Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX Read OP For Mod Warnings

average_runner · 22-03-2021 08:14AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The lack of self awareness here is off the charts

I’ve just been reading about the Covid situation in Brazil and the likelihood of that happening here if we reopen according to some posters. It was the same last year with Lombardy.

You vehemently defend Ireland’s plans when they have been, and plan to continue to be for month's, one of the most suppressed nations not just in Europe but across the globe.

Ireland is well clear on top of the length of time businesses are closed and will pull away further with the planned reopening timelines.

The chap I responded to, again tried to communicate that if it takes another 3.5 months for businesses to start to reopen that it will be fine.

It’s time people realise where the planned reopening will leave us, it’s a conversation that’s not happening across the media in Ireland at present.

The last line of comment is baffling,” we’re a prosperous country who can support its population”.

All’s kinds of misunderstanding there as our indigenous economy is in complete tatters, we’ve even closed construction, what’s supporting Ireland throughout this is FDI, and mostly US based companies.

Ireland is the 3rd most indebted nation across the globe and we plan to add to that for another few months and you claim we can support ourselves. If Ireland could support itself it wouldn’t have need billions of aid from the EU already.

Can you provide the link to the 3rd most in debt country?
All articles I read doesnt have us in top 20. Even as percentage of our gdp we aren't in top 20

the kelt · 22-03-2021 08:20AM

There’s been some drivel on here over the last few pages.

According to some golf has killed thousands and the reopening or easing of certain restrictions, sports etc are now dependent on their level of poshness.

So much for those opposing the easing of restrictions saying “follow the science and data”

Captain_Crash · 22-03-2021 08:20AM

average_runner wrote: »

Can you provide the link to the 3rd most in debt country?
All articles I read doesnt have us in top 20. Even as percentage of our gdp we aren't in top 20

He ain’t wrong. I’ve read a few articles in the last few weeks that have us behind only Japan and the US! I think per capita was the metric used. But we need some context.... we’re we’re third most indebted nation in the developed world before this too!

EDIT: I’ve removed the links because they didn’t post properly. On mobile now so I’ll repost them when I’m on a laptop

average_runner · 22-03-2021 08:24AM

the kelt wrote: »

There’s been some drivel on here over the last few pages.

According to some golf has killed thousands and the reopening or easing of certain restrictions, sports etc are now dependent on their level of poshness.

So much for those opposing the easing of restrictions saying “follow the science and data”

Outdoor sports should be open, if a club is found breaking the rules then shut it.down.

shtpEdthePlum · 22-03-2021 08:29AM

Benimar wrote: »

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/gemma-odoherty-arrested-live-stream-22595561

A name that may be familiar to one or two around here I’d assume.

Where is her address published in that article?

darconio · 22-03-2021 08:33AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The lack of self awareness here is off the charts

I’ve just been reading about the Covid situation in Brazil and the likelihood of that happening here if we reopen according to some posters. It was the same last year with Lombardy.

You vehemently defend Ireland’s plans when they have been, and plan to continue to be for month's, one of the most suppressed nations not just in Europe but across the globe.

Ireland is well clear on top of the length of time businesses are closed and will pull away further with the planned reopening timelines.

The chap I responded to, again tried to communicate that if it takes another 3.5 months for businesses to start to reopen that it will be fine.

It’s time people realise where the planned reopening will leave us, it’s a conversation that’s not happening across the media in Ireland at present.

The last line of comment is baffling,” we’re a prosperous country who can support its population”.

All’s kinds of misunderstanding there as our indigenous economy is in complete tatters, we’ve even closed construction, what’s supporting Ireland throughout this is FDI, and mostly US based companies.

Ireland is the 3rd most indebted nation across the globe and we plan to add to that for another few months and you claim we can support ourselves. If Ireland could support itself it wouldn’t have need billions of aid from the EU already.

Stop with your negativity Fintan, and show some resilience!

FintanMcluskey · 22-03-2021 08:53AM

Captain_Crash wrote: »

He ain’t wrong. I’ve read a few articles in the last few weeks that have us behind only Japan and the US! I think per capita was the metric used. But we need some context.... we’re we’re third most indebted nation in the developed world before this too!

