Irish journalist leaves China after rise in surveillance, lovely government

Captcha · 31-03-2021 2:38pm #1

"Irish journalist Yvonne Murray, who reports for RTÉ News and Current Affairs from China, has been forced to leave the country because of mounting pressure from the Chinese authorities."

What is this Chinese unelected police state, extreme unfair trade practicing, warmongering, human rights destroying government so afraid of?

https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0331/1207197-yvonne-murray-bbc-john-sudworth-china/

whisky_galore · 31-03-2021 2:46pm

Maybe they didn't pay their tv licence?

Captcha · 31-03-2021 2:50pm

whisky_galore wrote: »

Maybe they didn't pay their tv licence?

Yes but instead of a fine, you get 20 years of forced labour, followed by forced organ donation.

Housefree · 31-03-2021 2:56pm

The UK have an award winning journalist locked up for telling the truth who will probably end up rotting away in a US prison, hopefully not the Guantanamo Bay torture center. Freedom of the press died in the west when they went after Julian Assange

Captcha · 31-03-2021 2:57pm

Housefree wrote: »

The UK have an award winning journalist locked up for telling the truth who will probably end up rotting away in a US prison, hopefully not the Guantanamo Bay torture center. Freedom of the press died in the west when they went after Julian Assange

How did you get out from behind the great firewall?

The usual response about anything negative related to CHina, but but but the USA .... blah blah...

Whatabout, whatabout, whataboutism?

WrenBoy · 31-03-2021 3:20pm

The Chinese Communist Party aren't respecting the free press and information sharing !? Holy Cow , hold the presses !!

joseywhales · 31-03-2021 3:39pm

This is what you get for saving them from the mass murdering japanese empire. They have selective memory.

fiveleavesleft · 31-03-2021 3:47pm

joseywhales wrote: »

This is what you get for saving them from the mass murdering japanese empire. They have selective memory.

What a man Dev was.

whisky_galore · 31-03-2021 4:12pm

Captcha wrote: »

Yes but instead of a fine, you get 20 years of forced labour, followed by forced organ donation.

Let's send an Irish delegation to sort them out, they'll shiver in their boots at the thought.

Irish journo "nearly" imprisoned.

Timberrrrrrrr · 31-03-2021 4:17pm

Captcha wrote: »

"Irish journalist Yvonne Murray, who reports for RTÉ News and Current Affairs from China, has been forced to leave the country because of mounting pressure from the Chinese authorities."

What is this Chinese unelected police state, extreme unfair trade practicing, warmongering, human rights destroying government so afraid of?

https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0331/1207197-yvonne-murray-bbc-john-sudworth-china/

Do you believe journalists should be allowed to say what they want? I'm not saying the Chinese government treatment of this woman or her husband is right but why are you outraged at this? Why no other country?

Hande hoche! · 31-03-2021 4:22pm

joseywhales wrote: »

This is what you get for saving them from the mass murdering japanese empire. They have selective memory.

The Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere sounds more impressive than the Belt and Road Initiative.

biko · 31-03-2021 4:24pm

There are consequences after free speech.

caoty · 26-05-2021 10:46am

BBC "Journalist", John Sudworth, inventor of the "hell filter"

https://qr.ae/pGKCIh

political analyst · 26-05-2021 12:55pm

caoty wrote: »

BBC "Journalist", John Sudworth, inventor of the "hell filter"

https://qr.ae/pGKCIh

Typical Chinese communist propaganda.

26-05-2021 1:14pm

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-08/bill-birtles-mike-smith-evacuated-china-safety-concerns/12638786

Australian journalists fled recently too

suicide_circus · 26-05-2021 1:15pm

We'll they're going to be the global hegemony soon enough so you better play nice

caoty · 27-05-2021 6:47am

Is The BBC Biased Broadcasting Company? Is John Sudworth A Hero Or A Coward?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlCxbvWyB1Y

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khxQLI3aesM&t=3s

There are over 20,000 mosques in Xinjiang, a province of China, alone, which is over ten times of the number of mosques in all of the US. That gives a mosque per capita of about 500 per Muslim in Xinjiang which is higher than many Muslim countries in the world.

