2020 officially saw a record number of $1 billion weather and climate disasters.

Danno · 03-02-2021 12:04am

Akrasia wrote: »

You are wrong
Now, if you said ‘Carbon taxes cannot be completely avoided’
You would be correct, but then your point would be severely diluted

I guess I'm wrong, Carbon taxes can be avoided. Sell the car, quit the job and join the dole where my money won't be going into fuel taxes because there is no real alternative or no public transport. This is the reality for around 3 million Irish people outside of cities and large urban areas.

Akrasia wrote: »

Carbon taxes are designed to be avoided. If you walk to the shop instead of driving, you’ve avoided carbon tax. If you rent a Higher BER rated house, you avoid carbon tax....

Oh sh!t I forgot to get a few items shopping, oh well - what's another 30 mile round trip of a walk?

Akrasia wrote: »

Also. Where did you get this 60k cost for an EV from?

From the car brand you recommended earlier - the one that goes 100km in a 5min charge.

Akrasia wrote: »

I can go on donedeal today and buy a perfectly serviceable family sized EV for about 5k

Have you a link?

Akrasia wrote: »

I can go into a showroom and buy a brand new family sized EV for less than 35k

Have you a link?

*****

You really need to take a broad look at the different conditions the other three million Irish people live in. No fancy Darts or Luas, the few busses that run would have you fired for being late. It's a non-runner.

When the second hand market is *flooded* with affordable EVs that do *exactly* what my current vehicle does will I consider changing. Until then I will vote against every carbon tax hike as it's detrimental to the families of Ireland.

Over the past 20 years or so a huge amount of carbon tax has been raised. Where has this been spent, how much C02 did it reduce in the atmosphere, how much colder is the earth today because of all this carbon tax? Did we reduce temperatures by even 0.01c?

Thelonious Monk · 03-02-2021 12:44am

Danno wrote: »

You really need to take a broad look at the different conditions the other three million Irish people live in. No fancy Darts or Luas, the few busses that run would have you fired for being late. It's a non-runner.

Down to poor planning really and designing the country around the motorcar. This has us in a precarious situation where lots of people are reliant on cars. But hopefully in future we'll live in more sustainable ways where people don't necessarily need cars.

Danno · 03-02-2021 1:34am

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Down to poor planning really and designing the country around the motorcar. This has us in a precarious situation where lots of people are reliant on cars. But hopefully in future we'll live in more sustainable ways where people don't necessarily need cars.

Planning, there was no planning let alone call it poor.

I don't see people giving up cars either. Yes they'll eventually changeover to EV, and with that there will be an exodus into the countryside with remote working becoming more common and parked out front the nip-around EV to do the weekly shop and drop kids to games and live the peaceful life.

You could already say it has begun.

gozunda · 03-02-2021 2:02am

Suppose it will be pretty much the same way as we are reliant on flying. But hopefully in the future well live in more sustainable ways where people won't necessarily need to use airplanes. They can walk or cycle instead. That said by the time your average punter has cycled to Costa del Tobacco - it should leave just enough time to start on the journey home again.

In other news today this:

https://twitter.com/mr__daly/status/1356702605007851524?s=20

Akrasia · 03-02-2021 9:51am

Danno wrote: »

I guess I'm wrong, Carbon taxes can be avoided. Sell the car, quit the job and join the dole where my money won't be going into fuel taxes because there is no real alternative or no public transport. This is the reality for around 3 million Irish people outside of cities and large urban areas.

Oh sh!t I forgot to get a few items shopping, oh well - what's another 30 mile round trip of a walk?

From the car brand you recommended earlier - the one that goes 100km in a 5min charge.

Have you a link?

Have you a link?

*****

You really need to take a broad look at the different conditions the other three million Irish people live in. No fancy Darts or Luas, the few busses that run would have you fired for being late. It's a non-runner.

When the second hand market is *flooded* with affordable EVs that do *exactly* what my current vehicle does will I consider changing. Until then I will vote against every carbon tax hike as it's detrimental to the families of Ireland.

Over the past 20 years or so a huge amount of carbon tax has been raised. Where has this been spent, how much C02 did it reduce in the atmosphere, how much colder is the earth today because of all this carbon tax? Did we reduce temperatures by even 0.01c?

