gone.
In the original article it said a cargo shift was to blame for the list.
But with AQS gone (and the crane) then she must have taken on water for her to be still listing to that side?

Tabnabs · 07-04-2021 10:06am

A couple of big girls are on scene and awaiting the tow to a safe harbour.

https://www.solstad.com/vessel/normand-drott/

showphoto.aspx?photoid=3419967

Also on scene is a coast guard vessel capabale of towing or dealing with oil spill pollution, as well as acting as On-Scene Commander.

ohnonotgmail · 07-04-2021 10:19am

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
that first one is really, really ugly.

Tabnabs · 07-04-2021 10:21am

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
that first one is really, really ugly.

Ohh controversial. These giant tugs are considered things of brawn and beauty by the people who work on and around them. Apart from the helipad, I really like it.

ohnonotgmail · 07-04-2021 10:29am

Tabnabs wrote: »

Ohh controversial. These giant tugs are considered things of brawn and beauty by the people who work on and around them. Apart from the helipad, I really like it.

the helipad looks like a complete afterthought.

Tabnabs · 07-04-2021 12:45pm

Due to the conditions on scene, it has been announced that the recovery operation will be delayed until daylight tomorrow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaIWczln8pk

AndyBoBandy · 07-04-2021 12:54pm

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the helipad looks like a complete afterthought.

Still brilliant though....

Imagine that out supporting SAR activities, and with the ability to refuel & support Heli operations....

The only way anyone is getting aboard that ship now is by chopper..

Storm 10 · 07-04-2021 2:27pm

Not sure if you saw this brilliant work by the helicopter crews. I was wondering if the boats she was/is carrying came off her deck will they float

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5xEp82QX9M

Another video

https://www.thelocal.no/20210406/watch-norwegian-rescue-services-evacuate-crew-from-ship-adrift-at-sea/

AndyBoBandy · 07-04-2021 2:41pm

Storm 10 wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5xEp82QX9M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5xEp82QX9M

I would absolutely sh1t bricks if I had to jump off the back of that ship in those (or any) conditions......

I did the BIM Basic Sea Survival Course almost 30 years ago (my dad was the instructor), but that ship, in those conditions..... bricks would indeed be shat, and it large quantities.....

Storm 10 · 07-04-2021 9:18pm

It floats the green vessel that broke free from the deck looks ok.

CJhaughey · 08-04-2021 8:30am

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

I would absolutely sh1t bricks if I had to jump off the back of that ship in those (or any) conditions......

I did the BIM Basic Sea Survival Course almost 30 years ago (my dad was the instructor), but that ship, in those conditions..... bricks would indeed be shat, and it large quantities.....

Strange how they Hi-lined most of the crew off except the one guy in the survival suit that abandoned into the water?
Maybe he was the guinea pig :pac:

ohnonotgmail · 08-04-2021 9:09am

CJhaughey wrote: »

Strange how they Hi-lined most of the crew off except the one guy in the survival suit that abandoned into the water?
Maybe he was the guinea pig :pac:

yeah he went in first and the rest of them said "feck that, we'll wait for the helicopter".

Tabnabs · 08-04-2021 9:12am

Dohvolle wrote: »

They weren't taking any chance with the free fall lifeboat either. Would the list make it unuseable?

The list would certainly make things difficult, the other issue is being hoisted from an open deck (no matter the angle) is preferable to the small access hatch in the hull of the enclosed lifeboat, with 'dogs'/handles aplenty to snag the wire.

Tabnabs · 08-04-2021 9:15am

A break in the weather allowed the tow to be set last night and the tug and tow are underway to a safe harbour.

Tabnabs · 08-04-2021 9:24am

The "little" green boat washed from the deck of the ship has survived admirably, has been rescued and arrived into a harbour in the last few hours.

Tabnabs · 08-04-2021 9:36am

Hindsight is a wonderful thing. However, I hope I will not be back here in future years saying we warned of the necessity to purchase a towing vessel to help cope with potential future accidents. I hope I am proved wrong. One of the first reports into which I had to delve on taking up my position as Opposition spokesperson on the marine dealt with the need for a maritime towing vessel. It was a remarkably well produced document which contained scientific analysis as to the likelihood of marine accidents involving discharges of pollution in Irish waters. That research was undertaken in a clear and accurate manner. What was disturbing was its ability to predict reasonably accurately the likely consequences of 1.5 serious incidents a year within our waters, possibly involving quite significant discharges. If one considers the years during which the study was carried out one will note there was a series of incidents that would have corroborated that statistic. Given the volume of maritime traffic passing through our waters, it seems almost certain that we will have a serious incident at some stage. It is remarkable that we are not abiding by the recommendations of the report and spending €10 million to €15 million — I cannot remember the exact figure — on a towing vessel, which could possibly be operated in co-operation with the UK Government. It is a poor investment decision on the part of this State because if there is a problem, we may well look back and claim that the saving of this small amount of money was not wise in the long run.

Who said all this, what sane and rational person in Irish politics uttered these laudable words?

Eamonn Ryan, the current Minister for Transport, when sitting on the sidelines in 2004.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/dail/2004-06-03/14/

ohnonotgmail · 08-04-2021 9:41am

Tabnabs wrote: »

Who said all this, what sane and rational person in Irish politics uttered these laudable words?