EDIT: I’ve removed the links because they didn’t post properly. On mobile now so I’ll repost them when I’m on a laptop

To give further context on a EU level

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/ireland-to-have-highest-debt-per-head-in-europe-this-year-1.4503652%3fmode=amp

Ireland is forecast to have the highest government debt per head of population in Europe this year, as the impact of Covid-19-related borrowings pushes the burden on each individual in the State up by almost €4,000 in 2021.

It means that, per capita, the Irish will shoulder a debt burden of almost €20,000 more than the EU average.

The figures also show that Ireland has experienced the sharpest increase in debt per head over the past year, up 9 per cent, or €3,919, on 2020.

Irish public borrowing has ramped up over the past year to cope with the cost of the Covid-19 pandemic, with Ireland cited as having the strictest response by a recent Oxford report.

With the pandemic unemployment payment alone costing the State about €140 million a week, and with more than €6 billion spent on wage subsidies since the start of the pandemic, public debt has grown accordingly.

It’s important to remember that Ireland had a natural defence to Covid with its young population.

And we also plan to continue to maintain our status as the country with the most business closures across the EU for the next 3.5 months

JeffKenna · 22-03-2021 09:10AM

Have they got rid of the idea of moving the restrictions on a county basis? Maybe they did and I can't remember.

_Kaiser_ · 22-03-2021 09:20AM

Colm Henry on NT is stumbling his way through an interview at the moment, desperately trying to spin positives from the mess they've made of the vaccination program.

He then says they aren't tracing maybe 30% of cases when questioned about the reports of poor infrastructure behind it all and that lockdown is their only way to deal with this.

There you have it.. We are in ongoing lockdown because Colm and his colleagues haven't been able to get their internal processes and resources in order after a year and despite an unlimited pot of cash.

First question for the post-pandemic tribunal : what DID you spend the money on then??

arctictree · 22-03-2021 09:31AM

People talking about a curfew. It just wouldn't work in Ireland. Can you imagine the guards going into a housing estate at 6pm in the summer and trying to round up the kids?! A 5km limit can just be casually enforced with token effort.

arctictree · 22-03-2021 09:36AM

average_runner wrote: »

Outdoor sports should be open, if a club is found breaking the rules then shut it.down.

Outdoor sports are allowed, you just can't organise them! E.g an impromptu game of footy in the park...

Tipsy McSwagger · 22-03-2021 09:37AM

Feel really sorry for hairdressers. A few months ago they were on every news and radio channel showing all the steps they had taken and money they spent to make sure their place of business was safe to visit. Think they were allowed open for 3 weeks. A lot will never open their doors again. Then you have the elderly customers who look forward to going there for a chat as well as getting their hair done.

One hairdresser was on the radio a month ago saying she was calling her elderly customers to just have a chat, and one lady who was in her 80s had lost all hope and was in tears saying all she really had left in life was her little trips outside her house. She lives her life now stuck indoors.

Graham · 22-03-2021 09:37AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The lack of self awareness here is off the charts

I’ve just been reading about the Covid situation in Brazil and the likelihood of that happening here if we reopen according to some posters. It was the same last year with Lombardy.

You vehemently defend Ireland’s plans when they have been, and plan to continue to be for month's, one of the most suppressed nations not just in Europe but across the globe.

Ireland is well clear on top of the length of time businesses are closed and will pull away further with the planned reopening timelines.

The chap I responded to, again tried to communicate that if it takes another 3.5 months for businesses to start to reopen that it will be fine.

It’s time people realise where the planned reopening will leave us, it’s a conversation that’s not happening across the media in Ireland at present.

The last line of comment is baffling,” we’re a prosperous country who can support its population”.

All’s kinds of misunderstanding there as our indigenous economy is in complete tatters, we’ve even closed construction, what’s supporting Ireland throughout this is FDI, and mostly US based companies.

Ireland is the 3rd most indebted nation across the globe and we plan to add to that for another few months and you claim we can support ourselves. If Ireland could support itself it wouldn’t have need billions of aid from the EU already.

So am I getting this right?

You've just been reading about Brazil and Lombardy.

You think we should reopen anyway because it's expensive?

timmyntc · 22-03-2021 09:47AM

Graham wrote: »

So am I getting this right?

You've just been reading about Brazil and Lombardy.

You think we should reopen anyway because it's expensive?

