Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X Read OP For Mod Warnings

gozunda · 07-04-2021 01:19PM

lawred2 wrote: »

that's tenuous research really... we're barely a year into this thing and this is not much more than an attempt at modelling the future.

edit: nevermind I read that as some sort of attempt to aggregate the costs of 'long covid'...

From the link.

The analysis was carried out using data from ONS, NRS and NISRA on deaths in the UK, registered up to 5 March 2021

Well sorry that doesn't suit. As I said get on to them and tell them they're wrong.

It's truely amazing - there's a thing in this thread for a few to enthusiastically whoop up and thank any piece of misinformation which backs the whole covid denial / skeptics angle with nary a single question ever asked.

But he'll hath no fury when being presented with some actual data.

The interrogations, indignation and roars of disbelief are ear shattering and

Very odd indeed.

gozunda · 07-04-2021 01:21PM

Sobit1964 wrote: »

No need, a poster superior to you already explained.

Please keep the snark up though - it is so wonderfully helpful in turning people away from pretty much everything you say.

And the snark is where?

But yes the UK and England is not the exact same. My apologies I had to point that out btw.

Lougho · 07-04-2021 01:23PM

Has anyone any idea when hotels can be used by non essential workers?

Sobit1964 · 07-04-2021 01:27PM

gozunda wrote: »

"poster superior to you" lol.

And the snark is where?

But yes the UK and England is not the exact same. My apologies I had to point that out btw.

Yes. He posted the answer to my question without snark. I accepted and thanked him for his response.

Your reply was pathetic snark, as was your follow up. Any more questions?

FintanMcluskey · 07-04-2021 01:29PM

gozunda wrote: »

Thats the thing . It's not just auld ones popping their clogs or whatever euphemism is being used to push covid denial.

Research in the UK shows that 1.5 million potential years of life lost to COVID-19 in the UK, with each life cut short by 10 years on average

https://www.health.org.uk/news-and-comment/news/1.5-million-potential-years-of-life-lost-to-covid-19

So tell me Fintan - Would you be ok losing 10 years?

This is a broad misunderstanding of life and statistics, and it’s proving a point I’m always making

That whole report makes one insane assumption which is :

That nobody will die before life expectancy at any age

The analysis uses average life expectancies at each age. These may be overestimates as those who died from COVID-19 were more likely to have co-morbidities than their peers and may have had lower life expectancies. Our overall estimate should therefore be seen as an upper bound on the number of years of life lost from COVID-19.

So Gozunda, tell me, have you ever heard of anyone dying between the ages of 80-84?

Captain_Crash · 07-04-2021 01:32PM

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Do you think if we had not locked down that that 5,000 would be higher?

I know it’s not directed at me, but I’ll give my view anyway. I think if we done nothing deaths would be higher yes, however I don’t think they’d be significantly higher that what they are now (considering the deficit incurred by us, I won’t get into the cost vs value of life debate on this)

But.... if we used only a fraction of the money we’ve already squandered for specific, targeted, non agenda driven measures to protect those most at risk, and allow the rest of the country function relatively unscathed, we’d have less deaths!

Boggles · 07-04-2021 01:40PM

Captain_Crash wrote: »

I know it’s not directed at me, but I’ll give my view anyway. I think if we done nothing deaths would be higher yes, however I don’t think they’d be significantly higher that what they are now (considering the deficit incurred by us, I won’t get into the cost vs value of life debate on this)

But.... if we used only a fraction of the money we’ve already squandered for specific, targeted, non agenda driven measures to protect those most at risk, and allow the rest of the country function relatively unscathed, we’d have less deaths!

We back to last Summer and the herd immunity folly?

Go on then, tell us how you would protect "those most at risk".

What measures?

Remember now the vast majority of people who needed hospitalization and critical care were not from care homes, the majority of people who died were not from care homes.

B-D-P-- · 07-04-2021 01:46PM

I have still not heard of some person i know or in my outer circle that had no underlining illness that got covid and died as a direct result of covid.

I have however heard of at least 3 suicides in my circle in the last year, this is a alarming number.
Theres an argument that maybe covid was the final nail, but still it was a nail.

Government has absolute no care for mental health, does not finance Mental health support and with these lockdowns are a big diminisher to it.

The HorsesMouth · 07-04-2021 01:49PM

Irish times have a new article saying retail and cultural sites may be opened up on May 4th. It's behind the paywall so I've no other details.

FintanMcluskey · 07-04-2021 01:51PM

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Irish times have a new article saying retail and cultural sites may be opened up on May 4th. It's behind the paywall so I've no other details.

Can you see what year this is proposed?

