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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Comments

  • #2312
    Silentcorner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    Analogs daughter wrote: »
    Front page headline of Irish Independent today used the word "sinister" when describing businesses attempting to reopen in Tralee, aided by "subversive" far right groups.

    A more fitting headline would be,

    "Businesses on the brink of ruin attempt to salvage their livelihoods."

    Meanwhile absolutely nothing about the ISAG blatantly sowing fear amonsgst the population. The media coverage around Covid is becoming more disgraceful by the day.

    Its the media coverage from the start of this has been sinister!!!


  • #2313
    Akesh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 315 ✭✭Akesh


    Analogs daughter wrote: »
    Front page headline of Irish Independent today used the word "sinister" when describing businesses attempting to reopen in Tralee, aided by "subversive" far right groups.

    A more fitting headline would be,

    "Businesses on the brink of ruin attempt to salvage their livelihoods."

    Meanwhile absolutely nothing about the ISAG blatantly sowing fear amonsgst the population. The media coverage around Covid is becoming more disgraceful by the day.

    The Irish Independent is beyond saving at this point. They didn't like feedback from readers so shut down all their comment sections. I don't know why anyone pays attention to that rag. Far too cosy with the government too.


  • #2314
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Is it time for the old and vulnerable to pull on the green jersey and stay home?

    Maybe we can do alternating months; this month everyone stays home and next month the old and vulnerable stay home and the rest if us can move around


  • #2315
    Silentcorner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    Akesh wrote: »
    The Irish Independent is beyond saving at this point. They didn't like feedback from readers so shut down all their comment sections. I don't know why anyone pays attention to that rag. Far too cosy with the government too.

    You can include all Irish media, they really disgraced themselves this time!

    It is what happens when an industry abandons standards...they brought this disgrace on themselves, it has been a long time coming.


  • #2316
    Frilly Knickers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45 ✭Frilly Knickers


    I posted this on another thread but Irelands human rights body have weighed in with concerns on the level of decision making ability NPHET have been given and some of the decisions made in the last year with regards to legislation

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/covid-19-restrictions-raise-human-rights-and-equality-concerns-1.4494196%3fmode=amp

    Excerpt: "
    Problems in the law-making process “are exacerbated by the relationship between Nphet and the Government”. At times Nphet acted as “de facto decision-maker”, and there is a risk that public health advice “captures the whole decision-making process”. “This would be problematic both because important decisions should be made by democratically accountable actors and because Nphet has no particular expertise in human rights and equality.”


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  • #2317
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    Frilly Knickers wrote: »
    I posted this on another thread but Irelands human rights body have weighed in with concerns on the level of decision making ability NPHET have been given and some of the decisions made in the last year with regards to legislation

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/covid-19-restrictions-raise-human-rights-and-equality-concerns-1.4494196%3fmode=amp

    Excerpt: "
    Problems in the law-making process “are exacerbated by the relationship between Nphet and the Government”. At times Nphet acted as “de facto decision-maker”, and there is a risk that public health advice “captures the whole decision-making process”. “This would be problematic both because important decisions should be made by democratically accountable actors and because Nphet has no particular expertise in human rights and equality.”

    Yeah it was mentioned a couple of pages back. I mean, whatever side of the fence you sit on it’s alarming that a human rights advocacy group are commenting negatively on an Irish governments actions!! That type of stuff is reserved for crackpot dictatorships in central Africa yet here we are!!!

    Honest question here.... has any other developed country had its own human rights watch or equivalent body publish critical opinions of their own governments performance?


  • #2318
    dalyboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,491 ✭✭✭dalyboy


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Yeah it was mentioned a couple of pages back. I mean, whatever side of the fence you sit on it’s alarming that a human rights advocacy group are commenting negatively on an Irish governments actions!! That type of stuff is reserved for crackpot dictatorships in central Africa yet here we are!!!

    Honest question here.... has any other developed country had its own human rights watch or equivalent body publish critical opinions of their own governments performance?