It s funny how when you compare Ireland to Sweden et al, we are told it wouldnt be like that here because Irish people are different, Ireland is different.

But then when it comes to the negative scenarios - Lombardy, Brazil, Czech republic - then it is directly applicable here and it will happen if we relax our restrictions at all. Either you Graham are incredibly naive or downright dishonest with your scaremongering.

There are 101 reasons why what happened in Brazil will not happen here.

RGS · 22-03-2021 09:55AM

Kiith wrote: »

Who ****ing cares if something is viewed as posh? And jesus christ, i'm sick of hearing people say the "Optics would look bad" if one thing is allowed open and others are not. Golf is safe, tennis is safe, any outdoor non-contact activity is ****ing safe!

Use logic and science to decide what should re-open, not what someone might think about it and then tweet that it's unfair :mad:

Well said.

How people think golf and tennis are posh sports is frankly baffling. They are living in the 1920's not the 2020's.

Most golf clubs, i know, have membership from all strata of society.

My own club has bank employees, taxi drivers, public & civil servants, farmers, gardai, solicitors, doctors, students, office workers, schoolchildren(including girls) and worst of all we give ladies the same rights at male members.

suicide_circus · 22-03-2021 09:59AM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

There you have it.. We are in ongoing lockdown because Colm and his colleagues haven't been able to get their internal processes and resources in order after a year and despite an unlimited pot of cash.

Naturally. This is the HSE we're talking about here. H to the S to the mother****ing E. A failed institution. And senior figures from this failed institution currently rule the land.

22-03-2021 10:01AM

timmyntc wrote: »

It s funny how when you compare Ireland to Sweden et al, we are told it wouldnt be like that here because Irish people are different, Ireland is different.

But then when it comes to the negative scenarios - Lombardy, Brazil, Czech republic - then it is directly applicable here and it will happen if we relax our restrictions at all. Either you Graham are incredibly naive or downright dishonest with your scaremongering.

There are 101 reasons why what happened in Brazil will not happen here.

Don't look for logic. It's the same thing when you look at the overlap of people who think "the far right" boogeyman is "on the rise" and the lockdown protests are all far-right... but also thinks that the government the ability to grab an extraordinary amount of control and power on a whim and with very little checks and balances is a good thing.

Whichever contradictory point is convenient right now is the one that will be wheeled out.

Boggles · 22-03-2021 10:04AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't look for logic. It's the same thing when you look at the overlap of people who think "the far right" boogeyman is "on the rise" and the lockdown protests are all far-right..

Not according to the Commissioner.

The vast majority of those who took part belong to a number of factions including anti-vaccine, anti-mask and anti-lockdown far-right, far right groups, and those intent on trouble and disorder.

JeffKenna · 22-03-2021 10:22AM

RGS wrote: »

My own club has bank employees, taxi drivers, public & civil servants, farmers, gardai, solicitors, doctors, students, office workers, schoolchildren(including girls) and worst of all we give ladies the same rights at male members.

Hahaha back at work this morning after a week off and that gave me a good chuckle.

the kelt · 22-03-2021 10:23AM

timmyntc wrote: »

It s funny how when you compare Ireland to Sweden et al, we are told it wouldnt be like that here because Irish people are different, Ireland is different.

But then when it comes to the negative scenarios - Lombardy, Brazil, Czech republic - then it is directly applicable here and it will happen if we relax our restrictions at all. Either you Graham are incredibly naive or downright dishonest with your scaremongering.

There are 101 reasons why what happened in Brazil will not happen here.

I do find that logic very funny to be honest.

22-03-2021 10:25AM

Boggles wrote: »

Not according to the Commissioner.

That's an inaccurate quote, as you know. But never mind, you proved my point as one of the most ardent supporters here of authoritarian government powers.

Good luck with that if and when the "rise of the far right" results in an elected "far right" government.

"Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790)

You get what you deserve.

Boggles · 22-03-2021 10:27AM

Deleted User wrote: »

That's an inaccurate quote, as you know.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40235006.html

The vast majority of those who took part belong to a number of factions including anti-vaccine, anti-mask and anti-lockdown far-right, far right groups, and those intent on trouble and disorder

Really?

Could you link to the accurate one in your own good time please.

