What exactly is happening with AstraZeneca?

titan18 · 24-03-2021 10:01AM

Sh1t just keeps on coming with these guys. Hopefully EU seriously hurt them.

Wolf359f · 24-03-2021 10:04AM

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

Looks to me like AZ over promised.

Then they decided to divert eu supplies to the UK in order to cover their failings.

Pfizer's approach was restrict all deliveries to customers across the board when they were upscaling, so it was more fair. AZ decides to just prioritise the UK's order over the EU's. So it's easy to see why the EU are pissed off with them.

is_that_so · 24-03-2021 10:08AM

Wolf359f wrote: »

Pfizer's approach was restrict all deliveries to customers across the board when they were upscaling, so it was more fair. AZ decides to just prioritise the UK's order over the EU's. So it's easy to see why the EU are pissed off with them.

Yeah Pfizer understand vaccine production and have been quite accurate and upfront with their predictions. The solution will now have to come via a "sharing" arrangement, one where you'd expect the EU to push very hard to get a larger portion of doses.

fly_agaric · 24-03-2021 10:09AM

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

An English language source for those whose italian needs work

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-03-24/astra-may-hold-29-million-vaccine-doses-in-italy-la-stampa-says

Similar thing is in Irish Times this morning as well.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/eu-showdown-looms-with-uk-over-30-million-astrazeneca-doses-1.4518387

The question is which contract will they go to fulfil after steep shortfalls in AstraZeneca deliveries to the EU slowed the bloc’s rollout, and with Britain also facing a squeeze in its supply that London has blamed on manufacturing delays in India.

As posted before, don't think UK should receive more than 1/4 of any stockpiles produced in EU locations (100m/(300m + 100m)), certainly not all of it or even half (+ they already have been preferred by AZ for whatever reason), so will be interesting to see what happens + how the EU/Italy react to it.

24-03-2021 10:11AM

how do you "Hide" 29 million vials of vaccine?

Hurrache · 24-03-2021 10:13AM

What is quite amusing and unexpected, but sad all the same, is seeing UK commentators now complaining about EU populism behind the move by the EU to restrict exports. They haven't an ounce of self awareness.

Hurrache · 24-03-2021 10:13AM

Aegir wrote: »

how do you "Hide" 29 million vials of vaccine?

The number may be disputed, but you simply store them and just don't report you have them, something simple like that.

Pete_Cavan · 24-03-2021 10:15AM

Aegir wrote: »

how do you "Hide" 29 million vials of vaccine?

Presumably they are just sitting there rather than being released for distribution. If that is the case, I'd love to know AZs justification for it given how far they are behind in their contracted supply to the EU.

24-03-2021 10:23AM

Hurrache wrote: »

The number may be disputed, but you simply store them and just don't report you have them, something simple like that.

29million seems like an incredible number, that is pretty much their entire production to date.

IRISHSPORTSGUY · 24-03-2021 10:28AM

Aegir wrote: »

29million seems like an incredible number, that is pretty much their entire production to date.

Now just need Biden to release those 30m AZ doses stacked in Ohio warehouses to Europe and AstraZeneca have hit their quarterly target :pac:

titan18 · 24-03-2021 10:35AM

josip wrote: »

:eek: What are AstraZenica thinking?
It looks like they've completely abandoned the EU market, not just for the Covid vaccine, but reputationally as a company also, if this turns out to be true.

It's amusing to see the few remaining AZ apologists squirming trying to find some angle to defend them from.
The number of AZ defenders does seem to have diminished somewhat lately.
I wonder when and how the UK media outlets will report this.

On a positive note, Ireland would get 300,000 doses from that 29 million windfall I think ?

Ya, would be a serious help if we got that. Even if EU and UK agreed a deal so UK got like 20% or whatever their per capita amount is, 200k or so for us would probably get us through cohort 4 i'd imagine and into the next cohorts.

Call me Al · 24-03-2021 10:36AM

Are AZ shipping stock from the UK factories to the EU for fill and finish or is this all EU-based manufacturing?

deeperlearning · 24-03-2021 10:36AM

Beasty wrote: »

Stick to the topic, which is not other users or what they have posted elsewhere on the site

correct horse battery staple made a very valid point.

