When will it all end?

22-02-2021 11:26AM

SheepsClothing wrote: »

When all is said and done, Ireland will only be a month or so behind the UK. People need to calm down.

Well if that's the case (I'm not so sure) then they should be saying so because the "end of the summer" is half a ****ing year away.

At current rates we're well behind. We're meant to be ramping up but so will they.

gozunda · 22-02-2021 11:26AM

paw patrol wrote: »

they've had very few limitation put on their lives, yet 1 year into it and they are mid table on deaths.
We've sacrificed a whole year of everything and we are no better off

They did ultimately better than us

positive rates mean nothing, deaths matter - maybe hospitalisations.
We are all going to be exposed to the virus at some stage to deny that is silly

They have one of the highest 14 day incidence rates in Europe from that link
They've had a raft of restrictions since they've ditched the 'do nothing' policy and allowing covid run rampant in nursing homes

Compared to other comparable Nordic countries they've done absolutely ****e. Even on an EU level from a new case comparison - they're still at the back of the class.

beauf · 22-02-2021 11:28AM

the kelt wrote: »

To be fair for a lot of people they dont have to do much to be proclaimed as great, particularly a lot on here.

I mean they could only change the 5k restriction to 10k and we would have masterminds on here proclaiming "wow, there you go now, you can go twice as far as you could before and just be thankful you dont have a curfew"

To be honest ive seen pigeons that learn faster!

Govt created our spikes though ignoring medical advice and going the populist route. The lemmings here love these spikes so much they want to repeat them and make them far worse. They have more in common than they are different.

beauf · 22-02-2021 11:33AM

SheepsClothing wrote: »

When all is said and done, Ireland will only be a month or so behind the UK. People need to calm down.

In fairness after the shambles of Brexit and Covid in the UK they need all the good luck they can get.

22-02-2021 11:35AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

In April (let's say 6 weeks) it'll be 250k per day. Brits are currently doing the equivalent of that and are planning their ramp-up. I'll be finding out this week if I can register at an address up North and get it there because this is ****ing ridiculous. I'd love to know what the excuse is for the EU's ****ty procurement because the US has roughly the same buying power yet had administered less than 1/5 as many vaccines as ****in America has (adjusted for population).
FFS.

And what difference will it make to you if you have the vaccine and live down here?

Scotty # · 22-02-2021 12:02PM

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

They can't actually stipulate what they believe is the point we should lift all restrictions.

I have clearly explained mine, vaccinate the over 65's and the medically vulnerable and we move on and live with it.

The only way all restrictions will be lifted is when the virus is eradicated from the community. Until then we'll still have masks and limits on capacity on indoor gatherings. Even with 100% vaccine these restrictions will still apply.

You seem to be underestimating the virus and overestimating the vaccine. The vaccine does not make you immune, it does not make you untransmissible. It simple reduced the infection - nothing more. People will still get sick but hopefully not as many will require hospitalisation. But, if you think you can drop all other restrictions and rely solely on the vaccine controlling the virus, well... then you've clearly no understanding of the vaccine or the virus.

We've already seen how many thousands can become infected per day when restrictions are eased (the vaccine won't stop this) and it only takes a very small % of those to require hospitalisation before we're all in Level5 again.

Restrictions are here for the foreseeable I'm afraid. They'll be eased off slowly and gently until we find a balance.

paw patrol · 22-02-2021 12:04PM

gozunda wrote: »

They have one of the highest 14 day incidence rates in Europe from that link
They've had a raft of restrictions since they've ditched the 'do nothing' policy and allowing covid run rampant in nursing homes

Compared to other comparable Nordic countries they've done absolutely ****e. Even on an EU level from a new case comparison - they're still at the back of the class.

they've a much older population than their neighbours. But it's more accurate to compare to a few countries to see how bad or good somebody is.
Norway could be just better than everybody.

We can argue all day on statistic - countering one with another which is good fun tbh

But ultimately we've had lockdowns for a year now they have had none and over that year they are middle in all Europe for deaths. They haven't butchered their society like we have and the end result isn't much different.
Was it worth it for Ireland? I don't believe so (putting it mildly)

We could have managed on minimal restrictions and focused on better hygiene and health.
throw in some work form home type easy measures to keep the buses/trains quieter - i'm sure there are more easy to implement stuff like that.
but allow people to do their own risk assessment and live their lives.

gozunda · 22-02-2021 12:05PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Well if that's the case (I'm not so sure) then they should be saying so because the "end of the summer" is half a ****ing year away.

At current rates we're well behind. We're meant to be ramping up but so will they.

The endless UK is best - is rubbish

Currently the UK still have a much higher rate of infection per 100,000
Ireland 4,273.49
UK 6,058.89

That despite them having had one of the strictest lockdowns in Europe.