I'd also like to point out Harris was actually agreeing with you.

22-03-2021 10:30AM

Boggles wrote: »

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40235006.html

Really?

Could you link to the accurate one in your own good time please.

I'd also like to point out Harris was actually agreeing with you.

No he wasn't, but that's irrelevant.

You can find the accurate quote online yourself if you're that concerned (you're not). I'm not engaging with you in this thread any longer; it's a waste of my time.

Sharpyshoot · 22-03-2021 10:31AM

A danger of another surge is media hot right now. Suggestions of 5km down to 1km in 5th of April. Pubs and hair dressers don’t open till 2022 the way things are going.

Boggles · 22-03-2021 10:32AM

Deleted User wrote: »

No he wasn't, but that's irrelevant.

You can find the accurate quote online yourself if you're that concerned (you're not). I'm not engaging with you in this thread any longer; it's a waste of my time.

I just gave you the quote with the link.

Why would you claim the quote isn't accurate? Bizarre.

Also he very much did agree with your assertion that they were not all 'far right'.

Graham · 22-03-2021 10:32AM

timmyntc wrote: »

It s funny how when you compare Ireland to Sweden et al, we are told it wouldnt be like that here because Irish people are different, Ireland is different.

It's not funny when we relaxed restrictions at the end of last yet and proved we were more like Lonbardy and Brazil.

but let's ignore that because there's a few that prefer to avoid reality.

timmyntc · 22-03-2021 10:35AM

Graham wrote: »

It's not funny when we relaxed restrictions at the end of last yet and proved we were more like Lonbardy and Brazil.

but let's ignore that because there's a few that prefer to avoid that reality.

We relaxed restrictions last summer to a far greater extent and didnt end up like either.

Also even with our whopper christmas surge, we never ran out of hospital or ICU capacity.

Now we are in an even better place with most of vulnerable groups having at least 1 vaccination, so comparisons to christmas are moot.

22-03-2021 10:38AM

Graham wrote: »

It's not funny when we relaxed restrictions at the end of last yet and proved we were more like Lonbardy and Brazil.

but let's ignore that because there's a few that prefer to avoid reality.

You mean at the end of last year when the relaxation of restrictions happened to coincide with the arrival of the much more transmissible variant B117 wave from our nearest neighbour, which the rest of Europe is currently going through regardless of their prior level of restriction?

This "we let people sit in a room together over Christmas and the spike was our punishment" grows tired and thin when we watch other countries go through waves and spikes as B117 becomes more prevalent in their countries.

j@utis · 22-03-2021 10:39AM

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Feel really sorry for hairdressers. <...>

There's really no need to. Blackmarket hairdressers, barbers, beauticians and such are doing very well, there's even tanning salons operating on the quiet while collecting pup payments too. I work in retail and there's way less bad hairdos, peeling off fake nails and eyelashes this lockdown, and payments in cash vs card are going up all the time.

facehugger99 · 22-03-2021 10:39AM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Colm Henry on NT is stumbling his way through an interview at the moment, desperately trying to spin positives from the mess they've made of the vaccination program.

He then says they aren't tracing maybe 30% of cases when questioned about the reports of poor infrastructure behind it all and that lockdown is their only way to deal with this.

There you have it.. We are in ongoing lockdown because Colm and his colleagues haven't been able to get their internal processes and resources in order after a year and despite an unlimited pot of cash.

First question for the post-pandemic tribunal : what DID you spend the money on then??

Never in the history of the State has so much been spent for so little benefit.

We are now at the end of March with so called non-essential retail closed down, construction closed, 25% of the working population on the PUP and thousands of viable domestic businesses being systematically destroyed.

It is now abundantly clear from the case numbers that even the most fervent lockdown cheerleaders are done with this never-ending nonsense.

And still we persist in burning through billions every single month.

This money will need to be accounted for and paid back by taxpayers. Services will be eviscerated in the coming years, which will disproportionally affect those most in need.

The abdication of responsibility by politicians who are paid to best represent this country, the behavior of the media in chasing cheap clicks and advertising revenue by ramping up the hysteria and failing to hold politicians to account and the failure of the electorate, by demonstrating how easily they can be cowed and controlled, are all depressing to consider.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Comments

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX Read OP For Mod Warnings