Eamonn Ryan, the current Minister for Transport, when sitting on the sidelines in 2004.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/dail/2004-06-03/14/

would there be enough work for a full time towing vessel off the irish coast? are there no companies offering towing services commercially?

Tabnabs · 08-04-2021 9:55am

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

would there be enough work for a full time towing vessel off the irish coast? are there no companies offering towing services commercially?

The likely solution would be to share the role with the South West region of the UK, have a multi-role vessel(s) used for various tasks or a part of an EU operation with French, Spanish and Portuguese vessels.

AndyBoBandy · 08-04-2021 9:57am

CJhaughey wrote: »

Strange how they Hi-lined most of the crew off except the one guy in the survival suit that abandoned into the water?
Maybe he was the guinea pig :pac:

Conditions looked very harsh when that guy jumped in, with a massive swell, whereas when the guys went up the wire, things looked a lot steadier on the ship... so perhaps the events occurred at different times? or she came around in the wind? Looked like there was still propulsion when that guy jumped off the stern.

josip · 08-04-2021 10:16am

For someone who has only ever spent €700 on a 'boat' and browsed the Sunseeker website in envy after coming back from holidays, what kind of business case are you looking at for the Norwegian operation?

Value/Replacement cost of boats on deck = ?
Value/Replacement cost of Transporter = ?
Cost of Retrieval, tugs, Repair. etc = ?

To the nearest 10 million will do

CJhaughey · 08-04-2021 10:55am

Dohvolle wrote: »

They weren't taking any chance with the free fall lifeboat either. Would the list make it unuseable?

I would say they would prefer to winch off the deck of a larger ship than a lifeboat, less pitch and roll and a more stable platform.
Also as you mention a list like that might have made the risk of being crushed under the larger vessel too risky.
The sea conditions when the first crewman abandoned looked worse than when the rest of the crew hi-lined off, in fact it looked to me like the vessel was under some kind of tow because it was headed up into the weather not beam on as would be expected with a dead ship.
It does show the need for proper hi-line training, it's not the first time I have seen bad hi-line technique by crews.

neris · 08-04-2021 12:26pm

This is the yacht onboard after being initially loaded before her position was changed

image.png.0371ff46e1872ebc9cd8688287bb5026.png

Widdensushi · 08-04-2021 6:19pm

They have her safely back in port, still a bad list on the photo I saw earlier but probably rectified by now.

Tabnabs · 09-04-2021 2:14pm

Tabnabs · 09-04-2021 2:26pm

Atlantic Dawn · 13-04-2021 8:43pm

Seems 'Ever Given' has been seized in Egypt until a crazy large fine is paid. I suppose the ship would have been $125 million or so when new, cargo value could vary considerably whether a container had high value electronics in it or low cost goods.

A container ship that blocked Egypt's Suez Canal and crippled world trade for nearly a week has been 'seized' on court orders until the vessel's owners pay $900 million, canal authorities have said.

The MV "Ever Given was seized due to its failure to pay $900 million" compensation, Suez Canal Authority chief Osama Rabie was quoted as saying by Al-Ahram, a state-run newspaper.

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2021/0413/1209668-evergiven-seized/

josip · 13-04-2021 9:41pm

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Seems 'Ever Given' has been seized in Egypt until a crazy large fine is paid. I suppose the ship would have been $125 million or so when new, cargo value could vary considerably whether a container had high value electronics in it or low cost goods.

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2021/0413/1209668-evergiven-seized/

How do the likes of Egypt ever expect to be taken seriously trying to pull that kind of stunt?

The $900 million compensation figure was calculated based on "the losses incurred by the grounded vessel as well as the flotation and maintenance costs, according to a court ruling handed down by the Ismailia Economic Court,"

6 lost days at a maximum of €12m per day = $72m. So $828m to refloat ?

Presumably they would also have recovered most of the missed fees from any ships that waited around to transit in subsequent days?
So probably down a lot less than $72m.

Widdensushi · 13-04-2021 10:16pm

josip wrote: »

How do the likes of Egypt ever expect to be taken seriously trying to pull that kind of stunt?

6 lost days at a maximum of €12m per day = $72m. So $828m to refloat ?

Presumably they would also have recovered most of the missed fees from any ships that waited around to transit in subsequent days?
So probably down a lot less than $72m.

Legalised piracy, if they had more assets on standby it would have been cleared faster, difficult to see much difference in that figure than pirates hijacking ships.

Widdensushi · 13-04-2021 10:18pm

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Seems 'Ever Given' has been seized in Egypt until a crazy large fine is paid. I suppose the ship would have been $125 million or so when new, cargo value could vary considerably whether a container had high value electronics in it or low cost goods.

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2021/0413/1209668-evergiven-seized/

That's alot of steel for 125 million dollars, I have no idea but would have thought it would be more to build that with the engine power etc needed

Green is Growing · 13-04-2021 10:49pm

Over the past couple of weeks I've read a lot about The Suez Canal and Egypt and have heard many accounts from seafarers about how unprofessional and difficult dealing with the canal authorities, corrupt lazy and absent pilots and how Egypt will pretty much make your life as difficult as possible if you don't play their corruption game.

So I guess if there is any truth to this then it doesn't surprise me about this. I feel sorry for the crew who are now probably going to be held captive aboard in legal limbo for a long time to come.

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