I told you the name of the website, I’m not going to give you individual links to specific cars so you can nitpick count them having a dent in the rear bumper or other flaw that makes them impossible to live with
You can buy a Hyundai Ioniq EV for under 35k new, for example, this same car will cost the same as the ICE car after 6 years of depreciation.
You said you cannot buy an EV for under 60k using an example of a family currently driving a 10k used car

And your discussion of the ways to avoid carbon tax are all totally exaggerated. You’re talking about people who live in houses that are basically uninhabitable. In the 21st century no house should be so cold that they have to move out in the winter because they can’t afford to heat it.

The government provide grants for fuel and heating to low income families and elderly people, as well as grants to improve insulation and replace heating systems, and will even do much of this for free for the worst performing houses

If the country is full of people who are so desperate that they’re made homeless by a 200 euros a year carbon tax then we’re doing an awful lot of things wrong, luckily you’re talking nonsense and the vast majority of people are able to handle the cost and we have things like community welfare officers to help those who can’t

If you are genuinely concerned about these people, I’m sure you would support higher income supports targeted at them. Th income from a higher carbon tax could even help to pay for it

gozunda · 03-02-2021 12:10pm

Akrasia wrote: »

I told you the name of the website, I’m not going to give you individual links to specific cars so you can nitpick count them having a dent in the rear bumper or other flaw that makes them impossible to live with
You can buy a Hyundai Ioniq EV for under 35k new, for example, this same car will cost the same as the ICE car after 6 years of depreciation.You said you cannot buy an EV for under 60k using an example of a family currently driving a 10k used car

And your discussion of the ways to avoid carbon tax are all totally exaggerated. You’re talking about people who live in houses that are basically uninhabitable. In the 21st century no house should be so cold that they have to move out in the winter because they can’t afford to heat it.

The government provide grants for fuel and heating to low income families and elderly people, as well as grants to improve insulation and replace heating systems, and will even do much of this for free for the worst performing houses

If the country is full of people who are so desperate that they’re made homeless by a 200 euros a year carbon tax then we’re doing an awful lot of things wrong, luckily you’re talking nonsense and the vast majority of people are able to handle the cost and we have things like community welfare officers to help those who can’t

If you are genuinely concerned about these people, I’m sure you would support higher income supports targeted at them. Th income from a higher carbon tax could even help to pay for it

The nonsense of that statement is truely gobsmacking tbf. I take it either you don't live in this country or realise that a substantial proportion of housing stock in this country predates the 1960s. Insulation and other improvements can often only achieve limited increases in energy efficiency in these dwellings. And yes without heating many would be unliveable. If you doubt take a look at the BER map of Ireland. Id suggest you also look at the considerable difficulties involved in accessing the grants for improvements & etc which you refer to.

https://renewables.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=360f7b3f6f484d7d89b967b41231daef

And the joke about a '200 euros a year carbon tax' is evidently that's just for starters. It's little more than another vehicle to squeeze an already overtaxed population for money just like many other taxes here which were supposedly introduced to cover specific areas of revenue and which fail spectacularly to do so. The tax allows some 'greens' to feel righteous and bugger all else.

Good article on why Carbon taxes raise money from the wrong people, and are vulnerable to politics and why such carbon taxes have proven not particularly effective at cutting emissions.

Danno · 03-02-2021 2:41pm

Akrasia wrote: »

I told you the name of the website, I’m not going to give you individual links to specific cars so you can nitpick count them having a dent in the rear bumper or other flaw that makes them impossible to live with
You can buy a Hyundai Ioniq EV for under 35k new, for example, this same car will cost the same as the ICE car after 6 years of depreciation. You said you cannot buy an EV for under 60k using an example of a family currently driving a 10k used car

312km range! Get up the yard. Takes 1hr to charge to 80% if you're lucky enough to find a 100kW charger. Your own home can't charge faster than 7kW, so that puts "fast charging" in the ha'penny place.
Also, we've to wait six years for this car to come on the second hand market, but in the mean time you want us roasted with carbon taxes... thats nice.

Akrasia wrote: »

And your discussion of the ways to avoid carbon tax are all totally exaggerated. You’re talking about people who live in houses that are basically uninhabitable. In the 21st century no house should be so cold that they have to move out in the winter because they can’t afford to heat it.

Not true.