PTH2009 · 07-04-2021 01:54PM

Although I wasn't expecting us to host the Euros games in Dublin but I'm raging about it because the government had a chance to try and make it work but no we refuse to host them while others found away around it

RGS · 07-04-2021 01:59PM

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Irish times have a new article saying retail and cultural sites may be opened up on May 4th. It's behind the paywall so I've no other details.

Heres a quote from the article:

A further easing of Covid-19 restrictions from May onwards will be considered by Cabinet “if we can hold firm for a little bit longer”, a Government offical said on Wednesday morning.
At a Covid-19 briefing, assistant secretary general at the Department of Taoiseach Liz Canavan said the further easing could include the return of construction, retail, hairdressers as well as the reopening of cultural sites.
“If we can hold firm for a little bit longer, and if the health situation allows, a further of easing of restrictions will be considered from May 4th. Areas being considered are the full reopening of construction, the phased return of non-essential retail starting with click and collect and outdoor retail like garden centres and nurseries, the recommencement of personal services on a staggered basis, reopening of museums, galleries and libraries and the recommencement of religious services on a staggered basis.”

The auld "HOLD FIRM" line still front and centre.

Love the bit in red--is it ladies hairdressers first, followed by barbers and then the manicures and pedicures.

normanoffside · 07-04-2021 02:00PM

Michael martin is such a coward; he is getting Ronan Glynn to negotiate with Teacher and Garda Unions.
I missed the bit where Glynn is an elected minister.

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1379775819170582534

paddyisreal · 07-04-2021 02:02PM

RGS wrote: »

Heres a quote from the article:

A further easing of Covid-19 restrictions from May onwards will be considered by Cabinet “if we can hold firm for a little bit longer”, a Government offical said on Wednesday morning.
At a Covid-19 briefing, assistant secretary general at the Department of Taoiseach Liz Canavan said the further easing could include the return of construction, retail, hairdressers as well as the reopening of cultural sites.
“If we can hold firm for a little bit longer, and if the health situation allows, a further of easing of restrictions will be considered from May 4th. Areas being considered are the full reopening of construction, the phased return of non-essential retail starting with click and collect and outdoor retail like garden centres and nurseries, the recommencement of personal services on a staggered basis, reopening of museums, galleries and libraries and the recommencement of religious services on a staggered basis.”

The auld "HOLD FIRM" line still front and centre.

Love the bit in red--is it ladies hairdressers first, followed by barbers and then the manicures and pedicures.

Yes hold firm! I'd say its a certainty that these will be done on May the 5th and it will be more to do with relaxations in the North forcing the governmenta hand than anything else.

RGS · 07-04-2021 02:02PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

Although I wasn't expecting us to host the Euros games in Dublin but I'm raging about it because the government had a chance to try and make it work but no we refuse to host them while others found away around it

Cant have fans at the EURO and then ban fans from attending league of Ireland games, the All Ireland Championship and the Irish Open.

Think its safe to say 2021 another year with empty stadia.

facehugger99 · 07-04-2021 02:03PM

Captain_Crash wrote: »

I know it’s not directed at me, but I’ll give my view anyway. I think if we done nothing deaths would be higher yes, however I don’t think they’d be significantly higher that what they are now (considering the deficit incurred by us, I won’t get into the cost vs value of life debate on this)

But.... if we used only a fraction of the money we’ve already squandered for specific, targeted, non agenda driven measures to protect those most at risk, and allow the rest of the country function relatively unscathed, we’d have less deaths!

Absolutely, but that would have required a Government with the ability to make decisions, implement them and then face down the hysterical fear-mongering from the opposition and the media.

Our brave lads took the easy way out, they gerrymandered a quango to give them an answer - 'lockdown' - and then spent 10's of billions of our taxes on a monumentally stupid strategy.

niallo27 · 07-04-2021 02:04PM

Responder XY wrote: »

Life expectancy at birth and at 80 won't be the same thing. The 80 year old has survived everything that might have killed him/her younger and statistically now has another 8 years. Person at birth has to get through everything that might kill them before 80 first.

This is correct if you are saying the average 80 year old died, but most deaths happened in nursing homes, where the average stay is about a year unfortunately.

ypres5 · 07-04-2021 02:04PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

Although I wasn't expecting us to host the Euros games in Dublin but I'm raging about it because the government had a chance to try and make it work but no we refuse to host them while others found away around it

There's a simple reason behind that, sports leads to socializing, socializing leads to drinking and drinking leads to sin, we're essentially living in revolution era Iran with nphet filling in for Ayatollah Khomeini

JRant · 07-04-2021 02:12PM

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Do you think if we had not locked down that that 5,000 would be higher?

