How long before Irish reunification? (Part 2) Threadbans in OP

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Did you not say way back that you were a member? Ok, fair enough. Change to: 'The party you defend routinely on here - FG....'

LOL, eh no... just no..
Nice Try. :pac:

markodaly wrote: »

LOL, eh no... just no..
Nice Try. :pac:

Fair enough.

I changed it to 'the party you routinely defend'.

markodaly wrote: »

LOL, eh no... just no..
Nice Try. :pac:

Now we've sorted out that, any chance you can answer the questions I posed to you.

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Wow. Those goalposts moved fair quick.

But back to the point at hand...

Firstly your problem was that the MP was abstentionist.

When it was pointed out that you could go to the office, you then tell us the office is named for some IRA members.

So by my reckoning, abstentionism isn't the problem at all. You just can't face talking to your local MP cos it's one of Themmuns.

I mean, perhaps going to the office and discussing your issues like an adult might get you further than putting up barriers. You could even bring up the offensive name while there.

I mean we're always told how nationalists always have to compromise. Perhaps he could meet you under a rock in a field, a sort of rock school constituency clinic, so he knows his place.

It wasn’t me moved the goalposts. Francie said I intransigent for not visiting my MP.
I am afraid the evidence differs with your nonsense.
I was very well represented by Eddie Mcgrady MP and then Margaret Ritchie MP (both themuns) but neither of them named their office after gunmen.

Bonnie rather than ducking everything. Would you think it would be appropriate for a unionist MP to name their office after a local loyalist gunman who had take the lives of friends and family of constituents in living memory ??

markodaly wrote: »

There are loads of examples here and in other threads, too many for me to point out and anyway, you will reject them regardless and I dont have as much time as some of you guys to thread the needle so to speak.

One example though is an attempt to link the DUP and FG as being more or less the same. We have seen SF and their supporters for years demonise FG and Leo and it extends to Unionists as well.

These people merely see the North as a region to conquer and annex.

Who said the DUP and FG are the same?

In fairness to Downcow, I totally get why he wouldn't go to the office of his local SF representative. When Tom Elliot was my local MP, I wouldn't have asked him for anything. (In my case, not because he is a Unionist or because of his political party, but because I personally dislike the man).

Now I will highlight that the office in question in Downcow's constituency has been named as such since long before Chris Hazzard took office, (indeed before he was born), so blaming that on him personally is a bit much, I can still say I'd be deeply uncomfortable going to a local MP's office similarly named after a UDR member who had killed members of my local community.

I would ask how many times you attended the office of Eddie McGrady or Margaret Ritchie though, Downcow?

downcow wrote: »

Would you visit your MP and seek their assistance if the resided in an office called the Michael Stone Jonny Adair office, had a Union flag and an Israeli flag above the door and had lots of stuff in the window eulogising dead loyalist terrorists, and this same MP refused to condemn the killing of innocent Catholics in his constituency while also attending all the memorials to those who killed them?

I think that is a very simple question and I would like a simple answer from you, Bonnie and anyone else who thinks I should seek assistance from my local MP ?

Instead of wrongly attributing stuff to me, why don't you read the answers given... I answered you the first time.

francie wrote:

You should see who the statue outside Stormont is dedicated to and who nationalists have to walk past every single day off the week>

Ever open your eyes when out and about downcow and look at the trappings/celebrations/memorials to the oppressive bigoted state you defend, that are all around you?

Yes, downcow, anytime I visit the north I have to button my lip and get on with it. Because I think both sides should be allowed to remember their dead.

Fionn1952 wrote: »

In fairness to Downcow, I totally get why he wouldn't go to the office of his local SF representative. When Tom Elliot was my local MP, I wouldn't have asked him for anything. (In my case, not because he is a Unionist or because of his political party, but because I personally dislike the man).

Now I will highlight that the office in question in Downcow's constituency has been named as such since long before Chris Hazzard took office, (indeed before he was born), so blaming that on him personally is a bit much, I can still say I'd be deeply uncomfortable going to a local MP's office similarly named after a UDR member who had killed members of my local community.

I would ask how many times you attended the office of Eddie McGrady or Margaret Ritchie though, Downcow?

I know Margaret Ritchie very well through the assistance she provided on a regular basis to me. A lovely woman trying to do her best for her constituents.

She did quite annoy me once. I had and quite a few other unionists voted for her (not an easy thing for a unionist to do) and she got in by a tight margin. She made a silly statement the next week to say that she didn’t need unionist votes to get in. So the unionists left her to it next time and she lost her seat.
Hazard is such disgusting bigot that I have little doubt enough unionists will support SDLP next time to get him out.

As for the naming of the building. I am quite sure sf didn’t move into the building until long after he was born so your facts are wrong there.
The building was lived in by one of the very last Protestant families to be driven out of the town. The house was surrounded and attacked following a Wolfe tones concert in the gaa club just a few metres away. They left the next day. It was the last straw.
I’ll check dates but unless Hazard has aged very badly lol it was since his birth

downcow wrote: »

I know Margaret Ritchie very well through the assistance she provided on a regular basis to me. A lovely woman trying to do her best for her constituents.

She did quite annoy me once. I had and quite a few other unionists voted for her (not an easy thing for a unionist to do) and she got in by a tight margin. She made a silly statement the next week to say that she didn’t need unionist votes to get in. So the unionists left her to it next time and she lost her seat.
Hazard is such disgusting bigot that I have little doubt enough unionists will support SDLP next time to get him out.