Akrasia wrote: »

The government provide grants for fuel and heating to low income families and elderly people, as well as grants to improve insulation and replace heating systems, and will even do much of this for free for the worst performing houses

Over two years plus on the waiting list and works are not guaranteed for working families on low wages. :mad:

Akrasia wrote: »

If the country is full of people who are so desperate that they’re made homeless by a 200 euros a year carbon tax then we’re doing an awful lot of things wrong, luckily you’re talking nonsense and the vast majority of people are able to handle the cost and we have things like community welfare officers to help those who can’t

Thats a nasty thing to say that people are doing an awful lot wrong. You really don't understand the paycheck-to-paycheck life of a huge swathe of this country and countless other "developed" countries also.

Akrasia wrote: »

If you are genuinely concerned about these people, I’m sure you would support higher income supports targeted at them. Th income from a higher carbon tax could even help to pay for it

Give it in one hand to take off in another hand? The hoops families are put through just to get any level of support is met with scrutiny and suspicion. Again, you really don't understand the paycheck-to-paycheck life of a huge swathe of this country.

I'm rather shocked by your stance.

Nabber · 04-02-2021 3:24am

Whether you agree with AGW, have doubts about level of human influence or downright just don’t accept any of it... There is one thing that we can all agree on.

Carbon taxes disproportionately impacts the poor and working class. For good or bad, the squeeze is on the lower classes.

Carbon taxes have done very little to discourage the use of cars. Our tax system rewards high end cars and punishes affordable cars.

planes are allowed to fly inefficient first class seats. Why not target the excessive waste first.

delusional to think tax is used as dissuasion. When governments dissuade they do so with laws and prohibition. Working class taxes hurt, they don’t build any mental considerations to avoid high tax. Crazy to think otherwise.

Incentivise through innovation.

Oneiric 3 · 04-02-2021 4:21pm

A new study shows...

COVID-19 Lockdowns Caused Cleaner Air – And Warmed the Planet
https://scitechdaily.com/covid-19-lockdowns-caused-cleaner-air-and-warmed-the-planet/

The 'cleaner' the planet becomes, the warmer it gets. Something I have alluded too more than once for a number of years now.

Akrasia · 04-02-2021 8:13pm

Danno wrote: »

312km range! Get up the yard. Takes 1hr to charge to 80% if you're lucky enough to find a 100kW charger. Your own home can't charge faster than 7kW, so that puts "fast charging" in the ha'penny place.
Also, we've to wait six years for this car to come on the second hand market, but in the mean time you want us roasted with carbon taxes... thats nice.

Not true.

Over two years plus on the waiting list and works are not guaranteed for working families on low wages. :mad:

Thats a nasty thing to say that people are doing an awful lot wrong. You really don't understand the paycheck-to-paycheck life of a huge swathe of this country and countless other "developed" countries also.

Give it in one hand to take off in another hand? The hoops families are put through just to get any level of support is met with scrutiny and suspicion. Again, you really don't understand the paycheck-to-paycheck life of a huge swathe of this country.

I'm rather shocked by your stance.

You don’t know anything about my life and don’t pretend that you do. You’re the one turning up your nose at a car just because the range is ‘only’ 312 Kms, that’s 10 of your mythical man from Loop head’s round trips to the corner shop

You’re feigning concern for impoverished people and sneering at the idea that they can get assistance from our welfare system

If the government can cover the cost of carbon taxes for low income people then your only remaining argument against carbon taxes are that you personally do not want to pay them

There are many different forms of carbon tax proposals. I would favor the Nordhause tax and rebate system because it is works to both push people away from Carbon emissions, and pull them towards lifestyle changes that could speed up the transition by fueling demand for low carbon technology and crushing demand for polluting industry

Nabber · 04-02-2021 10:27pm

Akrasia wrote: »

There are many different forms of carbon tax proposals. I would favor the Nordhause tax and rebate system because it is works to both push people away from Carbon emissions, and pull them towards lifestyle changes that could speed up the transition by fueling demand for low carbon technology and crushing demand for polluting industry

Not sure I agree with Nordhaus, he just bring disparity taxes to the international scale, recommending a cabron tax per of ~$50, penalties to countries that go above and additional levies on countries who fail to sign up.
It sounds good on paper, but much like what Danno has said, going green costs more money, often not affordable, the tech is new and expensive. Applying that at an international scale will starve poorer countries the ability to grow.

From my own experience, I applied for a grant to bring up my BER rating of the house. As I could only use approved vendors they ate up the cost of the grant I was getting, where vendors/contractors who were not part of the scheme were cheaper. When all costs were worked out the price was relative (too expensive either way)
Tax rebates and grants on something you fundamentally can't afford is not the solution. There is also zero ingenuity in using tax systems.

