Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X Read OP For Mod Warnings

Anita Blow · 04-04-2021 10:29PM

walus wrote: »

Ffs what parent allows to have their kids to be guinea pigs in those trials?

Medical trials in kids are incredibly safe and conservative. Done in a stepwise manner down through the age groups, not progressing any lower until it's deemed safe in an older cohort.
It would be rare that when done in such a manner does a vaccine/treatment shown to be safe in an older age group is dangerous in a younger cohort.

AlekSmart · 04-04-2021 10:32PM

walus wrote: »

Ffs what parent allows to have their kids to be guinea pigs in those trials?

This is,after all,the U.S.A,which is a different place altogether,so you can be confident it will the poor,immigrant or criminal elements who get first shot ?

But,there are salutory lessons about Mass procedures to be learned from the early 70's,in a place far away...The Jewel in The Crown....

https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/in-1976-more-than-6-million-men-in-india-were-coerced-into-sterilization

The productions had one central message: Men should allow the government to take a scalpel to their vas deferens.

Similarly, the state hired “motivators” — government field workers, public health officials, postal workers, policemen and those who had already had a vasectomy — to persuade men within their social networks to attend the camps and undergo the operation in a makeshift clinical facility. “Sometimes these operations would even happen in the back of a van,” notes Balasubramanian. “There, men would undergo a 10- to 12-minute operation before leaving with a handful of painkillers.” Others were luckier and got cash for their efforts (in addition to the pills) — i.e., by the mid-1970s, Gandhi had directed the camps to begin offering the equivalent of $25 to $100, equal to half a month’s wages, for undergoing sterilization. Other pot sweeteners included clocks, buckets, butter and household goods.

What'll it take in Ireland,for us to offer our Infants for testing ?

GT89 · 04-04-2021 10:38PM

I don't need a vaccine I already have a much better one called my immune system

walus · 04-04-2021 10:43PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Depends on what you mean. Without the under 18s we can make things better. Without the under 18s we most likely can’t reach herd immunity so we don’t know what level off restrictions we’ll need next winter.

We want herd immunity for all the completely normal reasons we want herd immunity for every other illness. To control it and not really have to impose restrictions.

We don’t need to be vaccinating kids. We need to disband nphet and start using science on the way to achieving herd immunity.

gozunda · 04-04-2021 10:48PM

walus wrote: »

We don’t need to be vaccinating kids. We need to disband nphet and start using science on the way to achieving herd immunity.

We have. Its called vaccination....

walus · 04-04-2021 10:53PM

gozunda wrote: »

We have. Its called vaccination....

If we were using science we wouldn’t have 5km travel limit, construction shut down and many, many other ridiculous restrictions.

robbiezero · 04-04-2021 11:09PM

paddyisreal wrote: »

Some crack with guards pulling that app out at checkpoints to see whether you a are in or out

They wont bother their hole.
Down visiting the in laws today and the checkpoint outside Maynooth was just waving people on without a look.

Graham · 04-04-2021 11:19PM

Good grief.

So now we have; vaccines are unscientific, vaccines are unnecessary cos 'immune system' and vaccinations are like mass sterilisation.

The best hope we have of ending this soon are vaccinations and people are coming out with this cobblers?

GT89 · 04-04-2021 11:37PM

Graham wrote: »

Good grief.

So now we have; vaccines are unscientific, vaccines are unnecessary cos 'immune system' and vaccinations are like mass sterilisation.

The best hope we have of ending this soon are vaccinations and people are coming out with this cobblers?

This could actually end tomorrow if people and organisations stopped complying with the restrictions

Penfailed · 04-04-2021 11:38PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Regional restrictions in counties where numbers are above a certain amount per week

I've said the same previously. What do you think should be open right now?

Pussyhands · 04-04-2021 11:38PM

Really fed up with the daily updates and case numbers.

What is the actual need for daily pressers? Is it a sweetener for the media who make money off the misery?

gozunda · 04-04-2021 11:39PM

Sobit1964 wrote: »

This isnt just an economic problem - its far deeper than that. I'm not going to get into the medical costs of this past year either - those alone will cost thousands of lives.This past year has seen a fragmentation of the Irish people, a sickening finger pointing culture moved from toxic cesspits like twitter into our daily lives. A pervasive and ever present peddling of fear and worry.Consider the brain drain - yet again another cohort of the best young Irish will head to better prospects abroad, leaving behind a diminished talent set. There's a whole age range of women who will never have a child, the prospects after college, fighting up a career path, and then finally being ready has left them out of time. The literacy of a subset of children will never recover. It goes on and o.This lockdown was a cruel unscientific attempt at controlling the uncontrollable. It has been a sadistic theft of life from the many to protect what has become clear were the very few.