Genocide? or genocide of some people's IQ really?

riclad · 01-06-2021 3:38pm

The Chinese are building a massive surveillance system
using the Internet video surveillance apps on phones . Just because there's mosques in China does not mean there's freedom to protest or to report on human rights issues
All tech company's have to hand over data to the police and give acess to messaging apps
All company's in China have some government reps working there or Chinese partners
China is 1984 plus hi tech 24 7 surveillance
Workers work 10 or more hours per day there's no independent unions
We see in Hong Kong they passed laws to clamp down on free speech or any form of protest
People have limited freedom eg go to work consume shop there's no free press the Internet is heavily censored
Eg they removed Lady gaga from the friends reunion in China because she is friends with the dali lama
Even mild criticism of any government official is blocked or censored
Even the Palestinians in Gaza have more freedom than
the average Chinese citizen
They can use social media or talk to reporters

Beta Ray Bill · 01-06-2021 3:56pm

riclad wrote: »

The Chinese are building a massive surveillance system
using the Internet video surveillance apps on phones . Just because there's mosques in China does not mean there's freedom to protest or to report on human rights issues
All tech company's have to hand over data to the police and give acess to messaging apps
All company's in China have some government reps working there or Chinese partners
China is 1984 plus hi tech 24 7 surveillance
Workers work 10 or more hours per day there's no independent unions
We see in Hong Kong they passed laws to clamp down on free speech or any form of protest
People have limited freedom eg go to work consume shop there's no free press the Internet is heavily censored
Eg they removed Lady gaga from the friends reunion in China because she is friends with the dali lama
Even mild criticism of any government official is blocked or censored
Even the Palestinians in Gaza have more freedom than
the average Chinese citizen
They can use social media or talk to reporters

I'd say something "will be done about China" in the not to distant future.
But you are correct on the surveillance, Huawei doesn't work for the Chinese government, Huawei IS the Chinese government and Huawei run nearly every 5G phone network in the world, and they routinely listen in on calls.
5G controlling your brain rhetoric was initially distributed by China with the intention that it would end up that anybody that's against 5G is a looper (Which is exactly what's happened)
But clearly there is a security problem there, as the US nearly pulled the plug on the RAF F-35 program over Huawei 5G.

It's important to note though, that for the moment, the US and EU are tolerating China, as China is the worlds factory.
The US could shut China down both militaristically, technologically and economically in days if it wanted to, but for the moment that doesn't suit.

Gatling · 01-06-2021 4:44pm

Just look at the John Cena apology for calling Taiwan a country

WrenBoy · 01-06-2021 4:56pm

Gatling wrote: »

Just look at the John Cena apology for calling Taiwan a country

That was hilariously pathetic

01-06-2021 4:59pm

Captcha wrote: »

"Irish journalist Yvonne Murray, who reports for RTÉ News and Current Affairs from China, has been forced to leave the country because of mounting pressure from the Chinese authorities."

What is this Chinese unelected police state, extreme unfair trade practicing, warmongering, human rights destroying government so afraid of?

https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0331/1207197-yvonne-murray-bbc-john-sudworth-china/

What wars have the Chinese mongered lately? I'd take the west more seriously on Journalism if Assange could get a break.

01-06-2021 5:01pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

The US could shut China down both militaristically, technologically and economically in days if it wanted to, but for the moment that doesn't suit.

Days?

I doubt it. Shutting down China economically would shut down the US economically given the outsourcing, no idea what you mean by technologically as China is a peer pretty much, with some exceptions, and military wise China can't be invaded. Only nukes win that war, and then it would be a bed of roses for the US.

Beta Ray Bill · 01-06-2021 5:02pm

fvp4 wrote: »

What wars have the Chinese mongered lately? I'd take the west more seriously on Journalism if Assange could get a break.