As for the naming of the building. I am quite sure sf didn’t move into the building until long after he was born so your facts are wrong there.
The building was lived in by one of the very last Protestant families to be driven out of the town. The house was surrounded and attacked following a Wolfe tones concert in the gaa club just a few metres away. They left the next day. It was the last straw.
I’ll check dates but unless Hazard has aged very badly lol it was since his birth

Doing sums in my head I reckon a Protestant family still lived in that building in the mid to late 1990s. It had been their home for generations. They are now my nearest neighbour. I am basing that on my current neighbour on the other side of me who was burnt out for the third and last time in the late 1990s (Drumcree) and I think that was a couple of years after my other neighbour

FrancieBrady wrote: »

FFS...YES downcow, I would go into a constituency office no matter what the trappings outside where or what the building it is in is called.

Thanks Francie. First clear answer I ever got of you. Keep it up. It’s refreshing
Although I think that’s a little naive and inconsiderate to minorities. I certainly would go into one that had racist our homophobic trappings above the door. But every mans different

downcow wrote: »

Thanks Francie. First clear answer I ever got of you. Keep it up. It’s refreshing
Although I think that’s a little naive and inconsiderate to minorities. I certainly would go into one that had racist our homophobic trappings above the door. But every mans different

Man, but you are pathetic.

I answered you the first time but yet you have to try and get some wee patronising victory.

As I said...open your eyes and look at what those oppressed by the sectarian bigoted state have to walk past every day of the week.

Fionn1952 wrote: »

Chris Hazzard was only born in '84, Downcow. I'm not local enough to say with total confidence that it was before his birth (I believe he did give a statement to that effect when questioned on it though), happy to withdraw that small part if I'm mistaken though.

I do know it has been named as such for as long as I can remember, definitely pre GFA, so he would've been a small child at best, so my point about personally blaming him for it still stands.

The recent furore was around the new sign on the building; it is entirely possible that many weren't aware of the building's name until that time.

I appreciate what you are saying. I think the confusion may be that there was another building a short distance away which Sinn Fein named after the two killers and used as their office. They then moved premises and named their new premises after the same two killers of local people.
May be in and around 1998 as you say.

Absolutely no excuse and I am surprised you are suggesting such. Rediculous, if it had been named after those who carried out the loughinisland mascre do you think they would have kept the name?

He could have used different premises or he could have renamed it.

It is disgraceful nasty sectarianism and the local community is not surprised simply because it is sf.

Fionn1952 wrote: »

Jude Collins put the naming of the building at 25 years ago in 2018 (in an entirely reasonable piece that I think goes to the heart of some of our issues around remembrance in NI).

http://www.judecollins.com/2018/02/past-one-view/

Chris Hazzard stated on a Talkback interview that it was before he was born, though he doesn't provide specific dates, so he could be wrong, but the key point is it certainly isn't a recent affair;

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/sinn-fein-mp-hazzard-says-office-named-after-ira-killers-absolutely-fitting-36632106.html

I complete disagree with both pieces.
Jude Collins is equating a constituent receiving a letter from the MP with the names of the people who killed their friends on it, with a statue in Lisburn to the udr - need I say more.

Second piece is just lies. I am assuring you it was not named before his birth and paul magorian was not shot beside his office. Shinners have zero respect for the truth. And magorian was on ‘active service’ about to murder when the army shot him.

markodaly wrote: »

There are loads of examples here and in other threads, too many for me to point out and anyway, you will reject them regardless and I dont have as much time as some of you guys to thread the needle so to speak.

Hold on, you brought it up so the onus is on you show where Unionists are denigrated to the extent you are making out.

So fill your boots buddy...

One example though is an attempt to link the DUP and FG as being more or less the same. We have seen SF and their supporters for years demonise FG and Leo and it extends to Unionists as well.

That's not at all the same nor relevant to hat you brought up in your Tommie Gorman post.

These people merely see the North as a region to conquer and annex.

"These people" "Many" None to vague there Marky.

Where is it being stated by anyone that the north is to be conquered and annexed?

downcow wrote: »

It wasn’t me moved the goalposts. Francie said I intransigent for not visiting my MP.

No he didn't. I would suggest, yet again, that you start to read posts and heed what's there.

I am afraid the evidence differs with your nonsense.

What do you mean "differs"?

I was very well represented by Eddie Mcgrady MP and then Margaret Ritchie MP (both themuns) but neither of them named their office after gunmen.

Oh really? Well best you tell Mr Hazzard about your problems with abstentionism and the naming of an office.

An office I might add, that has been named that way for over a quarter of a century!

Only a problem now is it that SF have an MP?

Bonnie rather than ducking everything.

You've a wile queer way of "debating". You make a statement, get hung on it. Refuse to acknowledge the issue at hand. Accuse others of avoiding answers to questions that were never asked. Make out we're being unreasonable. Then you ask a question that conveniently moves the "debate" on meaning you get to avoid answering any questions.

Rinse and repeat.

Would you think it would be appropriate for a unionist MP to name their office after a local loyalist gunman who had take the lives of friends and family of constituents in living memory ??

I dunno. It would be odd for a Unionist MP to stand for election in Dublin 8. But I can assure you, we would inform said MP of the offensive nature of naming their building after, I dunno, Cromwell or Craig or Trevelyan or whoever.

---

But back to what I was saying earlier, your issue isn't the MP, nor the abstentionist policy but the name of a building.

So, rather then go there you could post a letter? I wouldn't be off-the-mark in thinking that you're building barriers just to make a point. And failing at that.