It needs to end this week.

Are you saying you don't agree with lockdown / restrictions or?

Any chance like we could hang on so people can get vaccinated or is that too big of an ask?

Penfailed · 04-04-2021 11:43PM

bear1 wrote: »

So what then?

You appear to have missed my posts where I've said that construction should be fully open immediately. Golf and tennis should be open. Schools should be open. Click and collect should be open. As more people are vaccinated, more can open. Restrictions should be based on numbers in each county and tailored to suit.

FintanMcluskey · 04-04-2021 11:48PM

Pussyhands wrote: »

Really fed up with the daily updates and case numbers.

What is the actual need for daily pressers? Is it a sweetener for the media who make money off the misery?

Of course it is.

It’s gutter journalism exploiting a gross misunderstanding of maths, statistics and demographics across a significant amount of the population to invoke fear and thus clicks

GoneHome · 04-04-2021 11:50PM

Oberkon wrote: »

Picked up a takeaway earlier off a restaurant my wife and I go to regularly. Really sad in reality to see the restaurant with all the tables and chairs laid out and silent .
I had a chat with the owner about the future and when he thinks it will reopen for indoor dining.
Next year at best he said if he’s still around . You really feel for these type of businesses . He said things couldn’t be worse . Really hope these places can stay open

Yes a member of my extended family own a restaurant in the midlands, was talking to him during the week and he thinks it will be late 2021 or early 2022 before he'll be open again, now saying that he was telling me he's very happy with the government money/subsidies he's getting at the moment

Pussyhands · 04-04-2021 11:53PM

GoneHome wrote: »

Yes a member of my extended family own a restaurant in the midlands, was talking to him during the week and he thinks it will be late 2021 or early 2022 before he'll be open again, now saying that he was telling me he's very happy with the government money/subsidies he's getting at the moment

The subsidies are something else.

That's why you don't hear them complaining anymore. Most of them are making more than they were when they were open!

And you couldn't trust what they themselves say anyways, playing the poor mouth will mean more people pack into them for "support" when things do open.

I mean come on, no rates, employees wages subsidized...they're laughing!

bb1234567 · 05-04-2021 12:30AM

https://twitter.com/drdavidsamadi/status/1378289828417114113

Low bar these days..but at least we havn't seen much violence against citizens by law enforcement here during the pandemic.

bb1234567 · 05-04-2021 12:43AM

https://twitter.com/Ray_J__/status/1378350525587030017

Very interesting chart tracking COVID deaths across every US county over the last year and how it correlated with temperatures. COVID deaths surge in cool/cold weather 4-10C, and in hot weather , over 30C. Lowest during mild temperatures , 15-21C. Clearly strong environmental forces at work there with such synchronised movements across such a large area with such wildly varying NPIs. A pretty invaluable piece of data

Penfailed · 05-04-2021 12:44AM

Oberkon wrote: »

Picked up a takeaway earlier off a restaurant my wife and I go to regularly. Really sad in reality to see the restaurant with all the tables and chairs laid out and silent .
I had a chat with the owner about the future and when he thinks it will reopen for indoor dining.
Next year at best he said if he’s still around . You really feel for these type of businesses . He said things couldn’t be worse . Really hope these places can stay open

I picked up a takeaway earlier from a restaurant my family and I go to regularly. Really sad to see the tables and chairs pushed to the side.
I had a chat with one of the guys who works there. He doesn't know when it will be open but is hoping it will be soon. He says that the takeaway is busier than it has ever been and that there's no way they'll close.

FintanMcluskey · 05-04-2021 12:47AM

Penfailed wrote: »

I picked up a takeaway earlier from a restaurant my family and I go to regularly. Really sad to see the tables and chairs pushed to the side.
I had a chat with one of the guys who works there. He doesn't know when it will be open but is hoping it will be soon. He says that the takeaway is busier than it has ever been and that there's no way they'll close.

That’s a bit coincidental.

Penfailed · 05-04-2021 01:19AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

That’s a bit coincidental.

Yeah. Amazing, isn't it? The chicken jalfrazei was class.