They are literally building islands in the South China sea and claiming the EEC up to the shores of all other countries.
The SCS is a major security issue for China, and in order for it to be super power (which it wants to be) it must fully control it - that means taking Taiwan.

They have been unable to monger wars because up until now, they have not been let.
Militaristically speaking, they have no power projection (but this is changing)

fvp4 wrote: »

Days?

I doubt it. Shutting down China economically would shut down the US economically given the outsourcing, no idea what you mean by technologically as China is a peer pretty much, with some exceptions, and military wise China can't be invaded. Only nukes win that war, and then it would be a bed of roses for the US.

Yep, Days

China is unable to feed its population.
The export a huge amount of products but import a huge amount of food, and rely heavily on the sea for food.
China has no Blue Water Navy (this is changing), A blockade of food from the SCS by the US would literally starve them out. This is why China wants to control the SCS. US policy towards China has always been containment.

So bad is the food situation in China that during the great famine in the early 60's, the Chinese government declared wild animals such as bats, rats, etc as a natural resource and could be legitimately farmed, slaughtered and sold. (This is still happening today)

01-06-2021 5:08pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

They are literally building islands in the South China sea and claiming the EEC up to the shores of all other countries.
The SCS is a major security issue for China, and in order for it to be super power (which it wants to be) it must fully control it - that means taking Taiwan.

I'd say the South China Sea is close to China, all the same.

Not sure why you care, as you aren't American. Americans want to maintain their empire.

A yank complaining about China being aggressive in the South China Sea is like a 19C Colonel Blimp in the UK 19C complaining about China's aggressiveness in the Boxer rebellion. The assumption is that the UK or the US had every right to be there, but the Chinese had no business defending themselves.

The US has no business there, or any where outside it's own seas. And Europe needs to get out of the shadow of the US, and do business with China, as many countries are already.

Beta Ray Bill · 01-06-2021 5:23pm

fvp4 wrote: »

I'd say the South China Sea is close to China, all the same.

Not sure why you care, as you aren't American. Americans want to maintain their empire.

A yank complaining about China being aggressive in the South China Sea is like a 19C Colonel Blimp in the UK 19C complaining about China's aggressiveness in the Boxer rebellion. The assumption is that the UK or the US had every right to be there, but the Chinese had no business defending themselves.

The US has no business there, or any where outside it's own seas. And Europe needs to get out of the shadow of the US, and do business with China, as many countries are already.

I get what you're saying, but it better the Devil you know and all that.

China is a mix of Fascism and Communism, but more leaning towards Fascism. (IE a very small group of people hold all the power)
A lot of people in Europe died fighting Fascism. Fascism is bad, like Communism, it needs to expand in order to survive (IE it wont stop expanding). Hence the policy of containment.

Here's a map of whos claiming what in the south China Sea

As you can see, China is claiming ALOT, so is Vietnam

Gatling · 01-06-2021 5:32pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

I get what you're saying, but it better the Devil you know and all that.

China is a mix of Fascism and Communism, but more leaning towards Fascism. (IE a very small group of people hold all the power)
A lot of people in Europe died fighting Fascism. Fascism is bad, like Communism, it needs to expand in order to survive (IE it wont stop expanding). Hence the policy of containment.

Here's a map of whos claiming what in the south China Sea

As you can see, China is claiming ALOT, so is Vietnam

They already have a Fortified man made island that they could use to launch military actions against anyone they don't want having access to the south China sea , the Chinese coast guard has been heavily armed and patrol with Chinese fishing vessels to force others countries fishing vessels out of their own fishing grounds

Galwayguy35 · 01-06-2021 8:09pm

Murray is still tweeting about China to her 919 followers, doubt Xi Jinping is losing much sleep over her though.

Marcos · 01-06-2021 8:41pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

China is unable to feed its population.
The export a huge amount of products but import a huge amount of food, and rely heavily on the sea for food.
China has no Blue Water Navy (this is changing), A blockade of food from the SCS by the US would literally starve them out. This is why China wants to control the SCS. US policy towards China has always been containment.