Akrasia · 04-02-2021 11:54pm

Nabber wrote: »

Not sure I agree with Nordhaus, he just bring disparity taxes to the international scale, recommending a cabron tax per of ~$50, penalties to countries that go above and additional levies on countries who fail to sign up.
It sounds good on paper, but much like what Danno has said, going green costs more money, often not affordable, the tech is new and expensive. Applying that at an international scale will starve poorer countries the ability to grow.

From my own experience, I applied for a grant to bring up my BER rating of the house. As I could only use approved vendors they ate up the cost of the grant I was getting, where vendors/contractors who were not part of the scheme were cheaper. When all costs were worked out the price was relative (too expensive either way)
Tax rebates and grants on something you fundamentally can't afford is not the solution. There is also zero ingenuity in using tax systems.

The reason for limiting suppliers is to avoid the inevitable exploitation where people pocket the cash by getting some guy to sign off that the work is done

It’s also important that any international relief to developing countries is tied to targets

Any financial interventions in response to climate change needs to be very well regulated because the scale of the problem means there are enormous amounts of money to be made through corruption and cronyism

I’m not saying it’s easy, I’m not saying it would be implemented perfectly with no instances of profiteering or corruption, but the mechanisms do exist to use financial, fiscal, monetary, legal and regulatory instruments to make a transition to a low-zero carbon economy

What balance of these is optimal is open for debate. The need to act is very much a fringe discussion

Nabber · 06-02-2021 1:59am

Akrasia wrote: »

The reason for limiting suppliers is to avoid the inevitable exploitation where people pocket the cash by getting some guy to sign off that the work is done

Typically vendors petition for access to government contracts, it's not a control mechanism. It's who has paid for access. This is evident in the BER testing does not have a prerequisite that any upgrades be carries out by council/government approved vendors.
It's mirrored by tax relief on homes, which is just absorbed by developers and sellers.

It’s also important that any international relief to developing countries is tied to targets

Any financial interventions in response to climate change needs to be very well regulated because the scale of the problem means there are enormous amounts of money to be made through corruption and cronyism

Unfortunate that such a thing is a problem, green taxes are as susceptible to abuse as any other tax/relief. I don't know that there is a good example to show government(s) implement any system well and honest. Not to say we shouldn't try, just sad that we accept corruption as an inevitable.

I’m not saying it’s easy, I’m not saying it would be implemented perfectly with no instances of profiteering or corruption, but the mechanisms do exist to use financial, fiscal, monetary, legal and regulatory instruments to make a transition to a low-zero carbon economy

What balance of these is optimal is open for debate. The need to act is very much a fringe discussion

Taxation doesn't work as a deterrent. To enforce any scheme at a global level requires the power that be to enforce it.
In my opinion green policies are typically just a populist move. I'm not convinced that any world leading country is truly invested in green at the cost of economy.
Green policies at a global level are similar to deforestation, fishing, coal burning et al. They disproportionately impact the poorer countries.

I'm not trying to champion poorer countries, but it's easy for us to sit in comfort and say what we think others should do. Carbon energy has removed more from poverty than any other resource.
I truly believe resources are better spent in education, bring up global brain power and working on solutions that can fix the problem. By it's own prognosis AGW can't be solved alone now by CO2 reductions.

Oneiric 3 · 16-02-2021 9:24am

Clown world:

https://twitter.com/lukelegate/status/1361149723072208896

Pa ElGrande · 16-02-2021 9:51am

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

Clown world:

That picture was taken in Sweden a few years ago. In Texas, currently many wind turbines are frozen and this has contributed to a power outages as far away as Mexico. Even worse the cold weather has led to natural gas shortages so the backup fuel is not available.

In Germany, despite massive capital investment in solar and wind, the random generation from these sources got exposed this winter and they were left depending on coal to keep their grid going. They don't get much out of solar in Winter for obvious reasons , this month the panels were covered in snow and ice.

There is a lesson for us here, we currently depend on gas to keep our electricity system stable, if we get a winter 1947 scenario again, we may not have enough fuel supply to keep homes heated and people will die. More people die in cold weather every year in Ireland (Excess Winter deaths) and if Professor Valentina Zharkova, of Northumbria University predictions from a few years ago come to pass, another 1947 in the British Isles is not an unreasonable expectation.