Boris is only now talking about brining kids back to school- thats already on plan here

Our restrictions already allow for meeting up with another person for exercise

The main difference seems to be organised sports - but I strongly suspect that is more bread and circuses than pragmatic planning tbh.

This from the UKs proposed rollback

The first step will be the return to school of all pupils in England in the second week of March.

Meeting one other person outdoors will also be permitted from then.

Organised outdoor sports and outdoor meetings in groups of six are planned to return from the end of March.

https://amp.rte.ie/amp/1198499/

Its quite obvious they're not rolling back their prohibitions on foreign travel this summer - its currently illegal there to travel abroad for holiday or leisure purposes.

As for vaccines - ok they win. Mainly because they have secured preferential deals over the EU and are manufacturing their own.

We are tied to our EU allocation.

People really need to get a bit of prospective on this tbh.

paw patrol · 22-02-2021 12:08PM

Scotty # wrote: »

The only way all restrictions will be lifted is when the virus is eradicated from the community. Until then we'll still have masks and limits on capacity on indoor gatherings. Even with 100% vaccine these restrictions will still apply.

.

we will never eradicate it , it's here to stay.
It'll come in from aboard if we did get to zero covid cases. You'll have largely asymptotic cases too who wouldn't go to a doctor cos the symptoms if any are mild.

We need to wake up to this fact and live with it. There will be another pandemic in 5 years, I'd rather take my chances than live this utter sh1te again

22-02-2021 12:21PM

gozunda wrote: »

The endless UK is best - is rubbish

Currently the UK still have a much higher rate of infection per 100,000
Ireland 4,273.49
UK 6,058.89

That despite them having had one of the strictest lockdowns in Europe.

Are the UK miles ahead in terms of vaccination? That's all I'm talking about.

gozunda · 22-02-2021 12:25PM

paw patrol wrote: »

they've a much older population than their neighbours. But it's more accurate to compare to a few countries to see how bad or good somebody is.
Norway could be just better than everybody.

We can argue all day on statistic - countering one with another which is good fun tbh

But ultimately we've had lockdowns for a year now they have had none and over that year they are middle in all Europe for deaths. They haven't butchered their society like we have and the end result isn't much different.
Was it worth it for Ireland? I don't believe so (putting it mildly)

We could have managed on minimal restrictions and focused on better hygiene and health.
throw in some work form home type easy measures to keep the buses/trains quieter - i'm sure there are more easy to implement stuff like that. but allow people to do their own risk assessment and live their lives.

It remains Sweden is in deep dodo with Covid and their infection rates remain very high compared to most other EU countries.

Sweden have had increasing levels of restrictions since they've stopped the 'do nothing" approach.

As to Ireland and Sweden economy

These from The November 2020 European Commission’s 2020 Economic Forecasts

Ireland’s economy is projected to contract by 2.25% in 2020, before growing by 3% in 2021

SWEDEN In 2020, economic growth is expected to fall to -5.3% before recovering to 3.1% in 2021.

This is what actually happened

Ireland’s economy was the only one to grow in the EU last year, economic figures show, boosted by medical and pharmaceutical exports.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/ireland-only-eu-economy-to-grow-in-2020-1.4482192

And Sweden is a much much wealthier country than Ireland

The only thing which has kept their heads above water - are the resources they have to throw at their health services.

Tazz T · 22-02-2021 12:33PM

ShineOn7 wrote: »

To get the vaccine as a "new UK resident"?

Er

Nah

Zero chance of this happening

This is happening. I could get it next month if I wanted. I have a doctor in the north, but I'm not allowed to travel. I know people living in border areas who have been vaxxed up north.

gozunda · 22-02-2021 12:33PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Are the UK miles ahead in terms of vaccination? That's all I'm talking about.

Yeah - they're the outlier as detailed because they have secured preferential deals over the EU and are manufacturing their own.

We are tied to our EU allocation. In Europe our vaccine rollout is at the higher end compared to other countries.

And that's where we are ...

beauf · 22-02-2021 01:13PM

paw patrol wrote: »

they've a much older population than their neighbours. ...

% over 65

21.9 Finland
19.9 Sweden
19.6 Denmark
19.1 Ireland
18.3 UK
17.2 Norway

I'm not going to pick apart the rest. They may only did marginally better economically. It looked they were going to recover better, then their 3rd spike exploded and herd immunity failed. So we won't know economically for a good while yet. But their economy isn't dependent on the same things ours is. So our outcomes in that regard were never going to be the same. Likewise comparing it to some of the economically broken countries in Europe even before Covid has little value.

As you say, there's little to be gained arguing about it. Get a groundswell of people in favor of repeating Xmas spike indefinitely. The Govt will likely give in to public pressure.

22-02-2021 01:52PM

bubblypop wrote: »

And what difference will it make to you if you have the vaccine and live down here?