The area in the South China Sea under Chinese claims is estimated to have about 10% of the worlds fish and seafood. China is using the belt and road strategy as a means of ensuring they are not contained. Also with the border disputes with India in the Himalayas so they build roads to get to warm water ports in Pakistan.

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

So bad is the food situation in China that during the great famine in the early 60's, the Chinese government declared wild animals such as bats, rats, etc as a natural resource and could be legitimately farmed, slaughtered and sold. (This is still happening today)

Yes, we still have folk memories and effects of the famine here. The Chinese one was in the early 60's like you said, so people are still alive with memories of that.

01-06-2021 11:15pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

China is unable to feed its population.
The export a huge amount of products but import a huge amount of food, and rely heavily on the sea for food.

Which is why they have massive trade agreements with Russia, and other neighbors for the importation of food, and also the leasing of land in other countries for the production of that food. All of which comes by land... and so, difficult for the US to interfere with. They've also been investing heavily in growing tech to bypass the problems they've had with pollution destroying arable land. They're not unaware of the weaknesses in their economy/logistics.

Luxury living and a residue of the famine thinking. With regards to food. Most Chinese could return to eating a few bowls of rice/noodles each day if they really needed to. Right now, they don't need to.

The one thing you're ignoring though is that even should a blockade occur, and they run out of food (which I doubt), the government won't care, and neither will the majority of Chinese people, because it would only affect a few provinces. As long as it doesn't affect everyone, it will be passed off as grounds for further hatred of the US, and western powers.

Nah. If the US wanted to shut them down, they'd hit the electricity production, and distribution grids. Many of the grids are extremely vulnerable, and China relies on huge amounts of coal/oil from other nations, most of which is transported by sea. A large percentage of their transportation network (trains/buses/trucks) are almost entirely electric, so, the US could seriously hurt their industrial capacity that way.

01-06-2021 11:24pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

I get what you're saying, but it better the Devil you know and all that.

China is a mix of Fascism and Communism, but more leaning towards Fascism. (IE a very small group of people hold all the power)
A lot of people in Europe died fighting Fascism. Fascism is bad, like Communism, it needs to expand in order to survive (IE it wont stop expanding). Hence the policy of containment.

You could just stick with communism.. no need to include fascism.. since communism ticks all of those boxes all by itself. Although, China is simply an Authoritarian state, with sprinkles of Maoism/Communism, and a very strong capitalist oligarchy backbone.

As for Europe, "People" weren't fighting fascism, except for the communists. People were fighting the territorial expansion of the Axis, otherwise Germany would have been stopped after Austria or Czechoslovakia. Let's leave out the propaganda.

Modern China is not spreading any kind of ideology, and will be stopped because they're a threat to Western (US) influence in Asia, and the territorial expansion that will eventually come.

archer22 · 02-06-2021 5:22pm

Jeez it never ceases to amaze me the amount of gullible idiots and half wits we have in the west who soak up American propaganda and run with it like its a divine revelation!.

And the way the Yanks can turn them on and off like a light switch :eek:

For example a few years ago the Yanks had them all ranting and raving about how "nasty and evil" North Korea was..then North Korea and America had some talks and all the shock horror yarns about NK suddenly ceased.

Then China started out competing America in every field..aaand surprise surprise the shock horror yarns about them went into full throttle, and the flaming torch and pitchfork brigades were off again

I will give America one thing, they truly have mastered propaganda down to a fine art and a science and get value for vast resources they devote to it..unfortunately though they have rotted and totally corrupted our media in the process.And that will probably be beyond repair.

02-06-2021 6:04pm

archer22 wrote: »

Jeez it never ceases to amaze me the amount of gullible idiots and half wits we have in the west who soak up American propaganda and run with it like its a divine revelation!.

And the way the Yanks can turn them on and off like a light switch :eek:

Ahh well, any media, and especially, anything driven by a government should be questioned.. The negative spin from the US, Australia, etc should be taken with an awareness that they have their own agendas at play. However, in the cases of N.Korea, and China, you can be pretty sure that they should be watched carefully.