Oneiric 3 · 16-02-2021 2:32pm

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

That picture was taken in Sweden a few years ago. In Texas, currently many wind turbines are frozen and this has contributed to a power outages as far away as Mexico. Even worse the cold weather has led to natural gas shortages so the backup fuel is not available.

In Germany, despite massive capital investment in solar and wind, the random generation from these sources got exposed this winter and they were left depending on coal to keep their grid going. They don't get much out of solar in Winter for obvious reasons , this month the panels were covered in snow and ice.

There is a lesson for us here, we currently depend on gas to keep our electricity system stable, if we get a winter 1947 scenario again, we may not have enough fuel supply to keep homes heated and people will die. More people die in cold weather every year in Ireland (Excess Winter deaths) and if Professor Valentina Zharkova, of Northumbria University predictions from a few years ago come to pass, another 1947 in the British Isles is not an unreasonable expectation.

At least 6 dead now from the cold in Texas:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/winter-storm-frigid-temperatures-deaths-power-outages/

with millions without power. I wonder why?

Tucker Carlson (oh my God, the horror!) here gives as good an explanation as anyone:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA46v_aMidQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA46v_aMidQ

And there seems to be a new narrative being woven now, as shown in the video above, in that anyone who might dare to question 'the science' is now fair game to be labelled a 'Nazi'. :rolleyes:

It has been obvious for a while now that 'The Science' is really nothing more than a front for class oppression. The perfect excuse for the haves to stomp their boot down hard on the have nots, all the while as they have the gall to sell themselves to be the most truly virtuous ones and the owners of all that is moral and good.

Gaoth Laidir · 16-02-2021 4:47pm

https://twitter.com/Houstorian/status/1361034343020437508

https://twitter.com/JeffLindner1/status/1361696334915522560

Thargor · 16-02-2021 10:47pm

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

Clown world:

https://twitter.com/lukelegate/status/1361149723072208896

Pa ElGrande wrote: »

That picture was taken in Sweden a few years ago. In Texas, currently many wind turbines are frozen and this has contributed to a power outages as far away as Mexico. Even worse the cold weather has led to natural gas shortages so the backup fuel is not available.

In Germany, despite massive capital investment in solar and wind, the random generation from these sources got exposed this winter and they were left depending on coal to keep their grid going. They don't get much out of solar in Winter for obvious reasons , this month the panels were covered in snow and ice.

There is a lesson for us here, we currently depend on gas to keep our electricity system stable, if we get a winter 1947 scenario again, we may not have enough fuel supply to keep homes heated and people will die. More people die in cold weather every year in Ireland (Excess Winter deaths) and if Professor Valentina Zharkova, of Northumbria University predictions from a few years ago come to pass, another 1947 in the British Isles is not an unreasonable expectation.

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

At least 6 dead now from the cold in Texas:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/winter-storm-frigid-temperatures-deaths-power-outages/

with millions without power. I wonder why?

Tucker Carlson (oh my God, the horror!) here gives as good an explanation as anyone:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA46v_aMidQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA46v_aMidQ

And there seems to be a new narrative being woven now, as shown in the video above, in that anyone who might dare to question 'the science' is now fair game to be labelled a 'Nazi'. :rolleyes:

It has been obvious for a while now that 'The Science' is really nothing more than a front for class oppression. The perfect excuse for the haves to stomp their boot down hard on the have nots, all the while as they have the gall to sell themselves to be the most truly virtuous ones and the owners of all that is moral and good.

This is pure disinformation, which is going to be a continuing problem for you both if you think climate denial blogs like "notalotofpeopleknowthat" and "notrickszone" (why the stupid names does anyone know? Is it how the bullsh1t artists signal to each other? See also "wattsupwiththat") and Tucker Carlson (lol). The Texas power grid collapses every time they have a bad Winter, also ERCOTs own data shows wind energy is currently generating significantly above forecasts, interesting article here:

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/02/texas-power-grid-crumples-under-the-cold/

Texas refusal to integrate with neighbouring states and refusal to spend money on Winter proofing their infrastructure means power from gas/coal and nuclear all failing to reach customers.

Strange that you would choose to focus on the 20% minority of power produced by wind and ignore the rest, wonder why that would be?

Oneiric 3 · 16-02-2021 11:35pm

Thargor wrote: »

Texas refusal to integrate with neighbouring states and refusal to spend money on Winter proofing their infrastructure means power from gas/coal and nuclear all failing to reach customers.
[/IMG]

But isn't this a good thing though, given that fossil fuel = bad? except, of course, when you blood thirsty, racist liberal types need to use it?

