Unsung Provincial Hero

shaungil · 24-02-2021 6:38pm #1

Who is the unsung provincial player with the most caps without receiving full international honours.

Michael Swift with 269 Connacht appearances jumps to mind but I'm sure there could be others.

aloooof · 24-02-2021 6:42pm

shaungil wrote: »

Who is the unsung provincial player with the most caps without receiving full international honours.

Michael Swift with 269 Connacht appearances jumps to mind but I'm sure there could be others.

John Muldoon (327,3) and Billy Holland (240,1) are 2 that come to mind with single digit international caps. Hard pushed to think of those with 0, tho.

arsebiscuits1 · 24-02-2021 6:56pm

While he's a ways off it's very easy to see him getting another 60 appearances for Connacht but 0 international caps.

Denis Buckley currently on 193 Connacht appearances. Still only 30

dregin · 24-02-2021 6:59pm

Michael Bent.

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pickarooney · 24-02-2021 7:55pm

dregin wrote: »

Michael Bent.

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2 caps before he was even a fixture at Leinster then nothing makes him both the right answer and completely the wrong answer.

sydthebeat · 24-02-2021 8:03pm

Stuart Hooper made 333 club appearances without test recognition

thomond2006 · 24-02-2021 8:25pm

He's way down the list in terms of most provincial appearances but James Coughlan was quite unlucky to never get a cap.
https://www.munsterrugby.ie/player?PlayGuid=JC686574

Losty Dublin · 24-02-2021 8:28pm

Chris Pim is a shoe in from the days when you could shoe in on players.

An Leinster and Old Wesley captain, he played in Scotland when it's domestic scene was strong. Heck he was even called up for and played for the Baa Baa's when it was the ultimate honour in the game yet he never even warmed a bench for Ireland.

Mind you it is a lot easier in the modern era to get caps given the layout of the test season, extra games and overriding medical concerns within the game itself otherwise the likes of Pim and others mentioned here would have gotten their game.

Teferi · 24-02-2021 9:33pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

He's way down the list in terms of most provincial appearances but James Coughlan was quite unlucky to never get a cap.
https://www.munsterrugby.ie/player?PlayGuid=JC686574

+1. Had a lovely run of form in his last couple of years at Munster too, it just arrived too late for him.

Zzippy · 24-02-2021 10:34pm

shaungil wrote: »

Who is the unsung provincial player with the most caps without receiving full international honours.

Michael Swift with 269 Connacht appearances jumps to mind but I'm sure there could be others.

Swifty is definitely the one for me. And sure, any excuse to post this gem again

https://youtu.be/n6VRs9ZN-A0

macslash · 24-02-2021 11:30pm

Zzippy wrote: »

Swifty is definitely the one for me. And sure, any excuse to post this gem again

https://youtu.be/n6VRs9ZN-A0

Always impressed with how good the pitch looked that evening.

Buddy Bubs · 24-02-2021 11:49pm

Ger Earls. Pre professional Era so number of provincial appearances way down but a lot of people say it was crazy he didn't get capped. His son won a load though so some justice.

Thrashssacre · 25-02-2021 1:30am

Barry Daly was looking like he was gonna be a stellar provincial player for Leinster, not sure if he'd have broken into Ireland squads but for those couple of years he was around he wasn't brilliant.

Dubinusa · 25-02-2021 5:59am

Alan O Connor is one. Ross Molony too.

Buer · 25-02-2021 9:21am

In the current Leinster set up, Josh Murphy. He has been massive for Leinster this season. I'd give a nod to Molony too for how consistent he has been.

Murphy is 5th in the league in successful carries (despite being 35th in carries), 37th in metres made (considering he's a blindside who can cover lock), 95% tackle success rate. He has become an exceptionally effective and powerful carrier. He isn't dynamic like Baird (who is a similar size) but he's able to hammer into contact and grind out metres on the majority of carries, dragging defenders with him.

49 of his 66 carries have been beyond the gain line. To put that in context, Rhys Ruddock has been successful on 52 of his 104 carries in the league, Gavin Coombes has been successful on 63 of his 95 (which is a very good return in itself) and Marcell Coetzee has been successful on 65 of 128. He's fast becoming one of the best carriers in Irish rugby yet I'd wager almost nobody would name check him as such.

Paul Smeenus · 25-02-2021 9:53am

Harry Byrne. Far too good for the Pro14, and not a single cap. Hardly ever anyone talking about him either. Odd.

arsebiscuits1 · 25-02-2021 11:43am

Buer wrote: »

In the current Leinster set up, Josh Murphy. He has been massive for Leinster this season. I'd give a nod to Molony too for how consistent he has been.

Murphy is 5th in the league in successful carries (despite being 35th in carries), 37th in metres made (considering he's a blindside who can cover lock), 95% tackle success rate. He has become an exceptionally effective and powerful carrier. He isn't dynamic like Baird (who is a similar size) but he's able to hammer into contact and grind out metres on the majority of carries, dragging defenders with him.