Penfailed · 05-04-2021 02:01AM

Penfailed wrote: »

You appear to have missed my posts where I've said that construction should be fully open immediately. Golf and tennis should be open. Schools should be open. Click and collect should be open. As more people are vaccinated, more can open. Restrictions should be based on numbers in each county and tailored to suit.

...and hairdressers and barbers should be open too.

FintanMcluskey · 05-04-2021 02:04AM

Penfailed wrote: »

...and hairdressers and barbers should be open too.

You do spend a lot of your time arguing with people who want the exact same things as you do

05-04-2021 03:47AM

Ace2007 wrote: »

And yet in countries in Asia where there were proper tough lockdowns, and where the people respect the policies and comply with them, the virus is not much of an issue now. In Ireland though, you have a certain % of society that are anti authority and nearly every week since this started say "this must end now".

https://www.unicef.org/rosa/media/13066/file/Main%20Report.pdf

This is the problem with blinkered, single-issue focus. “The virus” mightn’t be much of a problem, but perhaps the parents of the hundreds of thousands of children killed by lockdown measures in South Asia might have preferred less draconian, more holistic solutions.

machiavellianme · 05-04-2021 08:03AM

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.unicef.org/rosa/media/13066/file/Main%20Report.pdf

This is the problem with blinkered, single-issue focus. “The virus” mightn’t be much of a problem, but perhaps the parents of the hundreds of thousands of children killed by lockdown measures in South Asia might have preferred less draconian, more holistic solutions.

Hundreds of thousands of children killed by lockdown measures?
I must have missed that one. Care to elaborate?
What were they killed by? Boredom?

SnuggyBear · 05-04-2021 08:28AM

gozunda wrote: »

Are you saying you don't agree with lockdown / restrictions or?

Any chance like we could hang on so people can get vaccinated or is that too big of an ask?

Ye it is a big ask

ceadaoin. · 05-04-2021 08:41AM

machiavellianme wrote: »

Hundreds of thousands of children killed by lockdown measures?
I must have missed that one. Care to elaborate?
What were they killed by? Boredom?

I mean, you could just read the linked report that details the consequences of "containment measures" as they call it. Spoiler alert: it's not boredom. Here's a sample

The observed and estimated disruption in SRMNCH services is expected to have had a substantial impact on maternal and child mortality. The number of deaths among children < 5 years are estimated to increase by a total of 228,641 across the six South Asian countries in 2020 compared to the previous year, with 134,789 of these deaths expected to occur in the neonatal period. The greatest increases are anticipated in India (154,020,
15% increase) and Pakistan (59,251, 14% increase)
respectively.

The number of stillbirths are also predicted to increase in the region. Across South Asia as a whole, an estimated 89,434 additional stillbirths are anticipated as a result of reduced coverage of essential SRMNCH services.

Similarly, the number of maternal deaths is also expected to increase in 2020 as a result of the COVID-19 pandemic response, compared to those observed in 2019, with the highest number of deaths anticipated in India (7,750, 18% increase) and Pakistan (2,069, 21% increase).

Due to the observed and expected reduction in coverage of modern contraceptive methods, more than 3.5 million additional unintended pregnancies are expected in South Asia, with the highest number likely in India (~3 million).

The number of unsafe abortions are also expected to
increase in the region, by more than 50%. Overall in
South Asia, child and maternal mortality is expected
to increase by 14% and 16%, respectively.

pjohnson · 05-04-2021 08:58AM

bb1234567 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/drdavidsamadi/status/1378289828417114113

Low bar these days..but at least we havn't seen much violence against citizens by law enforcement here during the pandemic.

8 arrests yesterday of the "respectable business owners" that were protesting.

El_Duderino 09 · 05-04-2021 09:29AM

walus wrote: »

We don’t need to be vaccinating kids. We need to disband nphet and start using science on the way to achieving herd immunity.

Oh right. And how do we do that exactly? If herd immunity is estimated to be between about 70-85%, how do we get there without the under 18s?

El_Duderino 09 · 05-04-2021 09:39AM

bb1234567 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/drdavidsamadi/status/1378289828417114113

Low bar these days..but at least we havn't seen much violence against citizens by law enforcement here during the pandemic.

The other day we had posters using Belgium as an example of a country with sensible restrictions. You can travel anywhere in Belgium, they told us. You’d barely now there was a lockdown in Belgium, they told us. Can you imagine the complaining of this was happening in Ireland?

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X Read OP For Mod Warnings