But then, I do think people should be also careful when it comes to the US, since it sometimes feels that their focus on other nations is an attempt to draw attention away from their own issues, whether that's US political corruption, civil rights, their war commitments, etc. The US really shouldn't be placed on any pedestal that excuses it from similar watchfulness.

Still, I wouldn't trust either N.Korea or China... but then I don't trust the US either.

Beta Ray Bill · 02-06-2021 6:22pm

Deleted User wrote: »

You could just stick with communism.. no need to include fascism.. since communism ticks all of those boxes all by itself. Although, China is simply an Authoritarian state, with sprinkles of Maoism/Communism, and a very strong capitalist oligarchy backbone.

As for Europe, "People" weren't fighting fascism, except for the communists. People were fighting the territorial expansion of the Axis, otherwise Germany would have been stopped after Austria or Czechoslovakia. Let's leave out the propaganda.

Modern China is not spreading any kind of ideology, and will be stopped because they're a threat to Western (US) influence in Asia, and the territorial expansion that will eventually come.

Just to be clear, No country has ever gone full Capitalism / Communism / Fascisms / Socialism. It's just not possible to do.

Fascism is such a dirty word, that in political/diplomatic circles, the word isn't even used to describe enemies.

There's a quick chart I made on it.
What you call yourself and what you actually are, aren't necessarily the same thing.
As mentioned already, no country exists where the pink dots are (IE the extreme)

The blur between Fascism and Communism is where the states that have committed some of the worst atrocities in human history reside.

The Nazi's and the Russians weren't actually all that different, One person in charge, Military heavily involved in politics, state provided many things and had a set price in various commodities. The VW Beetle is a very good example of this, a car for all.

Gatling · 02-06-2021 6:27pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Still, I wouldn't trust either N.Korea or China... but then I don't trust the US either.

China and NK are one and the same China Keeps lil Kim and his father before him under strict control , China will never allow a unified Korea to exist even if Koreans did ,
It's not propaganda ,nk only exists as buffer between South Korea and America ,
But is it American propaganda that china have claimed the whole South China sea as theirs ,no it's fact based off a map that was found in an old school book

02-06-2021 8:33pm

Beta Ray Bill wrote: »

Just to be clear, No country has ever gone full Capitalism / Communism / Fascisms / Socialism. It's just not possible to do.

Well, that's lovely... since I didn't make any such claim.

China went originally for nationalism (not fascism), then inspired by communism, went for maoism, and has since embraced capitalism, under a Oligarchic system, while retaining a lot of the power structures from Maoism.

There's a quick chart I made on it.

Which is irrelevant.

The Nazi's and the Russians weren't actually all that different, One person in charge, Military heavily involved in politics, state provided many things and had a set price in various commodities. The VW Beetle is a very good example of this, a car for all.

Again, never said they weren't similar. Nazi's being National Socialist as opposed to being Mussolini's Fascism.

02-06-2021 8:47pm

Gatling wrote: »

China and NK are one and the same China Keeps lil Kim and his father before him under strict control , China will never allow a unified Korea to exist even if Koreans did ,

They're not one and the same, since N.Korea has managed to bring attention to the region which China wouldn't want, considering their own moves to expand their influence. While China wouldn't be bothered by N.Korea's flareups with Japan, they wouldn't be wanting an increase in US military in S.Korea, which is what Kim keeps managing to do, in spite of repeated efforts by the US to reduce their presence there. If Kim left things alone for a few years, China would be a lot happier, taking away attention for them to do their own things.

It's not propaganda ,nk only exists as buffer between South Korea and America

N. Korea's nukes are well capable of hitting all major population zones within mainland China. They're allies, and while N.Korea is a lesser ally, somewhat dependent on China economically speaking, should Kim decide to go it alone, that would make China extremely uncomfortable. Here's a little thing to consider... both China and N.Korea have military units and fortifications on the border between N.Korea and China.. It's not the close relationship you seem to believe. More a matter of convenience, and a lack of better options. It''s not as if China has a lot of choices in allies for the region...