    What’s the bets that NPHET etc end up facing a judge in the coming years ?


  • #2319
    JRant
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,236 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Yeah it was mentioned a couple of pages back. I mean, whatever side of the fence you sit on it’s alarming that a human rights advocacy group are commenting negatively on an Irish governments actions!! That type of stuff is reserved for crackpot dictatorships in central Africa yet here we are!!!

    Honest question here.... has any other developed country had its own human rights watch or equivalent body publish critical opinions of their own governments performance?

    The EU commission have issued strong warnings against germany and 5 other EU countries over banning the free movement of people and goods within the EU. It's starting as a trickle but will gather pace as the months go on and if the restrictions don't lift considerably.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • #2320
    JRant
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,236 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    dalyboy wrote: »
    What’s the bets that NPHET etc end up facing a judge in the coming years ?

    Zero.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • #2321
    Lundstram
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭Lundstram


    Gardai now refusing to be used as guards for quarantine hotels. Citing that the people haven’t broke any law as their reason.

    Pretty funny considering they had no problem fining and arresting Irish citizens for going about their normal lives.

    The over-time money must’ve ran out.


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  • #2322
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    dalyboy wrote: »
    What’s the bets that NPHET etc end up facing a judge in the coming years ?

    Liverpool have a better chance of retaining the league this year than that happening!


  • #2323
    Akesh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 315 ✭✭Akesh


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Yeah it was mentioned a couple of pages back. I mean, whatever side of the fence you sit on it’s alarming that a human rights advocacy group are commenting negatively on an Irish governments actions!! That type of stuff is reserved for crackpot dictatorships in central Africa yet here we are!!!

    Honest question here.... has any other developed country had its own human rights watch or equivalent body publish critical opinions of their own governments performance?

    Yes, there are plenty of examples. The issue is that there is no transparency on why these decisions have been taken other than to just 'suppress the virus' and to protect our failing health service. These decisions have been completely anti-democratic and they should have been rigorously scrutinised before being implemented.

    What is happening now is that it's glaringly obvious to the public that it's a case of the blind (NPHET) leading the blind (Govt.) with very little scrutiny of what evidence NPHET are basing their recommendations on, including having the toughest lockdown in Europe.
    dalyboy wrote: »
    What’s the bets that NPHET etc end up facing a judge in the coming years ?

    No chance, there is no accountability in the civil service in Ireland. They should all be held accountable (HSE, NPHET and Govt.) for what happened in nursing homes in Ireland and they should be held accountable for the damage they have done to the Irish economy.


  • #2324
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,566 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Yeah it was mentioned a couple of pages back. I mean, whatever side of the fence you sit on it’s alarming that a human rights advocacy group are commenting negatively on an Irish governments actions!! That type of stuff is reserved for crackpot dictatorships in central Africa yet here we are!!!

    Yet in their conclusions
    The regulations impose significant restrictions on several rights protected by the Constitution and international human rights law. Nevertheless, we consider that the public health threat posed by the pandemic is sufficient to provide a justification for these restrictions
    The enforcement powers conferred by the Acts are, in principle, permissible under both the Constitution and international human rights law.

    Their list of recommendations are basically technical and in reality would make absolutely no difference.


  • #2325
    facehugger99
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,878 ✭✭✭facehugger99


    dalyboy wrote: »
    What’s the bets that NPHET etc end up facing a judge in the coming years ?

    No chance.

    They have set this up from the start to cover each other's arses.

    NPHET can say their only role is to advise.

    Govt. can claim they felt they had to follow the advice.


    They are experts in avoiding any responsibility. It is depressing to see what the Irish political landscape has become. I personally will never vote for FG or FF again in my life, the opposition are actually worse so I will have to go for Independents and most of these are fcuking useless too - we are a banana-republic.


  • #2326
    Multipass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭Multipass


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    No chance.

    They have set this up from the start to cover each other's arses.