49 of his 66 carries have been beyond the gain line. To put that in context, Rhys Ruddock has been successful on 52 of his 104 carries in the league, Gavin Coombes has been successful on 63 of his 95 (which is a very good return in itself) and Marcell Coetzee has been successful on 65 of 128. He's fast becoming one of the best carriers in Irish rugby yet I'd wager almost nobody would name check him as such.

I love me a good collision stat Buer - where did you get yours?

phog · 25-02-2021 11:44am

Ian Dowling, James Coughlan & MOD (Micko got a good few Irish caps) would be 3 Munster unsung heros from the professional era for me.

Buer · 25-02-2021 11:51am

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

I love me a good collision stat Buer - where did you get yours?

Pro14 have a very comprehensive stats page listing the top 100 players in multiple metrics.

Fredinho · 25-02-2021 12:47pm

Eddie Hekenui

Close the thread now

Zzippy · 25-02-2021 12:49pm

Ben Betts? Anyone?

Teferi · 25-02-2021 10:54pm

I just found out Ben Betts retired and I am devastated.

shaungil · 25-02-2021 11:59pm

Billy mulcahy 68 caps for Connacht
Chris Keane 127 caps for Leinster and Connacht
Steve Jameson Leinster .

leakyboots · 26-02-2021 2:02am

Ger Earls is a great shout, widely regarded as one of the finest to come out of Limerick at a time when Limerick clubs were dominating AIL and he was criminally overlooked for national selection. He was on the Munster team that beat Australia and scored two tries in a final trial for Ireland that year for Possibles and Probables but was overlooked. There was a good interview with him a few years ago. I think he had a bit of a fallout with Kidney after not being offered one of the few pro contracts when they were being handed out which didn't do him any favours after that.

James Coughlan was another fine player in red, classy player who was deserving of national honours

Lost Ormond · 26-02-2021 2:19am

leakyboots wrote: »

Ger Earls is a great shout, widely regarded as one of the finest to come out of Limerick at a time when Limerick clubs were dominating AIL and he was criminally overlooked for national selection. He was on the Munster team that beat Australia and scored two tries in a final trial for Ireland that year for Possibles and Probables but was overlooked. There was a good interview with him a few years ago. I think he had a bit of a fallout with Kidney after not being offered one of the few pro contracts when they were being handed out which didn't do him any favours after that.

James Coughlan was another fine player in red, classy player who was deserving of national honours

Would agree about Ger Earls. Still played AIL up until he was 36 which is some going as well.

Sangre · 26-02-2021 11:43am

Hardly unsung but Isa Nacewa certainly never got a proper shot at test rugby

Losty Dublin · 26-02-2021 11:57am

leakyboots wrote: »

Ger Earls is a great shout, widely regarded as one of the finest to come out of Limerick at a time when Limerick clubs were dominating AIL and he was criminally overlooked for national selection. He was on the Munster team that beat Australia and scored two tries in a final trial for Ireland that year for Possibles and Probables but was overlooked. There was a good interview with him a few years ago. I think he had a bit of a fallout with Kidney after not being offered one of the few pro contracts when they were being handed out which didn't do him any favours after that.

James Coughlan was another fine player in red, classy player who was deserving of national honours

Up until the early 90's your chances for international caps hinged upon whatever province it was who had the balance of power on the selection committee. This was your make or brake simply because senior rugby was centred on your province. As such there was no platform in Irish rugby to show what you could do bar the Inter Pro's (Which were waning by then.) and the end of season All Ireland Cup.

The exception to the rule were the few who were playing Division 1 in England and visible on Rugby Special on BBC2; ironic that you had to leave Ireland to be selected within the domestic game :pac: The formation of the AIL did a lot to address this anomaly and Irish rugby was the better for it.

shaungil · 26-02-2021 12:55pm

Roger Wilson 200 Ulster caps 117 for Northhampton. But 1 Irish cap!!!!

ClanofLams · 26-02-2021 1:03pm

If we have reached the point of including one cap internationals, must offer the great Roman Loughney, almost 200 caps for Connacht, the most important being in Murrayfield where he made 17 tackles in 60 odd minutes against Leinster in pro 12 final.

Lost Ormond · 26-02-2021 2:10pm

Sangre wrote: »

Hardly unsung but Isa Nacewa certainly never got a proper shot at test rugby

He could have had one if he really wanted to. He got capped by Fiji in world cup and then tried all he could to dismiss that. When it was decided that those 120 seconds would count and he wouldnt be able to play for New Zealand then he could have went and played for Fiji

mfceiling · 26-02-2021 2:12pm

shaungil wrote: »

Roger Wilson 200 Ulster caps 117 for Northhampton. But 1 Irish cap!!!!