Thargor · 16-02-2021 11:52pm

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

But isn't this a good thing though, given that fossil fuel = bad? except, of course, when you blood thirsty, racist liberal types need to use it?

No idea what that gibberish is meant to mean like most of your posts, bloodthirsty racist liberal? Lol.

Oneiric 3 · 16-02-2021 11:56pm

Thargor wrote: »

No idea what that gibberish is meant to mean like most of your posts, bloodthirsty racist liberal? Lol.

'Lol'. :rolleyes:

Not gibberish, just answer the question.

Thargor · 17-02-2021 12:01am

Of how Im a bloodthirsty racist liberal? Im not a psychiatrist so I have no idea.

Oneiric 3 · 17-02-2021 12:06am

Thargor wrote: »

I have no idea.

You are right. You don't.

But do tell me again about misinformation in 'climate blogs', which are something I don't even go near.

Birdnuts · 17-02-2021 12:09am

Have to say its been very interesting the number of cold and snow records in the Northern Hemisphere that have been approached or exceeded in recent weeks. It puts into sharp focus much of the climate hysteria whipped up by the usual suspects. The near total failure of wind power dependent grids is also telling. Good discussion on the latter on bloomberg today about the matter with many energy experts saying that nuclear and NG will have to be invested in much more than wind to deal with these issues

Thargor · 17-02-2021 12:16am

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

You are right. You don't.

But do tell me again about misinformation in 'climate blogs', which are something I don't even go near.

No as you can see by the posts I quoted that was directed at the person before you, you seem to prefer to get your disinformation from Youtube videos from the likes of Tucker Carlson and other liars that serve your confirmation bias, those are usually easier to disprove than the denier blogs.

Do you want to retract any of your lies in the face of the actual evidence you've been given or just carry on with the racist/bloodthirsty/liberal lunacy (and not forgetting your Attenborough/penguin sex abuse theories lol)

Oneiric 3 · 17-02-2021 12:33am

Thargor wrote: »

No as you can see by the posts I quoted that was directed at the person before you, you seem to prefer to get your disinformation from Youtube videos from the likes of Tucker Carlson and other liars that serve your confirmation bias, those are usually easier to disprove than the denier blogs.

Do you want to retract any of your lies in the face of the actual evidence you've been given or just carry on with the racist/bloodthirsty/liberal lunacy (and not forgetting your Attenborough/penguin sex abuse theories lol)

You haven't disproving anything I have said or posted, but yeah, you and your sort calling the shots on what is 'disinformation' or not really cuts it.

Oneiric 3 · 17-02-2021 12:36am

Birdnuts wrote: »

Have to say its been very interesting the number of cold and snow records in the Northern Hemisphere that have been approached or exceeded in recent weeks. It puts into sharp focus much of the climate hysteria whipped up by the usual suspects. The near total failure of wind power dependent grids is also telling. Good discussion on the latter on bloomberg today about the matter with many energy experts saying that nuclear and NG will have to be invested in much more than wind to deal with these issues

Cold spells are just weather though Birdnuts. Weather only becomes climate when there is an agenda to push. Thagor speaks with moral authority about 'misinformation', but yet we see this every day when it comes to how the concept of climate change is presented to us and nothing is said.

For example, just today:

"When Climate Change and Xenophobia Collide"
https://www.newyorker.com/news/dispatch/when-climate-change-and-xenophobia-collide

Thagor?

Thargor · 17-02-2021 12:41am

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

You haven't disproving anything I have said or posted, but yeah, you and your sort calling the shots on what is 'disinformation' or not really cuts it.

Conveniently ignoring the posts disproving your misinformation about the failures in the Texas power grid there but yeah

As for your accusations of bloodthirsty racism, as I said Im not a psychiatrist.

Oneiric 3 · 17-02-2021 12:46am

Thargor wrote: »

Conveniently ignoring the posts disproving your misinformation about the failures in the Texas power grid there but yeah

I never mentioned the 'Texas power grid'. Old Tuck might have, but that wasn't my point, was it, dear Thagor?

Thargor · 17-02-2021 12:55am

Oneiric 3 wrote: »

I never mentioned the 'Texas power grid'. Old Tuck might have, but that wasn't my point, was it, dear Thagor?

"Its not my disinformation your honour, I just spread it!" :pac:

2020 officially saw a record number of $1 billion weather and climate disasters.

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