    NPHET can say their only role is to advise.

    Govt. can claim they felt they had to follow the advice.


    They are experts in avoiding any responsibility. It is depressing to see what the Irish political landscape has become. I personally will never vote for FG or FF again in my life, the opposition are actually worse so I will have to go for Independents and most of these are fcuking useless too - we are a banana-republic.

    I’ve had this problem for several years now - I start at the bottom of my voting card, but have terrible trouble once I get near the top. There is no credible opposition.


  • #2327
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    mohawk wrote: »
    The track and trace makes me angry to be honest. It surely would of been cheaper to implement a robust tracing system that tracks back to where people picked the infection up instead of a lockdown policy. Going back two days with a virus that can take 5-14 days for patient to become symptomatic means that we set ourselves up for failure. Last summer cases were low enough to clamp down of the virus if they had a functional test and trace in place.

    They didn’t do there part so will blame the public. It works to an extent as we can see from posts here on boards some people think that cases only rise when people break restrictions.

    The big problem is we haven't learnt how to deal with a pandemic

    We'll be straight back to lockdowns and awaiting vaccines when the next pandemic occurs

    Meanwhile other countries will be using test/trace and isolate and more intelligent measures to achieve near normality


  • #2328
    jim-mcdee
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 373 ✭✭jim-mcdee


    normanoffside wrote: »
    People just want to be treated like adults not scolded like children.

    depends on whether they are being childish no? need to match the response to the mentality.


  • #2329
    mikekerry
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 633 ✭✭✭mikekerry


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    No chance.

    They have set this up from the start to cover each other's arses.

    NPHET can say their only role is to advise.

    Govt. can claim they felt they had to follow the advice.


    They are experts in avoiding any responsibility. It is depressing to see what the Irish political landscape has become. I personally will never vote for FG or FF again in my life, the opposition are actually worse so I will have to go for Independents and most of these are fcuking useless too - we are a banana-republic.
    It's only now you realise FG and FF are a useless corrupt shower of spoofers?


  • #2330
    paddyisreal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,718 ✭✭✭paddyisreal


    Just read nphets latest address to the nation and for the first time in along time I can see a blue sky ahead. Nphet know that this lockdown is coming to an end and that the world is coming to grips with covid so they decide to release a statement with basically no concrete evidence but scaremongering bull**** of future pandemics and how covid cannot be fully got rid off etc etc.. Come July most things will be open and that will be it. Thank christ


  • #2331
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    paddyisreal wrote: »
    Just read nphets latest address to the nation and for the first time in along time I can see a blue sky ahead. Nphet know that this lockdown is coming to an end and that the world is coming to grips with covid so they decide to release a statement with basically no concrete evidence but scaremongering bull**** of future pandemics and how covid cannot be fully got rid off etc etc.. Come July most things will be open and that will be it. Thank christ

    Do you have a link for it? Not doubting you at all! Just on mobile here and dread having to scour rte for it lol


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  • #2332
    paddyisreal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,718 ✭✭✭paddyisreal


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Do you have a link for it? Not doubting you at all! Just on mobile here and dread having to scour rte for it lol

    Hope this works for you

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/nphet-says-normal-life-some-way-off-and-vaccination-unlikely-to-fully-halt-covid-19-1.4494969?mode=amp


  • #2333
    Chomper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Chomper.


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    No chance.

    They have set this up from the start to cover each other's arses.

    NPHET can say their only role is to advise.

    Govt. can claim they felt they had to follow the advice.


    They are experts in avoiding any responsibility. It is depressing to see what the Irish political landscape has become. I personally will never vote for FG or FF again in my life, the opposition are actually worse so I will have to go for Independents and most of these are fcuking useless too - we are a banana-republic.

    Dodging responsibility and consequent fallout is part of the ABC of politics


  • #2334
    facehugger99
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,878 ✭✭✭facehugger99


    Multipass wrote: »
    I’ve had this problem for several years now - I start at the bottom of my voting card, but have terrible trouble once I get near the top. There is no credible opposition.