My dad is in his 60s with emphysema and my mother is currently getting radiation therapy for cancer. It would be nice to see a little bit more of them. I also have asthma which is far less important but I'd probably get the vaccine up North because of that quicker than either of my parents will down here with their far more serious illnesses/conditions.

Irish Stones · 22-02-2021 02:01PM

Scotty # wrote: »

The only way all restrictions will be lifted is when the virus is eradicated from the community. Until then we'll still have masks and limits on capacity on indoor gatherings. Even with 100% vaccine these restrictions will still apply.

[...]

Restrictions are here for the foreseeable I'm afraid. They'll be eased off slowly and gently until we find a balance.

In my opinion, lots of measures we are currently taking to counter the spreading of the virus will stay forever, or at least for many many years.
Masks, social distancing, hand sanitizers, are relatively inexpensive and have proved to work rather effectively, so why drop them even in the future? They will prevent any possible future airborne disease.
Temperature scanning at the entrance of premises and screens at counters - shops and businesses have invested thousands to have them, will they just store them in the back shed or will they keep using them in the future?

Once that we get used to all this stuff, we won't even bother whether they are in place or not.

Tazz T · 22-02-2021 02:04PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Are the UK miles ahead in terms of vaccination? That's all I'm talking about.

Bojo was saying yesterday that they expect the entire adult population to be vaxxed by end of July. Sounds optimistic, but at least they're going for it.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/21/uk-speeds-up-vaccinations-all-adults-get-1st-jab-by-july-31.html

Scotty # · 22-02-2021 02:05PM

Deleted User wrote: »

My dad is in his 60s with emphysema and my mother is currently getting radiation therapy for cancer. It would be nice to see a little bit more of them.

You being vaccinated will not reduce the risk to them. They need to be vaccinated for that.

Le Bruise · 22-02-2021 02:05PM

Irish Stones wrote: »

In my opinion, lots of measures we are currently taking to counter the spreading of the virus will stay forever, or at least for many many years.
Masks, social distancing, hand sanitizers, are relatively inexpensive and have proved to work rather effectively, so why drop them even in the future? They will prevent any possible future airborne disease.
Temperature scanning at the entrance of premises and screens at counters - shops and businesses have invested thousands to have them, will they just store them in the back shed or will they keep using them in the future?

Once that we get used to all this stuff, we won't even bother whether they are in place or not.

Social Distancing is not 'relatively inexpensive'. Hospitality, sporting events and concerts all require crowds to be financially viable. As soon as it is safe to do so, it will be gone.

Irish Stones · 22-02-2021 02:14PM

Le Bruise wrote: »

Social Distancing is not 'relatively inexpensive'. Hospitality, sporting events and concerts all require crowds to be financially viable. As soon as it is safe to do so, it will be gone.

I'm sure they will find a way to balance it with the need of safety. A few important people in the world stated that our lifestyle will need a deep change, and I think that they were referring to that industry too.
The queues outside shops with floor markers and things like this will stay, in my opinion.

22-02-2021 02:26PM

Tazz T wrote: »

Bojo was saying yesterday that they expect the entire adult population to be vaxxed by end of July. Sounds optimistic, but at least they're going for it.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/21/uk-speeds-up-vaccinations-all-adults-get-1st-jab-by-july-31.html

Adult population around 55 million so 110 million doses needed (if everyone would take it).

5 months, ~150 days. Currently doing around 400k per day which would be another 60 million doses on top of about 17 million they've already done. So at current rates they'll hit 87 million by that point. They only need a small increase in their current rate to hit that target.

Le Bruise · 22-02-2021 02:29PM

Irish Stones wrote: »

I'm sure they will find a way to balance it with the need of safety. A few important people in the world stated that our lifestyle will need a deep change, and I think that they were referring to that industry too.
The queues outside shops with floor markers and things like this will stay, in my opinion.

Agree to disagree on this one, you can't have a socially distanced gig.

I believe the long term changes relate to greater numbers working from home, hand hygiene and cough etiquette...none of that a bad thing.

hynesie08 · 22-02-2021 02:31PM

Tazz T wrote: »

Bojo was saying yesterday that they expect the entire adult population to be vaxxed by end of July. Sounds optimistic, but at least they're going for it.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/21/uk-speeds-up-vaccinations-all-adults-get-1st-jab-by-july-31.html

First jab only, at a million a month, we should actually have pulled in front of them by then.

All British adults will be offered a first dose of the coronavirus vaccine by July 31, U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson said Sunday.

Multipass · 22-02-2021 02:32PM

gozunda wrote: »

They have one of the highest 14 day incidence rates in Europe from that link
They've had a raft of restrictions since they've ditched the 'do nothing' policy and allowing covid run rampant in nursing homes

Compared to other comparable Nordic countries they've done absolutely ****e. Even on an EU level from a new case comparison - they're still at the back of the class.