1 more than he should have got.

sydthebeat · 26-02-2021 2:18pm

Lost Ormond wrote: »

He could have had one if he really wanted to. He got capped by Fiji in world cup and then tried all he could to dismiss that. When it was decided that those 120 seconds would count and he wouldnt be able to play for New Zealand then he could have went and played for Fiji

he could have, but he felt Fiji fcuked him over

hahashake · 26-02-2021 2:25pm

sydthebeat wrote: »

he could have, but he felt Fiji fcuked him over

If he was capped by NZ he probably wouldn't have been a Leinster legend. Him feeling shafted by Fiji was probably his incentive to go to Leinster.

Dubinusa · 26-02-2021 3:43pm

Peter Dooley would be one? Solid pro, down the depth chart and always shows up.

shaungil · 02-03-2021 10:41pm

Right will try to put together a 15. Caps after name

Struggling for backs
1 Denis Buckley 194
2 Billy Mulcahy 70
3 Andrew Warwick 130
4 Alan O'Connor 123
5 Michael Swift (c) 269
6 Chris Pim ?
7 Ger Earls ?
8 James Coughlan 137
9 Duncan Williams 163
10 Chris Keane 121
12 Eoin Griffin 100
13 Bryn Cunningham 150
14 Barry Daly 36
11 ????
15 ????

Other notable Shoutouts
Brett Wikinson 183 Connacht caps
Ian Whitten 63 Ulster and 224 Exeter apps but capped in 2009 on USA tour.

Paul Smeenus · 02-03-2021 10:52pm

shaungil wrote: »

Right will try to put together a 15. Caps after name

Struggling for backs
1 Denis Buckley 194
2 Billy Mulcahy 70
3 Andrew Warwick 130
4 Alan O'Connor 123
5 Michael Swift (c) 269
6 Chris Pim ?
7 Ger Earls ?
8 James Coughlan 137
9 Duncan Williams 163
10 Chris Keane 121
12 Eoin Griffin 100
13 Bryn Cunningham 150
14 Barry Daly 36
11 ????
15 ????

Other notable Shoutouts
Brett Wikinson 183 Connacht caps
Ian Whitten 63 Ulster and 224 Exeter apps but capped in 2009 on USA tour.

Warwick a loose head, Cunningham a fullback

shaungil · 02-03-2021 11:02pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Warwick a loose head, Cunningham a fullback

Chris Keane is scrum half. Needs must.

Paul Smeenus · 02-03-2021 11:03pm

shaungil wrote: »

Chris Keane is scrum half. Needs must.

Ha ha fair enough! Well what about Ian Humphreys?

shaungil · 02-03-2021 11:10pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Ha ha fair enough! Well what about Ian Humphreys?

Perfect he can go 10 Keane to 12 and Cunningham goes back to 15 .

aloooof · 02-03-2021 11:17pm

Ronan O’Mahony for the missing wing spot?

shaungil · 02-03-2021 11:39pm

aloooof wrote: »

Ronan O’Mahony for the missing wing spot?

Thank you I can now put this to bed.

jacothelad · 03-03-2021 6:41pm

Bryn Cunningham at 15.

dregin · 03-03-2021 6:44pm

shaungil wrote: »

Right will try to put together a 15. Caps after name

Struggling for backs
1 Denis Buckley 194
2 Billy Mulcahy 70
3 Andrew Warwick 130
4 Alan O'Connor 123
5 Michael Swift (c) 269
6 Chris Pim ?
7 Ger Earls ?
8 James Coughlan 137
9 Duncan Williams 163
10 Chris Keane 121
12 Eoin Griffin 100
13 Bryn Cunningham 150
14 Barry Daly 36
11 ????
15 ????

Other notable Shoutouts
Brett Wikinson 183 Connacht caps
Ian Whitten 63 Ulster and 224 Exeter apps but capped in 2009 on USA tour.

Paul Warwick was IQ'd right? He'd fit in at 15.

FACECUTTR · 03-03-2021 6:45pm

dregin wrote: »

Paul Warwick was IQ'd right? He'd fit in at 15.

I think he had a few caps for Australia 7s or league or something.

dregin · 03-03-2021 6:50pm

FACECUTTR wrote: »

I think he had a few caps for Australia 7s or league or something.

Aye, my bad. 7s must be Australia's seconds team.

Dunmoreroader · 03-03-2021 7:03pm

Jack O'Donoghue playing out of his skin for Munster, after a career threatening injury, but nary a mention anywhere of him getting another crack at the Ireland squad and he still only 27.

shaungil · 03-03-2021 9:09pm

But Jeremy Manning might work 50 Munster caps and was Irish Qualified

connemara man · 03-03-2021 10:30pm

Gavin Duffy

Paul Smeenus · 03-03-2021 10:51pm

connemara man wrote: »

Gavin Duffy

Bloody hell. There were ENDLESS posts about our Gav not getting a crack. How could we have forgotten about him?!

Former Former Former · 03-03-2021 11:35pm

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Bloody hell. There were ENDLESS posts about our Gav not getting a crack. How could we have forgotten about him?!

Ah he got a good few caps and went to the RWC, wouldn't include him here

Downlinz · 04-03-2021 12:01am

He still has time on his side but 4 caps for Stuart McCloskey?

Unsung Provincial Hero

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