    The irony is that it is us, electorate, that are to blame for the politicians we have.

    The only thing they excel at is arse-covering and dodging difficult decisions.

    I used to wonder at the start of this, why NPHET, which was 40-strong, had such a narrow field of expertise reporting into it. Where were the economic-experts, business interest reps, child phycologists, human behavioral experts?

    The Covid issue is about far more than virus-transmission so why stock a quango with single-issue bureaucrats?

    It's pretty obvious when you think about the politicians we have. They didn't want to be recommended a suite of options or any conflicting advice. This would require them to step up and make an accountable decision. They just wanted to get a black and white answer to a grey question.

    By God, they got it. That's why this country has been locked down for months on end. everything is viewed through a narrow-prism of 'case numbers' and nothing else matters, not the economic cost and not the societal cost.

    We have been failed badly and we will pay for it dearly in the years and decades to come but unless we demand real political change, we deserve it.


  • #2335
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    paddyisreal wrote: »
    Hope this works for you

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/nphet-says-normal-life-some-way-off-and-vaccination-unlikely-to-fully-halt-covid-19-1.4494969?mode=amp

    Haha thanks..... what’s funny is NPHET’s own comment “Covid-19 will remain in circulation for years to come” is an acknowledgement that the current approach isn’t working!


  • #2336
    Captain_Crash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    facehugger99 wrote: »
    The irony is that it is us, electorate, that are to blame for the politicians we have.

    I remember watching a programme a few years back about the change in corporate and political influence over the years.... 30 years or so ago the best paid gigs were generally in politics, so the best of the best were attracted to running for office.

    However, the ave salary of corporate CEO positions has grown by a factor of over a thousand in that time and that’s where the real money is now, with no term limits, no electorate to worry about, more scope for financial compensation and so on.... the corporate world has attracted the “best people” and left persons who aren’t suited to running a company the only ones interested in running a country.


  • #2337
    paddyisreal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,718 ✭✭✭paddyisreal


    Captain_Crash wrote: »
    Haha thanks..... what’s funny is NPHET’s own comment “Covid-19 will remain in circulation for years to come” is an acknowledgement that the current approach isn’t working!

    Couldn't understand that comment from nphet, basically it's going to be with us so we need to keep on doing the failed approach in future...


  • #2338
    PTH2009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,552 ✭✭✭✭PTH2009


    We're ****ed because NPHET will never recommend lifting of the restrictions and our cowards in the dail going with it


  • #2339
    themacattack.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 119 ✭✭themacattack.


    PTH2009 wrote: »
    We're ****ed because NPHET will never recommend lifting of the restrictions and our cowards in the dail going with it

    people wont stand for it...everyones an inch away from being done with restrictions...we have done our bit and the government and nphet have failed to come up with an alternative solution to lockdowns...most peole i know and people i dont know but meet through work are saying open things up and accept a level of risk...other diseases kill people too but we dont close our economy and hide under the bed to try and deal with them and minimise risk...


  • #2340
    Archeron
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,574 ✭✭✭Archeron


    The one thing that makes me happy in all of this horrible sh*tshow is that it really seems the tide is turning against the bumbling gobsh*tes that are supposedly in charge.

    Good Lord, even Ciara Kelly seemed to be turning against the muppetry on Newstalk this morning when she began to question the erosion of our human rights.

    Genuine thanks to all on this thread who are sharing some very very interesting information.


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  • #2341
    Tork
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,632 ✭✭✭Tork


    PTH2009 wrote: »
    We're ****ed because NPHET will never recommend lifting of the restrictions and our cowards in the dail going with it

    Or maybe it means that Covid will still be around but in a milder form. We might end up having to have booster injections to deal with the mutations but life will continue as normal. No matter what NPHET may recommend, no government is going to want to continue this indefinitely. The money will run out and it's political suicide.


This discussion has been closed.
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