24-03-2021 10:38AM

Call me Al wrote: »

Are AZ shipping stock from the UK factories to the EU for fill and finish or is this all EU-based manufacturing?

fill and finish for the UK batches are done by Wockhardt in North Wales

titan18 · 24-03-2021 10:44AM

Call me Al wrote: »

Are AZ shipping stock from the UK factories to the EU for fill and finish or is this all EU-based manufacturing?

Seems like it's fill and finish for Halix in the Netherlands.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 24-03-2021 10:48AM

Aegir wrote: »

fill and finish for the UK batches are done by Wockhardt in North Wales

Nearly flooded back in January. Imagine the panic if that happened.

Call me Al · 24-03-2021 10:52AM

Aegir wrote: »

fill and finish for the UK batches are done by Wockhardt in North Wales

So are both EU manufacturing sites listed in the UK supply chain for their 100million doses, or just Halix?

I've seen UK govt ministers lay claim only to Halix.

Should the the Italian media be accurate, this BBC article is a load of complete gibberish.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/56483766

Raisins · 24-03-2021 10:52AM

How is it that these Italian vials apparently according to Bloomberg represent the intended second shot for uk doses?

Did AZ genuinely think they’d give UK made doses for the first shot and then 30 million EU doses as a second shot?

Call me Al · 24-03-2021 10:56AM

Raisins wrote: »

How is it that these Italian vials apparently according to Bloomberg represent the intended second shot for uk doses?

Did AZ genuinely think they’d give UK made doses for the first shot and then 30 million EU doses as a second shot?

Possibly. Az have proven themselves to be untrustworthy. It's hard to distinguish fact from fiction when it comes to them.

Or maybe these vaccines are to fulfill the EU contract and it's all just spin.
It's so hard to know.

BonnieSituation · 24-03-2021 10:58AM

stefanovich wrote: »

Aren't we as human's a selfish bunch in general? Isn't leveraging this greed the most pragmatic approach, if it is an unchangeable and inherent quality of all individuals?

I guess that makes it okay so.

Cheers Stef.

RobMc59 · 24-03-2021 10:59AM

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

Except a dozen million dozes went from Eu to uk with nothing in other direction

Why make up hypothetical strawmans Rob when there’s facts and reality which you seem to ignore to suit your brexiteer (seen your posts in politics forum) narrative?

I care about my country but that doesn't mean I'm a brexiteer.I dislike the tories and was totally against brexit, now that ship has sailed I hope my country can kick on. Hopefully Johnson will live to regret his latest comments which show his true colours.
The Oxford AZ vaccine is a British development although I'm aware all vaccines require intermediates from different countries,including EU countries.

24-03-2021 11:07AM

Call me Al wrote: »

So are both EU manufacturing sites listed in the UK supply chain for their 100million doses, or just Halix?

I've seen UK govt ministers lay claim only to Halix.

Should the the Italian media be accurate, this BBC article is a load of complete gibberish.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/56483766

the Italian site is fill and finish, not manufacturing. it is likely that these were made in Halix and sent to Italy for filling.

That said, my guess on this article would be that there is a batch/batches of Xmillion ready for shipping, some for the UK and the majority for the EU, but making out that it is a shipment of 30 million for the UK and and that there is something secretive about the whole thing gets far more likes and shares than just plain old setting the facts out as they are.

Melanchthon · 24-03-2021 11:10AM

Aegir wrote: »

the Italian site is fill and finish, not manufacturing. it is likely that these were made in Halix and sent to Italy for filling.

That said, my guess on this article would be that there is a batch/batches of Xmillion ready for shipping, some for the UK and the majority for the EU, but making out that it is a shipment of 30 million for the UK and and that there is something secretive about the whole thing gets far more likes and shares than just plain old setting the facts out as they are.

I thought the UK would likely be importing vaccine product though and fill and finishing in their own plants in Wales.
If Astra Zeneca were trying to hide it wouldn't that approach have made a lot more sense?