We may have had less deaths but there is no way to know because locking down entire populations had never been done before and there is no settled science on the outcomes.

paddyisreal · 07-04-2021 02:17PM

ypres5 wrote: »

There's a simple reason behind that, sports leads to socializing, socializing leads to drinking and drinking leads to sin, we're essentially living in revolution era Iran with nphet filling in for Ayatollah Khomeini

Will nphet ever lift the fatwa against the publicans of Ireland!

normanoffside · 07-04-2021 02:19PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

Although I wasn't expecting us to host the Euros games in Dublin but I'm raging about it because the government had a chance to try and make it work but no we refuse to host them while others found away around it

Despite what is now known about outdoor transmission, the government won't let a few thousand fan into a 55,000 seater stadium (UEFA wasn't asking for full capacity, just that some fans would be allowed attend).

Meanwhile, next week The crucible will allow fans indoors for the world snooker championship

https://www.bbc.com/sport/snooker/56661944?

helimachoptor · 07-04-2021 02:20PM

normanoffside wrote: »

Despite what is now known about outdoor transmission, the government won't let a few thousand fan into a 55,000 seater stadium (UEFA wasn't asking for full capacity, just that some fans would be allowed attend).

Meanwhile, next week The crucible will allow fans indoors for the world snooker championship

https://www.bbc.com/sport/snooker/56661944?

utter shambles, follow the science, but only the science that continues to enable us to lock everyone down

ypres5 · 07-04-2021 02:20PM

paddyisreal wrote: »

Will nphet ever lift the fatwa against the publicans of Ireland!

They're too handy a punching bag for them to give up, you need only look at Mr Sunshine himself George Lee for blaming pubs and restaurants and shops for an increase in cases even though they've been shut the last 3 months and he got away with what amounts to slander

_Kaiser_ · 07-04-2021 02:22PM

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Irish times have a new article saying retail and cultural sites may be opened up on May 4th. It's behind the paywall so I've no other details.

Here you go ...

A further easing of Covid-19 restrictions from May onwards will be considered by Cabinet “if we can hold firm for a little bit longer”, a Government offical said on Wednesday morning.

At a Covid-19 briefing, assistant secretary general at the Department of Taoiseach Liz Canavan said the further easing could include the return of construction, retail, hairdressers as well as the reopening of cultural sites.

“If we can hold firm for a little bit longer, and if the health situation allows, a further of easing of restrictions will be considered from May 4th. Areas being considered are the full reopening of construction, the phased return of non-essential retail starting with click and collect and outdoor retail like garden centres and nurseries, the recommencement of personal services on a staggered basis, reopening of museums, galleries and libraries and the recommencement of religious services on a staggered basis.”

Still far too slowly. Another month away at least!

paddyisreal · 07-04-2021 02:26PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Here you go ...

Still far too slowly. Another month away at least!

I am cautiously optimistic that things might move a bit quicker. If the numbers in hospital and ICU keep dropping and the North starts reopening - we will have to get our arses in gear.

SnuggyBear · 07-04-2021 02:29PM

I don't know a garden centre that's closed. Are they supposed to be closed?

Ray Donovan · 07-04-2021 02:31PM

normanoffside wrote: »

Despite what is now known about outdoor transmission, the government won't let a few thousand fan into a 55,000 seater stadium (UEFA wasn't asking for full capacity, just that some fans would be allowed attend).

Meanwhile, next week The crucible will allow fans indoors for the world snooker championship

https://www.bbc.com/sport/snooker/56661944?

And Italy, who Stephen Donnelly wants to add to the MHQ list are going to allow fans into the Stadio Olimipico for games. Go figure eh. Don't even get me started on Israel being on the list.

Multipass · 07-04-2021 02:34PM

SnuggyBear wrote: »

I don't know a garden centre that's closed. Are they supposed to be closed?

I’ve had a choice of 3 since the beginning of March, been at least once a week

helimachoptor · 07-04-2021 02:40PM

fwiw, i went to the in laws last week, they are both vaxxed.

One of the pubs in the town has been open since May (or whenever pubs opened last year). Went in with the brother in law, 8 people and the owner, one of those drinking was the town Garda :cool:

gozunda · 07-04-2021 02:42PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

This is a broad misunderstanding of life and statistics, and it’s proving a point I’m always making
That whole report makes one insane assumption which is :

That nobody will die before life expectancy at any age

So Gozunda, tell me, have you ever heard of anyone dying between the ages of 80-84?

Well done Fintain. You've just made a whole sector of statisticians redundant :pac:

And that might be a point if you had bothered to consider any of that in your previous post. Rather than dragging it in to use as a gotcha moment or whatever.

Or if they weren't actually using actual statistics of those who have actually died from Covid which oddly enough precludes them from dying from anything else.

But let's do this in order. I asked a question which you've dodged. Maybe you'd give an answer.

So tell me Fintan - Would you be ok losing 10 years?

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X Read OP For Mod Warnings