Comparing Sweden to its neighbours is just nonsense - they have far more immigration and dense low income housing. Norway is much richer, lower population density and not bound by EU rules regarding movement of people.

Silentcorner · 22-02-2021 02:50PM

Multipass wrote: »

Comparing Sweden to its neighbours is just nonsense - they have far more immigration and dense low income housing. Norway is much richer, lower population density and not bound by EU rules regarding movement of people.

They have also, to my knowledge, had softer flu seasons in recent years, which would mean an accumulation of aged and compromised immune systems than their neighbours...seems to be a pattern many don't factor in.

22-02-2021 02:54PM

If they're saying first dose in the UK by the end of July then they must be planning to slow things down.

ujjjjjjjjj · 22-02-2021 02:55PM

Scotty # wrote: »

The only way all restrictions will be lifted is when the virus is eradicated from the community. Until then we'll still have masks and limits on capacity on indoor gatherings. Even with 100% vaccine these restrictions will still apply.

You seem to be underestimating the virus and overestimating the vaccine. The vaccine does not make you immune, it does not make you untransmissible. It simple reduced the infection - nothing more. People will still get sick but hopefully not as many will require hospitalisation. But, if you think you can drop all other restrictions and rely solely on the vaccine controlling the virus, well... then you've clearly no understanding of the vaccine or the virus.

We've already seen how many thousands can become infected per day when restrictions are eased (the vaccine won't stop this) and it only takes a very small % of those to require hospitalisation before we're all in Level5 again.

Restrictions are here for the foreseeable I'm afraid. They'll be eased off slowly and gently until we find a balance.

Look I respect your point of view but I just can't agree with you. This virus is endemic now and it is critical we understand that.

This virus being endemic will continue to spread and move around our society just like the flu does, it won't go away with vaccines but once hospitalisations and deaths are low we have to move on, stop testing, stop all restrictions and get on with life.

Any other approach guarantees we stay locked down to some extent forever.

Patches oHoulihan · 22-02-2021 02:57PM

Scotty # wrote: »

The only way all restrictions will be lifted is when the virus is eradicated from the community. Until then we'll still have masks and limits on capacity on indoor gatherings. Even with 100% vaccine these restrictions will still apply.

You seem to be underestimating the virus and overestimating the vaccine. The vaccine does not make you immune, it does not make you untransmissible. It simple reduced the infection - nothing more. People will still get sick but hopefully not as many will require hospitalisation. But, if you think you can drop all other restrictions and rely solely on the vaccine controlling the virus, well... then you've clearly no understanding of the vaccine or the virus.

We've already seen how many thousands can become infected per day when restrictions are eased (the vaccine won't stop this) and it only takes a very small % of those to require hospitalisation before we're all in Level5 again.

Restrictions are here for the foreseeable I'm afraid. They'll be eased off slowly and gently until we find a balance.

and how long is this balance going to take then?

People are about done with ****ing restrictions.
At this point just get back to life and let nature take its course

Martin567 · 22-02-2021 03:04PM

Le Bruise wrote: »

Social Distancing is not 'relatively inexpensive'. Hospitality, sporting events and concerts all require crowds to be financially viable. As soon as it is safe to do so, it will be gone.

I agree 100%.

Whatever anyone's views on social distancing (I despise it), it is utterly mind boggling how anyone could describe it as relatively inexpensive.

Pretty much every restriction in place at the moment is there to facilitate social distancing. It impacts on business, sport, arts & culture, education right down the basics of going out for a meal or visiting friends and family. Once most of the population is vaccinated later in the year, social distancing needs to quickly become a thing of the past.

I do wonder if people who say things like this have any understanding of psychology. Presumably they want people to comply with existing measures and to get vaccinated? Do they not understand that suggesting mask wearing and social distancing will continue for years into the future will lead many people to see no point in maintaining the current levels of compliance or to bother getting vaccinated?

Patches oHoulihan · 22-02-2021 03:04PM

the kelt wrote: »

So getting back away from mystic meg land!

As the thread is titled, "when will it end"

Whats peoples thoughts as to tomorrows announcement.

Will it give us any indication as to when it might end?

Any indication as to when it might actually even ease a bit?

Or is it still a good bet to take the majority of European countries will ease and even end at some stage and add c. 4 to 6 weeks on top of that for Ireland if we are lucky?

I think it will be worse after the announcement. Relying on this Gov to give us anything other than a gloomy NPHET led report is too much to ask for.

We are all going to be locked up for years. The virus is here to stay. Vaccines dont and wont work. You can have a coffee with your neighbour in September. Next year.

But sure holdfirm etc etc. There is light at the end of the tunnel...as you approach the gates of Heaven!:rolleyes:

When will it all end?

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