Joe_ Public · 24-03-2021 11:13AM

Call me Al wrote: »

So are both EU manufacturing sites listed in the UK supply chain for their 100million doses, or just Halix?

I've seen UK govt ministers lay claim only to Halix.

Should the the Italian media be accurate, this BBC article is a load of complete gibberish.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/56483766

There is also another firm in Germany, IDT Biological, that was doing fill and finish for the UK market. Not sure about now, though.

https://www.politico.eu/article/after-failing-to-deliver-astrazeneca-rethinks-eu-coronavirus-vaccine-supply-chain/

24-03-2021 11:16AM

Call me Al wrote: »

Possibly. Az have proven themselves to be untrustworthy. It's hard to distinguish fact from fiction when it comes to them.

Or maybe these vaccines are to fulfill the EU contract and it's all just spin.
It's so hard to know.

Is there not supposed to be massive AZ deliveries in the last week of the month? These could be those?

24-03-2021 11:18AM

RobMc59 wrote: »

I care about my country but that doesn't mean I'm a brexiteer.I dislike the tories and was totally against brexit, now that ship has sailed I hope my country can kick on. Hopefully Johnson will live to regret his latest comments which show his true colours.
The Oxford AZ vaccine is a British development although I'm aware all vaccines require intermediates from different countries,including EU countries.

https://www.jenner.ac.uk/about/funders-partners

FUNDERS
Funding agencies who currently support the work of the Jenner Institute:

CEPI

Wellcome Trust

Medical Research Council UK

European Commission

Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation

US National Institutes of Health

Foundation for the National Institutes of Health

International AIDS Vaccine Initiative

UK Department of Health

National Institute for Health Research

Malaria Vaccine Initiative at PATH

European Virtual Institute of Malaria Research

Wolfson Foundation

European Vaccine Initiative

Lister Institute

University of Oxford

Gates Foundation Malaria Programme at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine

Biotechnology and Biological Sciences Research Council

Department for Environment & Rural Affairs

Call me Al · 24-03-2021 11:19AM

Aegir wrote: »

the Italian site is fill and finish, not manufacturing. it is likely that these were made in Halix and sent to Italy for filling.

That said, my guess on this article would be that there is a batch/batches of Xmillion ready for shipping, some for the UK and the majority for the EU, but making out that it is a shipment of 30 million for the UK and and that there is something secretive about the whole thing gets far more likes and shares than just plain old setting the facts out as they are.

I know Italy is fill and finish.
But the other Belgian site is manufacturing, so either they are claiming access to both EU manufacturing sites, Halix has been dramatically overachieving, or it's all spin.

I had read that there were 10million in Halix that the UK were claiming as theirs.

The requirement for 2nd doses will now be increasingly arising in the UK, as well as their u50s. It will be interesting to see how they will coordinate this.

odyssey06 · 24-03-2021 11:21AM

Anyone know what the UK domestic output capacity per month is for AZ, without EU plants?

astrofool · 24-03-2021 11:22AM

stefanovich wrote: »

Aren't we as human's a selfish bunch in general? Isn't leveraging this greed the most pragmatic approach, if it is an unchangeable and inherent quality of all individuals?

While this post confirms a few things, this only works if you don't brag to everyone about it, which is usually what simple minded followers of this philosophy do, thus undermining the following of it.

It also helps to do this covertly, which it looks like the British were trying to do and have now been caught with their pants around their ankles, all for the sake of getting a few weeks ahead of the EU. I don't think it will be worth it in the end (given they still have the highest death rate per capita in the EU, which is made even worse by being an island which can control it better than being on the continent).

Call me Al · 24-03-2021 11:24AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Is there not supposed to be massive AZ deliveries in the last week of the month? These could be those?

They might yes. I hope it is.
The implication with language like "hiding" is that these aren't for the EU, and that AZ are trying to pull a fast one. And with their track record wrt covid vaccines anything is possible.
So a little more meat on the bones from official sources would be good.

What exactly is happening with AstraZeneca?

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