Although, yes, China wouldn't want to see N.Korea be taken over by either the South, or the US.

But is it American propaganda that china have claimed the whole South China sea as theirs ,no it's fact based off a map that was found in an old school book

Part of their "map" is due to the claims given after both WW1 and WW2, both times during which they were screwed by the Allies (and from what I've read, they were actually screwed). There's a range of islands and sea territory which should have left Imperial Japanese control and been passed to China after the war... but the Allies left them in the hands of Japan or assigned to other nations.

But yes, a large part of it is based off ancient claims.. which are rather worthless. All the same, you're being awfully selective. Japan and N.Korea have loads of territorial disputes in the region, as does Vietnam with Japan. Hell, most of the nations in the region claim large parts of the South China Sea for themselves regardless of international considerations. China is not alone in behaving this way.. and were simply the first to implement the artificial islands. Japan has been seeking to do similar themselves in a couple of places.

archer22 · 02-06-2021 9:48pm

Deleted User wrote: »

They're not one and the same, since N.Korea has managed to bring attention to the region which China wouldn't want, considering their own moves to expand their influence. While China wouldn't be bothered by N.Korea's flareups with Japan, they wouldn't be wanting an increase in US military in S.Korea, which is what Kim keeps managing to do, in spite of repeated efforts by the US to reduce their presence there. If Kim left things alone for a few years, China would be a lot happier, taking away attention for them to do their own things.

N. Korea's nukes are well capable of hitting all major population zones within mainland China. They're allies, and while N.Korea is a lesser ally, somewhat dependent on China economically speaking, should Kim decide to go it alone, that would make China extremely uncomfortable. Here's a little thing to consider... both China and N.Korea have military units and fortifications on the border between N.Korea and China.. It's not the close relationship you seem to believe. More a matter of convenience, and a lack of better options. It''s not as if China has a lot of choices in allies for the region...

Although, yes, China wouldn't want to see N.Korea be taken over by either the South, or the US.

Part of their "map" is due to the claims given after both WW1 and WW2, both times during which they were screwed by the Allies (and from what I've read, they were actually screwed). There's a range of islands and sea territory which should have left Imperial Japanese control and been passed to China after the war... but the Allies left them in the hands of Japan or assigned to other nations.

But yes, a large part of it is based off ancient claims.. which are rather worthless. All the same, you're being awfully selective. Japan and N.Korea have loads of territorial disputes in the region, as does Vietnam with Japan. Hell, most of the nations in the region claim large parts of the South China Sea for themselves regardless of international considerations. China is not alone in behaving this way.. and were simply the first to implement the artificial islands. Japan has been seeking to do similar themselves in a couple of places.

Absolutely correct but that is never mentioned, instead the narrative is put forward that China has grabbed all the islands there, which is false.

The others in the dispute occupy a lot of them and also claim what each other have and in at least one case Vietnam grabbed an Island from the Philippines when Filipino soldiers temporarily left the island and returned later to find the Vietnamese army in possession of it.
The only reason there is not a regional war between all the claimants is because there is a big Dog, China in the fight,the rest are all fairly evenly matched and would likely fancy their chances against each other.

This is a very complicated dispute not the simple black and white issue as portrayed by western propaganda.

Gatling · 02-06-2021 9:55pm

archer22 wrote: »

Absolutely correct but that is never mentioned, instead the narrative is put forward that China has grabbed all the islands there, which is false.

They claim they own the whole South China sea this is fact right up to other countries shore lines ,this isn't disputed ,nor is building a Fortified airbase on a reef and looking at doing more ,
Don't see other countries doing that ,

But America yada yada yada

02-06-2021 10:14pm

Gatling wrote: »

They claim they own the whole South China sea this is fact right up to other countries shore lines ,this isn't disputed ,nor is building a Fortified airbase on a reef and looking at doing more ,

Yup. You're correct. They have claimed all that territory, and have built artificial islands. I'm not disagreeing that China has a very strong expansionist policy for the entire region. Although, in some cases, their claims do have some validity, since China prior to the Japanese invasion did control those territories, but the Allies didn't return them after the war. Now, I'm not suggesting that most of their claims are legitimate, because they're not... still.. some are, and they've been kinda screwed on more than a few occasions by international treaties in the past.

But then, so too have most other nations in the region have expansionist interests, although their desires are more "moderate" and yet, not acceptable by international standards either.

Don't see other countries doing that ,

Not to the same extent, but they are the major power in the region.

How about this? The US decided that South America was beyond the interests of European nations. That was a pretty big declaration, and pretty much guaranteed US dominance on the continent for over a 100 years. It's how major powers behave, and China has been watching how western powers have behaved for a long time.

But America yada yada yada

But America what? America engages in wars? Yup. America started an illegal war, pulling in many other countries, based on lies and doctored information? Yup. America bypassed human rights and the rights of people in warzone's with the use of Guantanamo bay? Yup.

Now.. I'm not seeking to downplay China's behavior.. so why are you so quick to downplay American behavior? Just so China can be the bad guy? Everyone already knows that China is the bad guy in Asia...

Kermit.de.frog · 02-06-2021 10:33pm

Bit of Father Ted about this one...

https://twitter.com/TheresaAFallon/status/1400018346280689665

guy2231 · 02-06-2021 10:41pm

Housefree wrote: »

The UK have an award winning journalist locked up for telling the truth who will probably end up rotting away in a US prison, hopefully not the Guantanamo Bay torture center. Freedom of the press died in the west when they went after Julian Assange

It's a shame journalists in the west have to travel to the other side of the world to be able to report the truth, most of us know quite well reporting on the truth in the UK would not fly either.

caoty · 06-06-2021 1:45am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s54jr7uKnM0
7：00

06wilkersonSUB-inyt-jumbo.jpg?quality=90&auto=webp

What the "critical thinking crowd" in the "free world" were told and believed at that time, e.g.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/2277791.stm
History repeats itself.

Positions of Security Council members:

US: The US maintained that Iraq was not cooperating with UN inspectors and had not met its obligations to 17 UN resolutions. If Iraq failed to comply with the "one final chance to comply" provision of Resolution 1441, then military action would be the result.

UK: The primary supporter of the US plan to invade Iraq

France: Foreign Minister Dominique de Villepin said, "We think that military intervention would be the worst possible solution," although France believed that Iraq may have had an ongoing chemical and nuclear weapons program. Villepin went on to say that he believed the presence of UN weapons inspectors had frozen Iraq's weapons programs.

Russia: Russian Foreign Minister Igor Ivanov said that "Russia deems that there is no evidence that would justify a war in Iraq.". Putin continued to stress that the US must not go alone in any such military endeavor, but instead must work through the UN Security Council.

China: On January 23, Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Zhang Qiyue said Beijing was "worried and uneasy about the large-scale military build-up" in the Gulf region and that China's position on potential war with Iraq was "extremely close" to France's. Chinese officials repeatedly spoke in support of a diplomatic solution, including continued weapons inspections.

Germany - On January 22, German chancellor Gerhard Schröder, at a meeting with French president Jacques Chirac, said that he and Chirac would do all they could to avert war. At the time, Germany was presiding over the Security Council.
Angola - Angola supported continued inspections, but had not taken a stand on disarmament by military action.
Bulgaria - Bulgaria suggested that it would support the use of military force to disarm Iraq, even without UN backing.
Cameroon - Cameroon encouraged the continued inspections, but had not taken a firm stand on whether the country would support a US led strike to invade Iraq.
Chile - Chile indicated that it would like inspections to continue, but had not taken a position on the use of military force to disarm Iraq.
Guinea - Guinea supported further inspections, but had not taken a position on the use of military force to disarm Iraq.
Mexico - Mexico supported further inspections, and hinted that it would support a US-led military campaign if it were backed by the UN. The country also hinted that it might consider supporting a military campaign without UN backing as well. President Vicente Fox heavily criticized the war when it started and Mexican diplomats described their conversations with US officials as hostile in tone and that Washington was demonstrating little concern for the constraints of the Mexican government whose people were overwhelmingly opposed to the war with Iraq. (USA Today)
Pakistan - Pakistan supported continued inspections.
Syria - Syria felt that Iraq was cooperating and meeting its obligations under UN resolutions. Syria would have liked to see the crippling UN sanctions on Iraq lifted.
Spain - Spain supported the US's position on Iraq and supported the use of force to disarm Iraq, even without UN approval.

Ocer · 22-06-2021 6:26pm

In China, we say It is better to travel ten thousand miles than to read ten thousand books. Seems like we know the west way more than the west knew us, which is great, I hope most of them in their dreams forever.

22-06-2021 6:36pm

Ocer wrote: »

In China, we say It is better to travel ten thousand miles than to read ten thousand books. Seems like we know the west way more than the west knew us, which is great, I hope most of them in their dreams forever.

haha... most Chinese are completely clueless about both Western society, and our politics. When all your books are censored by your government, I can see why you wouldn't read so much. (Yes, I know from personal experience what it's like to publish in China, and the level of censorship involved.)

gw80 · 22-06-2021 6:45pm

Ocer wrote: »

In China, we say It is better to travel ten thousand miles than to read ten thousand books. Seems like we know the west way more than the west knew us, which is great, I hope most of them in their dreams forever.

Sorry but I couldn't read that without putting on a Chinese accent,
Did I just do a racism?

Ocer · 23-06-2021 12:40am

Deleted User wrote: »

haha... most Chinese are completely clueless about both Western society, and our politics. When all your books are censored by your government, I can see why you wouldn't read so much. (Yes, I know from personal experience what it's like to publish in China, and the level of censorship involved.)

So arrogant:eek: Who gives a **** about Western society and your politics??? liars and murderers, that's all. Maybe Irish Government is not a murderer regarding Ireland never output wars to other countries. Maybe that's why I choose here to enjoy my retired time.

China is not the US, Chinese people only interested in making money and wonderful food. You and your country are totally safe, we have not bombed any country for now.

CCP leads the right way in the past 30 years, made the 1.4 Billion population country No.2 at the moment. CCP made Chinese people getting rich, their life quality is getting way better than ever. So we are very happy with CPP's govern. Overtaking the US is only a matter of time. You will see, I wish you good health.:D

An Ri rua · 23-06-2021 12:42am

joseywhales wrote: »

This is what you get for saving them from the mass murdering japanese empire. They have selective memory.

A man's gotta know his limitations, Josey

Ocer · 23-06-2021 12:48am

gw80 wrote: »

Sorry but I couldn't read that without putting on a Chinese accent,
Did I just do a racism?

No, you are grand, I also read that like Master Shifu in Kung Fu Panda~

BloodBath · 23-06-2021 12:53am

Ocer wrote: »

So arrogant:eek: Who gives a **** about Western society and your politics??? liars and murderers, that's all. Maybe Irish Government is not a murderer regarding Ireland never output wars to other countries. Maybe that's why I choose here to enjoy my retired time.

China is not the US, Chinese people only interested in making money and wonderful food. You and your country are totally safe, we have not bombed any country for now.

CCP leads the right way in the past 30 years, made the 1.4 Billion population country No.2 at the moment. CCP made Chinese people getting rich, their life quality is getting way better than ever. So we are very happy with CPP's govern. Overtaking the US is only a matter of time. You will see, I wish you good health.:D

On track to overtake them within the next 5 years. China will be miles ahead of them in 10 years.

political analyst · 23-06-2021 1:41am

Housefree wrote: »

The UK have an award winning journalist locked up for telling the truth who will probably end up rotting away in a US prison, hopefully not the Guantanamo Bay torture center. Freedom of the press died in the west when they went after Julian Assange

That's BS. Assange is a creep. He dodged prosecution for alleged rape in Sweden by jumping bail in London.

Irish journalist leaves China after rise in surveillance, lovely government

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